lxflyer Registered User
#16

Lord Sutch - I think you're getting confused - all of the latest queries have been about Dublin Bus' new order - not London!!

LordSutch Registered User
#17

Dublin bus? Oops!

Some more Borismaster chat would be nice )

dowlingm Registered User
#19

Borismasters for Cork, they're the right colour already!

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LordSutch Registered User
#20

dowlingm said:
Borismasters for Cork, they're the right colour already!


How about a 'two tone' Nottingham City Borismaster?
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8435/7980617401_8291063729_z.jpg

Or a nice cream Sheffield Borismaster?
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8252/8478905501_5c6c6542c7_z.jpg

How about a BorisMaisie Lothian Borismaster?
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8146/7606250414_6d4d60f036_z.jpg

Or maybe even a 'triple axel' Berlin Borismaster?
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8007/7552187008_a99371dba1_z.jpg

Cookie_Monster Registered User
#21

The first two actually look really well.

#22

Yes the first two actually look much better than the actual red thing!!

The last one is brutal.

MGWR Registered User
#23

LordSutch said:
How about a 'two tone' Nottingham City Borismaster?

Or a nice cream Sheffield Borismaster?

How about a BorisMaisie Lothian Borismaster?

Or maybe even a 'triple axle' Berlin Borismeister?
All of the above (even the less pleasant ones) make the idea of seeing one in present-day DB logos painful.

Seems like this project was a true vanity exercise anyhow.

LordSutch Registered User
#24

600 in the pipeline over the next three years for London.

Route 24 to be the 1st London route to convert 100% to Borismasters (June 2013).

http://thebuspeople.co.uk/?p=2197

bk Moderator
#25

Going Forward said:

The last one is brutal.


It may look brutal, but it is one of the best designed (operationally) buses in the world.

They have massive capacity, 128 passengers. Triple doors and two stairs with the doors placed directly in front of the doors to maximise boarding flow.

You board at the front door, go directly up the front stairs and when leaving you use the stairs at the back of the bus and go directly out the back door.

Leads to very fast boarding times on one of the highest capacity buses in the world. Yes maybe ugly, but all very German, well designed and efficient!!

We would be so lucky to have such buses and such a setup here in Ireland.

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AlekSmart Registered User
#26

bk said:
It may look brutal, but it is one of the best designed (operationally) buses in the world.

They have massive capacity, 128 passengers. Triple doors and two stairs with the doors placed directly in front of the doors to maximise boarding flow.

You board at the front door, go directly up the front stairs and when leaving you use the stairs at the back of the bus and go directly out the back door.

Leads to very fast boarding times on one of the highest capacity buses in the world. Yes maybe ugly, but all very German, well designed and efficient!!

We would be so lucky to have such buses and such a setup here in Ireland.


I have become a very strong fan of the Wright Bus for London since I first encountered it.

The asthetics are,as with every man-made design,open to debate,but the reality is that TfL,Wrights and The Heatherwick Studio have really pushed at the boundaries of Bus Design here.

The very principle of a old style,long established Bodybuilder such as Wrights,being able to take on board an outside non-bus designer such as Heatherwick is of itself a major advance in Bus design.

The Wrights product has been returning some highly impressive in-service availability and performance figures which show every prospect of improving as the lighter production vehicles enter service.

I believe that this vehicle will be far more significant in the Public Transport world than even it's designers thought possible.

As it stands,TfL (The owners of the design rights) have had many enquiries and requests for inspection visits from a wide cross-section of the Public Transport world.

But to return to bk's points on the efficiency of German PT operations,I feel that we,as a society,are simply not amenable to the type of conduct which the Germanic peoples accept so readily.

I would ardently wish we were,but alas it is not part of what we regard as beneficial.

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bk Moderator
#27

AlekSmart said:

But to return to bk's points on the efficiency of German PT operations,I feel that we,as a society,are simply not amenable to the type of conduct which the Germanic peoples accept so readily.


I see what you are saying, but I respectfully disagree. Once we see the benefit of something we are pretty quick to embrace it.

I think it is more of an issue of DB's fears about possible fare evasion and the court issue about insurance for operating dual/triple door buses.

Really don't see any reason why these couldn't work in Ireland. To be honest their design actually psychologically leads you to using them in an efficient manner.

The front stairs faces forward directly from the front entry door and the rear stairs dumps you directly out the rear door. With Irish people very use to always using the front door, it very naturally leads to the correct flow. People can easily see if downstairs is full and go directly upstairs. And then they would naturally go downstairs at the back due to people coming in the front.

I think the new Dublin Bus are a bad design, the rare door is far behind the stairs leading people to more naturally use the front door to leave.

AlekSmart Registered User
#28

bk said:
I see what you are saying, but I respectfully disagree. Once we see the benefit of something we are pretty quick to embrace it.

I think the new Dublin Bus are a bad design, the rare door is far behind the stairs leading people to more naturally use the front door to leave.


I think we can agree to disagree with safety....

I would agree with you on the design aspects of the GT class Centre Door,however as with much else the specification tends to be dictated by factors which are extraneous to the issue.

It seems that the specifying agency,the NTA,were more concerned with maximising the Disabled Spaces and lower saloon seating than with flow patterns,which has left us with a particularly arkward situation to solve.

My own belief is that mainstream Public Transport has a finite capacity to be "Disabled Accessible" before that concept starts impinging upon it's ability to cater for the non-disabled masses.

From my own perspective,Dwell Time at Stops is THE single most significant issue effecting BAC core services,however I have yet to hear any NTA or BAC personage even mention it's existence.

The first step to solving any problem,is to admit to it's existence...and there the issue lies...

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joegriffinjnr Registered User
#29

Spotted one of these in town yesterday....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/km_edinburgh/8585825055/

AlekSmart Registered User
#30

joegriffinjnr said:
Spotted one of these in town yesterday....

http://www.flickr.com/photos/km_edinburgh/8585825055/


Joe,I would not at all surprised if WBfL (WrightBus for London) made an appearance in Dublin fairly shortly.

Whilst many of the designs detractors focus upon capacity issues and similar traditional factors,the reality is that the Urban Transport sector now has new and far more diverse issues to consider.

By far and away the largest issue is emissions (of rapidly and constantly changing types) and this is one area where WBfL is performing strongly and exceeding it's design targets by quite a bit.

With all major PT operators and administrative agencies now tied into World Wide schemes to reduce or eliminate these,the designs which can effectively and affordably do this will have to be assessed,whether we like their aesthetics or not.

I would imagine that TfL and the NTA will be more than happy to share their thoughts on this one,and for sure a demonstration visit is possible...without having to leave the island too !!!!

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