I guess Michael really did know what he was doing all those years ago.
I doubt it - you seem determined to take offence - you were saying something about egocentric?
you cant tell people they are being idiots, they dont believe you, they think you are attacking their heritage and culture which entrenches them even further. Sadly we have to wait a generation or two for their "traditions" and what they stand for to die out of their own accord as later generations realise what complete knobs their ancestors were................
*the same can be applied to the other side of this debate as well
** you still get idiots and bigots in later generations as well regardless
I wasn't "whinging about the lack of atmosphere on a holiday", that comment was directed at the overall parades to which I have to part of. However, what I was "whinging" about was the fact that these cunts (and they really are cunts, let's drop that social niceties) paraded in front of a Catholic Church in an area that they weren't marching in. They didn't need to do it, apart from just provoking the other side. They succeeded in that objective in Ardoyne last night.
I can't leave my home for hours on end lest they see I'm not part of their group. Do you understand what I mean by the use of the word "hegemony" at all? It is a hegemony when a minority (they are a minority in all respects) proceeds to take over parts of the city (along with other areas of Ni) in order to have their triumphalist marching. However, when they know what areas they are allowed to they still insist on marching in areas in order to antagonise the local population. They know which areas are a flash point but they insist on it. And that display outside St. Patrick's was the icing on the cake.
I know quite a few protestant people and we get on just fine.
(I am of the Catholic heritage, even if an atheist)
Where the disconnect lies for me is the fact that leaders of the OO try to portray the 12th as "Orangefest", some kind of family-friendly event. Well I went to a pre-12th local OO march in my area, and although it seems that for most of the participants it was a fun get-together, many of the people who came out for it were the real problem: total scumbags who were openly drinking and generally acting the bollix. One idiot 15 year old was even running around with a UVF flag stuck in his knapsack. The police saw them and just laughed.
If senior members of the OO really and truly believe that the 12th should be some kind of cross-community festival that even foreigners like myself are welcome to take part in, then they need to do something about 1) the scummy element who frequent these events and seem to get their rocks off by trying to be hard men, 2) the open and brazen display of paramilitary flags and paraphernalia, 3) anti-Catholic songs and banners, and 4) brazen acts of provocation. The older men in the video who attacked the person recording this tomfoolery in front of St. Patrick's would have been better served by turning their ire on the idiots who - once again - made their community look like unreconstructed bigots. The fact that they did nothing and attempted to 'shoot the messenger' so to speak, says volumes, really.
Reaction here to the vid here https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151896598970427&set=vb.111907769567&type=2&theater
Some hateful comments from Loyalist side, every excuse pulled out of the book. Thankfully they are a minority within the Unionist community who largely do not agree with their bigoted ways.
And burning a Polish flag(nevermind the usual Irish one) on a bonfire! (fast forward to about 2min to see it clearly)
What did the Polish do to deserve this?!
These marches are all about 'marking territory' rather like canines do it.
But the dogs do it with a lot more grace.
You don't understand how sectarianism or racism could bother somebody?
There's plenty of provocateurs on both sides of the divide. However, as far as I'm concerned if people want the 12th of July to be a bank holiday commemorating the Battle of the Boyne, what odds? However, obviously the route of the marches should be chosen carefully, with respect, and with consultation with the PSNI.
I find the notion that this is only a Loyalist issue to be silly though. There's plenty of intolerance on both sides of the divide. I'm not convinced that the 12th of July in and of itself is the cause of the intolerance, but rather that it brings out the intolerance of a few.
Because spides need encouragement to mix it up? Ardoyne didn't kick off because of this church antic - it's the same old story year after year. Six of one, and a half dozen of the other.
The parades used to take place without Catholics feeling they had to stay in all day - it's quite possible for the parades to continue without you fretting about 'hegemony', 'triumphalism' etc - and that's what the future holds - it's not your bag, but it is others'. Like I say - if you choose not to be antagonised, it fades away.
The bbc's coverage of the incident.
These droolers define themselves by their hatred for 'the other'; Polish, Black, foreign.. any old other will do.