The independent poll was not an objective poll.
Please provide the questions that provided these percentages.
The questions were leading and do not compare like with like
In any case the results are poor for FF . The constant drone of whinge is obviously not working
First of all, social polices are not really on the top of peoples prorities. We are in the middle of an economic crisis and will be for the next few years at least. A crisis caused more or less by FF. Backing Gay marriage and expecting a big bump in the polls kinda shows us that they still don't get it. FF are like the Torries in 1997, they still think the problem is with the voters not them. They have to change utterly to be acceptable and even with that many many people will never vote for them again regardless of what they do. Thats life!
I still have no idea what they stand for (apart from Gay marriage!). Arm chair populist republicanism is dead and wont garner much votes any more.
There is one question that is itching on my mind for a while now; When FF officially does go under the hatchet (whenever that will be), what will happen primarily to the TD's and Senators when it is wound up?
Is it going to be in the same position as the PD's left and became independents or will they all resign their seats straight away?
I mean the notion of former FF TD's going into different party affiliations in the present day does not sound right IMO.
The country has seen them go down once a year ago. The public would realise nowadays that their policies are just being described as lazy and self defeating.
Social policy is a very important thing in a recession, you just don't get any thanks for it and might get the policy enacted 10 years later, Garret and divorce for example or never, Garret and Abortion for example!
I had another look at the weekend polls
The Independent gave a very FF biased view. And hallelujajordan just reiterated this biased view.
Here are some real stats from the weekend
83% of people would not vote FF first preference.
In fact 40% of people do not want FF to recover and become a realistic alternative party of government. 28% are strongly of this view.
39% blame FF for the state of the economy
23% would like to see Sinn Fein in government unfortunately.
Indeed, only 40% of people DO NOT want to see Fianna Fail recover. .
Exactly , so where is the good news ? That 36% that you refer to don't necessarily want them in govt. Only 17% would give them preference. The 36% just don't want them to die off completely yet
Looks pretty hopeless for FF
Who's telling porkies ?
Oh - hj.....no "maybe" about it, so no need for that word if you want to try being genuinely open and truthful.
And I would count myself in those 36% who want to see FF playing a strong role in opposition but who do not want to see them in government (at least not for a while) . . However, I am able to recognise that we need a strong opposition and this will not come from either SF or the Independents .
Not sure what you mean? 3% of people are willing to blame themselves. 39% blame FF ?..
Ah - I read it that the "they" meant FF
3% of 4.5 million is what ? 135,000 people ?
And the main golden circle is about 90 people that owe the vast majority of the private debt that FF lumped us with, IIRC ?
135,000 people is a hell of a lot more than the core actual cause, but at least it's a starting debating point as to how many.....that said, FF had more votes than that so I'd agree that it's on the low side.
Do you think the thousands of FF members and activists would just disappear off the face of the planet if hypothetically one day Martin woke up in a crazed manner and wound down the party? These are people who are committed to public life no matter the case.
Nope, I can assure you that will not be the case.
I'm flabbergasted. . you really believe that the 'core actual cause' is down to 90 people ? ? ? 90 people created the Celtic Tiger, overheated the economy and inflated a most enormous property bubble. .
I can accept your assertion that not everyone was responsible for the creation of a bubble that eventually exploded all over us, but 90 people . . . really ? ? ?
What about the many many people who overspent, overborrowed, invested in property, bought cars/holidays/holiday homes/property extensions that they couldn't afford . . that continued to reward a government that put money in their pockets, that successfully encouraged the opposition parties at the time to adopt more or less the same economic policies. . ?? What about the people that were willing to accept the loans they knew they couldn't afford.. the ones that you were prudent enough to turn down ??
Here we go again with more FF history rewriting.
The main cause of the biggest financial disaster in Irelands history was Fianna Fail, Michael Martin admitted it and said sorry. Was I hearing things when all the FFers stood up and clapped and cheered and waved their FF flags and balloons in the air , united in glee???
It was your personal hero Bertie who also played a huge part.
Am I missing something ?
Michael Martin admitted that Fianna Fail made mistakes and apologised on behalf of the party for those mistakes. . He was right on both counts . .
Does that mean that no other mistakes were made ? That no one else is culpable ? That there is no responsibility on those who overspent/overborrowed/overinvested in a hyper-inflated property market ? ? ? No responsibility on those who repeatedly rewarded and encouraged short term economic policies that served to feed the tiger and inflate the bubble ? ?
It seems that Fianna Fail are the only ones willing to acknowledge their culpability . . but that certainly does not mean that they are the only ones culpable. .
It is true that Fianna Fail did have accomplices in causing our bankruptcy.