[Oldtree]

A provisional inventory of ancient and long-established woodland in Ireland
11 July 2012

yum yum

http://www.npws.ie/publications/archive/IWM46.pdf

[about 3 fity]

have to wonder are reports like this worth the money and staff investment

[Oldtree]

I think that a report like this brings about recognition of what we have and will hopefully lead to better protection and highten awareness in the future of these (imo) valuable areas.

we dont have a great record generally speaking in this regard:

http://www.npws.ie/publications/euconservationstatus/

[robp]

We have lost plenty of species of flora and fauna in the past because of their fragmentation. Not all forests are equal. If we know whats there we can much more efficiently target areas which need additional measures or expansion etc.

[Silvics]

Originally Posted by about 3 fity

have to wonder are reports like this worth the money and staff investment

Agree. Does the NPWS have an actual forester on its staff? Have had dealings of late with a so-called local authority "biodoversity" officer-I'd venture that a pre-schooler would be as informed if not better informed than him.
Reports like this can be prepared just as well and probably more objectively by the private sector.
I'd like to see protection of out native forest ecosystems, and an expansion where cost-effective and practical.

[Oldtree]

Originally Posted by Silvics

Does the NPWS have an actual forester on its staff?

The report was prepared by what look to be suitably qualified and experienced personnel:

http://www.botanicalenvironmental.com/about-us/

All BEC staff members are trained ecologists

The report was about ancient woodlands and not a planted forest, I am unsure as to what else a forester could bring to this report or to the NPWS? I would however ask if they have an arborist on staff?

[Silvics]

[QUOTE=Oldtree;80023639]The report was prepared by what look to be suitably qualified and experienced personnel:

http://www.botanicalenvironmental.com/about-us/

All BEC staff members are trained ecologists

The report was about ancient woodlands and not a planted forest, I am unsure as to what else a forester could bring to this report or to the NPWS? I would however ask if they have an arborist on staff?[/QUOTE
Do we preserve for the sake of preserving, or can they be functional too?
It might throw the spotlight on forestry education in Ireland-certainly I learned only about plantation forestry. Native woodlands were taught by a botanist, who actually favoured a holistic approach to forestry, whereas UCD Forestry dept at the time was quite insular and limited in outlook.

[Oldtree]

It is great that your tutor passed on a wider view than UCD forestry, it is also great that you were able to learn from that tutor. Arborists are taught about plantation forestry, woodlands and ecology umong other subjects and I had some fantastic progressive tutors as well.

I was not having a personal go at foresters, their job is to deal with a crop, I was just having an indirect gripe at the clearfell policy almost universely implemented here rather than a sellective felling policy implemented elsewhere, not to mention the non commercial and non sustainable coups planted here there and everywhere in the past.

[Silvics]

How to define "forester"? For me, it's more than just plantation forestry (and there's nothing wrong with plantation forestry), it's all trees growing in whatever community, whether natural or man-made, and must take account of all overlapping disciplines. Tall order perhaps, but an open mind, travel and listening to and questioning others and some decent books are a great help.
Clearfell vs selection.....on the right soils should work, but earlier thinning regimes, possible mixing of species, ground prep techniques all factor in. For example, I'm slowly clear-felling SMB sites-there's no way to selectively fell and expect a standing crop with this sort of ground preparation, and anyhow with the inherent instability there is creeping w/throw.
Another concern I have is the expectation that natural regeneration will occur with selective felling-from what I've seen it's sparse and one problem is the phenomenal growth of grass that occurs once you open up a site and the seedlings have no chance.