[Doc Farrell]

Hello, I just want to see if I can reach a consensus opinion on this.
A friend of mine lives on a farm. She found four kittens in the barn of her sisters farm next door. She says that the parent cats are wild. She is feeding them each day. The parents are never fed. She says that when they are grown she will stop feeding them and just let them go wild.
I said that this is cruel and that she should give them to a rehoming centre if that is really her plans. I suggested that they should be neutered if she intends to keep them but she says that she won't because she can't afford it. I think that her views are appalling but she thinks that I'm soft and that her way of doing things is how cats are reared on farms. So, what do you think?
I can't understand why she is sentimental towards them now but is basically condemning them to a miserable life.
I'm not trying to upset anyone so please keep your replies short and direct. I'm seriously thinking of getting the kittens taken away by the ispca but I dont want them put down. Should I take them away myself and get them rehomed in Dublin? She lives in west cork.

[blindside88]

While I don't agree with it, it is the done thing on farms, if the cats aren't being fed they will hunt mice, rats and rabbits and keep the numbers down. However I know of one farmer that feeds wild cats and now has about 20 around the farm and they are a nuisance. I agree that having one of 2 around an feeding th sparingly is fine but when they start to breed and inbreed it becomes more of a hassle than anything. If I were you I wouldn't call the ispca as this will surely ruin your friendship, the cats won't starve don't worry

[JDxtra]

They're wild - who would want them? What would the ISPCA do with them except put them down. They probably wouldn't even entertain you. I agree with your friend, but I probably wouldn't be feeding them unless the mother had abandoned them.

[Doc Farrell]

I think that the parents are wild though they stay around the farm but how can kittens be wild if they are being hand fed? Surely she will end up with 15 cats in no time? What's the best course of action for her to take? She told me that once they are grown she won't feed them or neuter them. I think the caring thing to do is to try to rehome them. 4kittens and two cats between two farms, it sounds cruel to me.
Thanks for your views. Any others?

[Rommie]

While they are wild now, it is possible to tame feral kittens. And you're right, it is cruel to keep them in that situation. Especially as four related cats will grow up, inbreed, give birth to kittens, who will then grow up, inbreed etc, etc. The cycle goes on and you have kittens dying young, very unhealthy cats struggling etc. If she's not willing to have them neutered, then they are better off being taken out of there. There are groups who can help with this sort of thing, I'll pm you the name of one if you want?

[christmas2012]

if wild cats are gotten at an early age they can be tamed

[mhge]

Originally Posted by blindside88

While I don't agree with it, it is the done thing on farms, if the cats aren't being fed they will hunt mice, rats and rabbits and keep the numbers down.

This is actually incorrect, cats don't hunt for food, but due to their hunting instinct (see home cats bringing mice home... they don't even eat them). If they are kept hungry and can't catch enough rodents, they may go after chickens etc.

However I know of one farmer that feeds wild cats and now has about 20 around the farm and they are a nuisance.

Cats may be coming in from neighbouring farms if he's the only one giving them food. It would be much better for everyone if each farmer fed their cats moderately so that they have strength for hunting on the farm and don't need to wander in search for food.

[Zapperzy]

Yes very cruel, cats will breed with close family members if allowed and soon those 4 kittens, presuming at least 2 are female in 6-7 months time will have a litter each, the mother cat is probably already pregnant again and could have 2 or 3 more litters before the end of the year. Soon 2 cats and 4 kittens will turn into 20 within a year, probably 40+ in 2 years, The Sweeper done up a very good post with the math on how many kittens can be produced starting with only 1 breeding pair a while ago. Not much else you can do except constantly nag, tell them the figures on how many cats they will have in a few months time and point them in the direction of a charity that does reduced cost neutering (a lot of local shelters give out neutering vouchers for cats).

It's such a shame the way cats are treated in this country in that manner, how can anyone call these cats their pets when they don't feed them, don't neuter them and give them no veterinary care. I too know someone who does the exact same, it's like banging your head against a brick wall.

A good home environment and these kittens could be tamed within a week or two no problem presuming they are only a few weeks old. Even older previously feral cats can be tamed enough to pet them with enough food and patience.

[Doc Farrell]

Originally Posted by Rommie

While they are wild now, it is possible to tame feral kittens. And you're right, it is cruel to keep them in that situation. Especially as four related cats will grow up, inbreed, give birth to kittens, who will then grow up, inbreed etc, etc. The cycle goes on and you have kittens dying young, very unhealthy cats struggling etc. If she's not willing to have them neutered, then they are better off being taken out of there. There are groups who can help with this sort of thing, I'll pm you the name of one if you want?

Pm sent.
She's college educated. I'm fairly sickened about the whole situation to be honest. How can one be sentimental about kittens but indifferent to the welfare of them as adults. I literally do not comprehend that mentality. That's why I posted here, in case I'm missing something obvious about cats on farms.

Edit: she's currently my girlfriend which is why I'm so involved and annoyed

[adrenalinjunkie]

We used to have an old photo here somewhere of a neighbours house that literally was just a carpet of cats on the roof of the cottage and in the yard. I've turned the house upside down looking for it before, but I've no idea where it has gone. I assume this lady started off the same way as your OH. My nan picked several kittens up off the road in her time, always females and always those in reasonable health and in pairs. Neutering was somewhat unheard of in those times so she kept them strictly confined to her house, that was as much as she was able to do. From her point of view everytime she did it, that was two less breeding females and two more cats with a much better quality of life. Perhaps you can convince your OH to at least let you take the females to be re-homed elsewhere?

[Graces7]

Originally Posted by Zapperzy

Yes very cruel, cats will breed with close family members if allowed and soon those 4 kittens, presuming at least 2 are female in 6-7 months time will have a litter each, the mother cat is probably already pregnant again and could have 2 or 3 more litters before the end of the year. Soon 2 cats and 4 kittens will turn into 20 within a year, probably 40+ in 2 years, The Sweeper done up a very good post with the math on how many kittens can be produced starting with only 1 breeding pair a while ago. Not much else you can do except constantly nag, tell them the figures on how many cats they will have in a few months time and point them in the direction of a charity that does reduced cost neutering (a lot of local shelters give out neutering vouchers for cats).

It's such a shame the way cats are treated in this country in that manner, how can anyone call these cats their pets when they don't feed them, don't neuter them and give them no veterinary care. I too know someone who does the exact same, it's like banging your head against a brick wall.

A good home environment and these kittens could be tamed within a week or two no problem presuming they are only a few weeks old. Even older previously feral cats can be tamed enough to pet them with enough food and patience.

Agree wholeheartedly; thank you.

Used to visit, before the last move, someone who fed ferals. She was so careful and yet complained re how much it cost her. They got warm milk in winter etc. She said she was loathe to pay out for neutering as they might get killed on the road and the money wasted. I spent two days arranging vouchers and humane traps go start the TNR for her; she said she could not be bothered to do it. Just sometimes impossible to help.

[GreenLady]

I use semi-wild cats to control rats and mice around the place, as well as my house cats. All my cats, including the ferals are not only neutered but regularly checked by the vet - this has cost me quite a lot of scarring over the years - and are well fed. Healthy cats hunt for fun and kill far more rodents than starving cats do and a resident healthy cat population keeps out the diseased and inbred animals others have referred to. Much cheaper and safer than poison. And the rats don't develop immunity to death by cat

[planetX]

It's so depressing to hear about attitudes like this. I live near farms like this, and now own some of the inbred kittens. These cats do not live healthy natural lives, they're riddled with disease and parasites. It's taken mine over 6months to recover from malnutrition, heavy tapeworm infestation, cat flu and various other viral diseases that get transmitted when cats mate. Every kitten in the litter had eye deformities, and one would have died without surgery. All that before I even mention the trouble caused by unneutered tomcats. I wish attitudes would change

[GreenLady]

My house cats are ones I've rescued that wouldn't be able to live outside. Found close to dying in roads and ditches and presumably the product of uncontrolled breeding, no feeding, no healthcare. The people who think that feral cats will work for them uncared for wouldn't dream of treating their working dog populations or their cattle and sheep the same way - or at least most of them wouldn't

[planetX]

Originally Posted by GreenLady

The people who think that feral cats will work for them uncared for wouldn't dream of treating their working dog populations or their cattle and sheep the same way - or at least most of them wouldn't

I'm not sure about that. I remember a farming family telling me that neutering their collie would be cruel - they used to drown the puppies. Still some odd ideas around about what is 'natural'.