It's never black and white, but it generally becomes stark when the grey areas are neglected.
A good read here which may crystallise what most of us on here believe: http://whiffofcordite.blogspot.com/2012/03/some-good-mostly-bad-time-for-new-broom.html
Exactly that Declan Kidney should just go; or if he stays start blooding props, centres and second rows pronto.
If its rubbish, why can't Wales translate their international success to club success? It's not logical to believe that HC rugby success has to transfer to the international stage, blaming DK for that is just silly
CIARAN_BOYLE Registered User
Munster have as many NIQ props as the four Welsh regions have NWQ props (three). Not saying that prop depth would turn things around completly but just bringing it to your attention
Its hard to succeed in the HEC without 4 quality props. Few of the Welsh teams have that due to the absence of NWQ props.
Latest Against the Head is up http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/sixnations/highlights.html?3232661,3232661,flash,null
The same reason we can't convert it to the 6N... Bad coaching/management/union setup.
Ok so we have players playing for the Irish team; 8 of which play for Leinster who are HCup champs and Munster and Ulster are in the QFs. Munster are Rabo champs; Leimster win the HCup in 09 as well; Munster won it 08 and 06. So the national team has a group of players that can win and are used to winning.
When they are brought together they should win right; they dont; we have a coach who has coached this team to steadily worse results since he took over at the end of 08. He had a high in 09 and then nothing since except decrepit results with the odd decent game or performance thrown in.
I cant see how Kidney shouldn't take some blame for the teams performances.
Please tell me the difference between the team he inherited in 08 to the team he has now??
molloyjh Registered User
What was the overall opinion from the lads on the Breakdown? Missed it myself and would love to know their take on the whole thing...
I'd rather not have to choose personally. But if I absolutely had to I'd pick Leinster for one very simple reason. If I'm going to watch one of my teams suffer I'd rather see less of it. And there are a lot less Ireland games than Leinster ones.
Obviously though I want both to succeed.
I think looking at this the other way around, i.e. national level down to club level, is all a bit disingenuous. All you need is a pool of 25-30 quality players to make up a good national squad. If a handful of those are abroad and the others are spread across the 5 regions that's an average of 4-5 quality players per region. If that's all Wales had (for arguments sake) then the regions couldn't succeed.
However if the regions had 10-12 quality NIQs each then those 50-60 players would be battling it out at national level.
In other words just because a national side has enough quality players to create a quality team, doesn't mean their clubs/provinces/regions do. If the clubs had enough then the national side would be laughing. It's apples and oranges really.
Add to that the problems Wales have at regional level and the financial issues that come from that and they just can't afford the same quality coaching staff that our provinces can.
Does that then mean that the Welsh unions desire is for Welsh only props etc, regardless of the effect it has on the regions. Putting the international teams need first, and the regions nowhere, as opposed to second?
Ardillaun Registered User
If it was so grossly illegal, why did the ref allow it time after time and why hasn't Kidney complained about it publicly? Refs are given a fair bit of discretion on these matters, and their intrepretation is effectively the law for the match. What was stopping Ireland scrummaging in the same way?
Kind of pointless at this stage and will smack of sour grapes. Nigel Owens is notoriously poor at scrum time, so it's no surprise he missed stuff. He's not alone, teams regularly put in crooked and get away with it, start pushing before the ball is in (as England did on Saturday time after time) and get away with it, so more subtle cheating like Hartley loosening his bind to push our front row up whilst still allowing his two props to scrummage would be well outside the ref's radar.
JRant Registered User
They pretty much just went through the game as it happened. Didn't go into to much detail on the overall performance of the team during the 6N's. They're doing a full breakdown next week so it should be very interesting to hear what they have to say.