I had same leg 4 to 5 and lost time on it. I exited the courtyard fine but headed direct as originally thought there was gap just beyond 5. Was passing playgound when I realised and went back to road.

Whats your opinion on the route of heading back towards 3 and then north through gap to road? From there, simply a long straight run to 5.

I lost too much time, mainly to lack of experience. Poor start, great middle section and then the change of terrain of parkland on south side of river caught a lot of people out including myself.

And the fact that I had equal quickest time of all classes on the run in proves I didn't hammer it enough before hand.

Anyway, this is about you, congrats on achieving your objective in the sprints.

ocnoc Registered User

Mothman said:
I had same leg 4 to 5 and lost time on it. I exited the courtyard fine but headed direct as originally thought there was gap just beyond 5. Was passing playgound when I realised and went back to road.

Whats your opinion on the route of heading back towards 3 and then north through gap to road? From there, simply a long straight run to 5.

My route to 5 was 340m with 4 decelerations
Going back by 3 is ~310 with 2 decelerations

So, I reckon 10seconds quicker...maybe

1:08 was the fastest split, I was +11sec. Looks like only 1 guy got the correct route, but he stuffed it, leaving the control and running into a dead end.

The beauty of sprint is that if you pick and go, even if your route is not perfect, their will be only a couple of seconds in it.

Looking at your routes, if you ran a few more sprints, I reckon you could lay down some wastage! A bit more aggression/confidence on the micro route choices and the seconds start to be shaved away.
Just a bit of split compassasion


3-4, knock off 10sec
4-5, knock off 20sec
17-18, knock off 10sec

Get more clinical in the circle ~1-2sec per leg. Thats suddenly 1:20 quicker and a 4th place finish.
A lot of irish orienteers are actually pretty dam good at sprint - pitty we don't have more quality maps to get some more races in.

1 person has thanked this post
ocnoc Registered User

Being invloved in the sharp end of the sprint, i expected to be inside the top 20 for the middle is well.

This did not materialise. In fact - it all went to sh1t.
I was caught by Roar and then it was a complete hammerfest all the way home with Ger. It was enjoyable due to the burn up at the end.

Day 3 was the long distance.
I was orienteering well, was sitting in 21st, had a ~5min fúck up, then came the crash and oh man did I crash bad. I lasted 30mins before my body fell apart.
It was a long jog home

The last day was the relay.
CNOC had two teams
Long Locks, Ocnoc (Ego 1), Roar
The Swede, The Boss (Ego 2), The Ginger

It was perfectly set up for a big d*ck measuring competition.
Swede V Irish Import and Ego 1 V Ego 2.

When I was warming up, I was so pissed off with yesterday I was just going to hammer physically. I knew yesterday was a disgrace and an insult to all the work I had put in with John so I felt the need to rectify it. Not from a mental or orienteering point of view, but from a hill running point of view.
I could see the concern/fear in Roars eyes as he told me to enjoy the orienteering.

The Swede got in just in front of Long Locks (maybe 30sec) and a hammerfest started between Ego 1 and Ego 2. Ego 2 had the lead going around the two butterflies. Ego 1 and 2 had one eye on the map, one eye on the terrain and the map eye actually on where the other ego was.
The boss made a break for it leaving the second butterfly and blasted it to control 11. I hammered after him. As he punched 11, he turned back up the hill an was running towards me! (Unknown to me, he missed control 10).

The rest of the course was a hammerfest with the SHUOC (Sheifield Uni O Club) second team. This kept the pace high. A gap was put in that let Roar out well in front. But the Ginger didn't approve and caught Roar! Luckly, the ginger made a mistake and a gap was formed. However, the small bauld man of the Southern Mountains, Marcus Magic Pinker of Cork-O, caught Roar.

Roar, somehow, used his blistering down hill pace to get a gap going to the last control and held him off (while overtaking someone else!) to cross the line in 12th. Get in!!


Thanks for your analysis.
Here's my account of the 3 legs you highlighted plus 2 other legs.

About 90 secs in total for a 2nd place....
#4 brought me back to earth as I started out on my route I noticed an uncrossable fence in way. I had to retrace and then lost further time locating the flag. About 12 secs lost.
Again an uncrossable fence got in the way to #5 and I had to retrace. At least 20 secs lost. Perhaps best route was retrace back towards #3 and out to road.
At #18 I over ran my navigation. I was almost on top of control when I decided I was heading towards other hill and so turned back to where I thought my control would be to find what I punched was not the right one. I then saw my control. 15 secs lost

The other 2 I had issues with was your 13 and one near end just past the skateboard park.
15 secs lost at #9 with missing the route into control after going through dense vegetation. Perhaps would have been best to have accessed control from the direction that I left it towards #10
For #19 there was a skate park in the way. I didn’t know that the green found on sprint maps is private land. I had it in my head that it was for vegetation that is not to be crossed, such as gardens. I thought the skate park was the paved area on map and knowing that I needed to be north of this area, proceded to go north around it and then hit the river. With this the penny dropped. So had to relocate and plot the route to 19. 30 secs lost

There were quite a few top 10 Irish finishers down through the classes. There is certainly talent amongst us.

the small bauld man of the Southern Mountains

He's nearly as old as me and you lot are stilling trailing in his wake. tut tut, does the truth hurt?

I finished weekend with a feeling what might have been, but also came away with confidence and a better know how of tackling technical areas, the like of which I haven't experienced in recent years.

ocnoc Registered User

Mothman said:
you lot are stilling trailing in his wake. tut tut, does the truth hurt?

Your forgetting he also got knocked off his bike and was almost killed.
He is Irelands best technical orienteer and a complete terrain monster.
He does all of his running on trails and in terrain. He doesn't do anything on the roads and has no top end speed.

Does it hurt? It always hurts when you lose!
If it didn't hurt to lose, then I clearly wouldn't be putting in enough effort to win.

ocnoc Registered User

National 10k

So I ran the National 10k instead of Wicklow Lakes....
I'll go get my coat and leave now

Club said they needed me so I said fine.. if ye insist.
Unsure how to describe a road race.

Went off controlled, went though 5km in 16:06, still controlled.
Kept on hammering, everything is fine. The hurt began to come on. Brian Furey went by me, I slipped in behind him.
My legs fell off trying to get out of the Furry Glen at any speed. The last km took a long time to end. I could see the clock tick from 32:59 to 33:00 and I swore silently inside.

Suppose can't be too pissed as I haven't run on roads since... my debut in 2007.

Went to jog home but I remembered I had a slight pain in my foot running down the Kyber that I forgot about. Turns out I split my runner and the sole was cutting into my foot. Got 1,000 miles out of a pair of racers, win!

It was a long 4km walk home.
Legs now sore. Left foot contains a very nasty blister.

In other racing news - Roar is a ********.
Final league table here. One single feckin point. ONE!!!! GAWHHHH

2 people have thanked this post

ocnoc said:
National 10k

So I ran the National 10k instead of Wicklow Lakes....
I'm speechless....

Got 1,000 miles out of a pair of racers, win!

Everything a win or lose

In other racing news - Roar is a ********.
Final league table here. One single feckin point. ONE!!!! GAWHHHH

Mullaghmeen in 2 weeks.....not going?
A place that would suit your speed and make up that point....

I mispunched yesterday, visited 11 twice instead of 5 & 11. I think first time I've ever mispunched! I'm usually careful in checking codes but had made map reading error, so was in a pickle anyway. Glad to get around though considering ankle. It held up well. Took it easy on anything but good paths, particularly on downhills. I think I'm still tired from JK, just the one tired run during week.

ocnoc Registered User

Roads suck. I'm still sore.

Also interesting to note, my average HR was lower in the National 10k then it was at the JK Sprint.

@Mothman: Check your codes You tend to do it a couple of times in Ireland, the you do it abroad or at a really important race and it doesn't happen again

jeffontour Registered User

ocnoc said:
National 10kTurns out I split my runner and the sole was cutting into my foot. Got 1,000 miles out of a pair of racers, win!

Time to buy those Inov-8s!

ocnoc Registered User

Got me a pair of Asics DS Racers.
I made a call of if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Tonelagee should be fun tomorrow... fun being the wrong word.

ocnoc Registered User

Everyone makes mistakes.
Only sometimes, you don't realise its a mistake until after you made it.

On Saturday, I ran Tonelagee and the Lake. Ran, not raced. I decided it would be a nice stretch of the legs and sure wouldn't me and the Long lad run it twice and it'd be a grand ould 2 hour run.
So we rocked up to Wicklow Gap and I was all "no, not racing, just going for a wee jog".
Race kicked off and the pace was slow. I was sitting in the middle of the pack. Watching the leaders slowly pull away... so slowly it gave me enough time to debate shedding my extra outer layers and ripping it off after them.
Accidently, I think I upped my pace just thinking about racing. Looking around for the Long lad he was nowhere to be seen. I stopped and let him catch up - it was meant to be a socialable run anyways. A couple of concerned call outs from people asking was I ok and one horrified looking Ro who thought I had wrecked something!
Thats what I like about IMRA. I reckon if I had done myself an injury, more than one person would have given up their race to help me get back to the road. I'm unsure what words to use. Camaraderie maybe(?), regardless of where you are in the field.
Plod plod plod up the mountain. Pointing out some bits and pieces to people that might aid them to get up the mountain quicker.

Coming up to the summit, I saw someone drop a bag. Didn't think much of it Aat first. Just ignored it. Waited for Roar at the summit, having a wee auld chat to Aidan. Views very fantastic, if a bit windy.

Roar arrives and we drop off the edge. The couple of minuites we lost to people climbing, we suddenly make back up in seconds as we skip down the muddy/rocky/heathery drop. I said it last year, and I'll say it again. Mountain running bliss! On route down, I tried to coach or point out lines to as many people as I could, all the time making sure I didn't snot myself as the Long lad was beginning to stretch his legs. Around the lake, we got a smile out of the handiness of being orienteers when it comes to sloppy stuff. Then up the b*stard of a climb back up Tonelagee. While walking (it was meant to resemble a slow jog) up it, all I could think about was how bloody hard did I push this climb last year (8:00 179 -v- 11:00 156).

At the top, I again clicked the watch and waited for the Long lad. He was hurting when things go vertical. On reaching the top, we just run off the summit. Putting serious time into those that were with us. The horror on the Long lads face was funny. He couldn't believe how technically poor some of the other imra guys were. Needless to say the topic of conversation then went to the difference between the shrap end (neck and neck, trying to learn peoples weakness and how to break them) to the middle packers (running in isolation. Larger gaps in peoples strengths. Traffic jams etc).
All in all, it was a fantastic run. Most enjoyable company through out.
Then for some sadistic reason, I finished and did an about turn. The Long lad bailed after 100m. He was trashed.
Meanwhile I contuined my lonely plod back up. Meet the usual folks coming down. A wee bit of encouragement whispered to people as they went by
Meet Don coming down and was raging I didn't get to the summit in time to cheer him off it.
Landed on the summit in time for Mick Kellet (the legend) to come through.
Debated doing a run down towards Brockagh to check up on a father and son that got into a little bit of trouble but Aidan said they would be fine.
Cruised off the summit with the wind whistling, now a cloud touching the mountains and chatting about how awesome IMRA is.
What more can ya want from a Saturday morning run.

National Road Relays.

I did not enjoy this. At all. Not sure why. I generally enjoy racing.
I was all set to run the last two mile, but a mix up in logistics meant I ran the 3mile leg (it was a long 3miles... hit 5k by the garmin and double checked it with mapmyrun).
Set off behind Jasion Reid and he kept the gap steady. Clicked off the first km in 3:03 and had the plan to contuine motoring. However, my body and brain had a different thought process going. I was fairly isolated during the race and hammering along on a cement road surrounded by buildings and cars isn't my ideal terrain. My km times then began to wobble and a bad 2nd km of 3:20 showed I clearly started too hard and my enthusiasm for a fight dropped off.
A guy I beat in the National 10k caught me and we ran should to shoulder for the next 2 and a bit km, he clearly wanted to get me back for dropping him on the hills in Phoenix Park. His breathing thoughout was far heavying and erratic than mine. As we rounded the last corner, I shifted through the gears and got away easily. Got to the line first but there was no final leg runner for the club so I stepped off the track. The final leg running arrived after the race was finished. He was more gutted than any of us. Watch out for a sub 70 half come Nationals.

So that was the weekend. A run in the mountains that should have being a murderfest and a race on the roads that should have being a long run in the mountains. Sh!t happens.

I guess I remembered why I race in the mountains again. Its actually a race. Its not just a time trial around a housing estate. Then again. Some of my races in the mountains turn into a time trial - the more recent being the Wicklow Way last year. Maybe in the mountains, there is more to focus on that just turning over my legs at the same cadence, putting one leg in front of the other. In the mountains you have to use all the information that is available to you to make sure you get around the course as quickly as possible. Is that slight dip in the heather to your left a small bog hole? A hollow? or is it a sheep track? That line of peat hags up ahead, can you find the shortest line through the maze or are you straight lining it?

Now stick a map into the equation. All the data you needed to pick the fastest lines, while flat out, you v you, catching your 3min man, dropping him, distractions left and right.
Road racing, a mental mindset to help prepare for WOC Sprint. A necessary evil.
Mountain racing, a mental mindset to help prepare for WOC Long. One of the sick pleasures in life.

Bring on the O.
Selection races 5 weeks 5 days and counting.

ocnoc Registered User

ocnoc said:
teams that rock up into town, tie up the horse, spit on the dog, and leave without a word

This got quoted to me the other day.
Got me fairly motivated.

ocnoc Registered User

Mullaghmeen Map.
Ran hard. Got beaten. Annoyed.
Map lacked consistancy with the brambles. Straight to 15 (through the brambles) was clean, going around was hidious!

The AAI National 10k results are out, and they are wrong.
Long live the AAI. Death to IMRA and the IOA


ocnoc said:
Mullaghmeen Map.
Ran hard. Got beaten. Annoyed.

Same here, well not the annoyed bit, thought I'd been quicker, but I was lacking on the hills, perhaps a little tired from training. Note my errors, I had an almost clean run. Missed 6 by 5m, (ran right by it!) peripheral vision out of glasses is bad and the 2nd depression at 8 stumped me because it was hidden by the route line
Map lacked consistancy with the brambles. Straight to 15 (through the brambles) was clean, going around was hidious!
Pretty bad there alright. I was going round as I usually avoid brambles like the plague but saw an opening and went. Hit brambles where the map said clear....

1 person has thanked this post
ocnoc Registered User

Its difficult to sum up the past month in terms of racing.
There have being highs and low and moral crushing exams.

Since Mullaghmeen my life revolved around my thesis.
That got put to bed and it was off to Inch Strand to race at the Irish Orienteering Champs Relay. The boys gave me a +5min lead and I threw it away with sloppy orienteering and unused legs. Sh!t happens.

Then it was into the auld exams.
Mid way through exams I went south and ran the Leinster 10k

From my training log

Leinster Senior Road Championships.

Ken really wanted a team, so I said I'd give them a lash.

Went off slightly harder than intended. Ken and some DSD guy went off for the fight for gold, I was in the pack for 3rd.
Some LV dude was out in front, a pack formed on my shoulder and we hunted him down. Caught him at 3k and the pace settled. John Canning (Newbridge AC) went off the front and caught Catch Grennin (Tullamore) and it was game on as my bunch tried to reel them in. Going through 5km, it was strung out in a straight line.
I jumped out of the line and pushed the pace as we dropped down the hill.
Catch came back to us and I knew that someone in this group could take 3rd. John was still a bit in front but catchable. At around 7.5k, Catch went for it again and the group splintered. The group I was in was now every man for himself. Everyone knew they could medal but we were running out of time. As the distance ticked down, I knew we couldn't catch John and Catch was looking difficult.
It ended up being a 3 horse race for 5th. I got dropped going up the hill at 9km, but managed to get back Darren Spring of LV as we neared the end. Couldn't catch the other guy. Maybe 5m in it at the end.

Ken won (31:59), Canning 3rd (33:36), mise 6th.
Turned out Phil dropped out injured. Bit ****, but there things happen.

Happy with how the day went. More positives than negatives, ever if the time is a bit ****.

3:03, 19, 18, 48, 15, 21, 19, 34, 38, 24

Exams ended and a 1.5 Mile TT was the order of the day
Bashed out 7:33. Nothing to write home about.

Then it was off to Scotland for the Irish World Champs Selection races.

Friday evening was an awesome run around Craigendarroch. A small beautiful forest on the edge of the Cairngorms.

Saturday was the Long Distance of Death. 19.5km with 960m of the vertical stuff. Just didn't have the legs for it following my 8 weeks of nothingness during my exams. Map.

Sunday dawned bright and windy. Awesome conditions for a shake out while racing the Scottish Relay Championships. I was running on a mix match Irish team that was entered for the craic! I had a solid run, but kept it easy on the climbs given I still had two races to go in the selection races.

Map, beautiful forest. Can't fault the planning either. Good gaffles and great head to head racing.

With that done and done, it was show time for the Irish WOC Sprint Selection race. This was the race I wanted to win and I wanted to win well. I wasn't planning on any sort of second place.


2 people have thanked this post

Want to share your thoughts?

Login here to discuss!