[factfindr]

I have heard from some sections that these new staff for the general office will be working in other posts in the prison and will quickly replace the position of rpo, with this new grade being the only entry level to the prison service. Basically it's all about paying people alot less to work in this environment which I feel will result in some staff deciding this position is just not worth it.

[Judymayo]

Originally Posted by factfindr

I have heard from some sections that these new staff for the general office will be working in other posts in the prison and will quickly replace the position of rpo, with this new grade being the only entry level to the prison service. Basically it's all about paying people alot less to work in this environment which I feel will result in some staff deciding this position is just not worth it.

Please explain 'rpo' don't know the lingo

[factfindr]

Originally Posted by Judymayo

Please explain 'rpo' don't know the lingo

recruit prison officer it's the entry level to the prison service involves a 3 year training course divided up between on the job training and diploma studies

[shawmor]

Originally Posted by factfindr

recruit prison officer it's the entry level to the prison service involves a 3 year training course divided up between on the job training and diploma studies

If a you became a PASO III do you think you would have to do the 3yr Sligo IT course?

[factfindr]

Originally Posted by shawmor

If a you became a PASO III do you think you would have to do the 3yr Sligo IT course?

No, that would cost money !

[V480]

Anyone get called for a fitness test yet? I thought it said in the information booklet that the fitness test would be conducted at the same time as the overall training?

[shawmor]

Yes that's what I got from it. It said in the letter for the medical we had to pass it during the probationary period, which is a year in the first booklet.

[fly.on.the.wall]

Regarding the pay, if you do the maths it seems for me anyway, thay they are paying almost the same hourly rate that im on now. Granted, your point on the payscale goes up, but you working an extra 200 approx hours a year.

This is coupled with having to work up to 8pm in cases and some saturdays, and they aint paying a premium for this! Misleading that they say in the circular, that the pay reflects these unsociable hours, but when you do the maths it clearly doesn't.

This with no flexi, or ability to work up time off makes for a tough decision. Hmmm Anyone else have any thoughts?

[shawmor]

Originally Posted by fly.on.the.wall

Regarding the pay, if you do the maths it seems for me anyway, thay they are paying almost the same hourly rate that im on now. Granted, your point on the payscale goes up, but you working an extra 200 approx hours a year.

This is coupled with having to work up to 8pm in cases and some saturdays, and they aint paying a premium for this! Misleading that they say in the circular, that the pay reflects these unsociable hours, but when you do the maths it clearly doesn't.

This with no flexi, or ability to work up time off makes for a tough decision. Hmmm Anyone else have any thoughts?

I worked out the pay increase for myself and it worked out at roughly €69 extra a week. Don't have exact figures with me they are at home. This is for working later hours, Saturday's and giving up flexi time. Also bearing in mind that the PASO III hours/ shifts could change at any time to include nights, it's a very tough decision.

[twowheelsonly]

Originally Posted by shawmor

I agree with you. I think after time the shifts will get later, longer and include nights.

Shifts won't get later IMO as the 'Jail Day' finishes at 8 in any case with the night staff taking over at that time. There's no need for clerical staff at night.

Originally Posted by factfindr

I have heard from some sections that these new staff for the general office will be working in other posts in the prison and will quickly replace the position of rpo, with this new grade being the only entry level to the prison service. Basically it's all about paying people alot less to work in this environment which I feel will result in some staff deciding this position is just not worth it.

Can't see that happening. As it is the RPOs' are on miserable money as it is. Also, transfers are based on Seniority so for a PASO to walk into a jail down the country and end up working on the floor shortly afterwards shouldn't be allowed to happen. Cork Prison is the worst - the next lads due for transfer in there are over 13 years waiting - but all 'Country' prisons have a transfer waiting time of a few years.

Right now, all of the Clerks are originally Prison Officers who were promoted to Office grades or ended up there by circumstance. All of these people are being redeployed back to Prison posts and the PASO grade will be taking over the office work.

Any PASO grade that would agree to being redeployed to the floor on their money would want to have their head examined IMO. As things stand you will have dealings with prisoners but mostly on a 1 to 1 basis with very little threat. You do however need to be able to assist any colleagues with any disturbance in your area which is likely to be rare and of a minor nature but can happen. The last thing that you want is to be known as the one that stood back!!
It can be complex and busy work depending on your post and where you'll be stationed. It involves dealing with Courts, Gardai, IPS Headquarters, Welfare, Teachers and a host of other outside agencies. Dealing with warrants can be the greatest PITA of all time. A lot of the work is routine but there's some sort of spanner thrown in almost every day. You also have to bear in mind that almost every piece of paper that you handle can end up being part of a legal challenge at some stage.
Serving Officers that have ended up working in the Clerical areas actually have an advantage over the likes of the new PASO grade as they have hands on experience of dealing with prisoners, Gardai and Courts by the time they end up in the offices so are familiar with different warrants and legal terminology etc.

Good luck to anyone that's going for it. Interesting times ahead!!!!

(Serving Officer BTW, NOT in the office area...)

[Judymayo]

I worked out the pay increase for myself and it worked out at roughly €69 extra a week. Don't have exact figures with me they are at home. This is for working later hours, Saturday's and giving up flexi time. Also bearing in mind that the PASO III hours/ shifts could change at any time to include nights, it's a very tough decision.[/Quote
If they introduce nights it becomes a whole new pay scale with a 25% shift allowance mandatory. Cant see that happening as little or no admin at night and they will hardly give the keys to paso's.

[shawmor]

Originally Posted by Judymayo

I worked out the pay increase for myself and it worked out at roughly €69 extra a week. Don't have exact figures with me they are at home. This is for working later hours, Saturday's and giving up flexi time. Also bearing in mind that the PASO III hours/ shifts could change at any time to include nights, it's a very tough decision.[/Quote
If they introduce nights it becomes a whole new pay scale with a 25% shift allowance mandatory. Cant see that happening as little or no admin at night and they will hardly give the keys to paso's.

Yeah that makes sense so I doubt that will happen.

[V480]

I can't really understand why someone would wish to leave a permanent position within the Civil Service to do this job, giving up flexi, ect. I'd be interested to hear why someone would?

Hopefully we will be told our place on the panel next week.

[Rawhead]

Originally Posted by twowheelsonly

Shifts won't get later IMO as the 'Jail Day' finishes at 8 in any case with the night staff taking over at that time. There's no need for clerical staff at night.



Can't see that happening. As it is the RPOs' are on miserable money as it is. Also, transfers are based on Seniority so for a PASO to walk into a jail down the country and end up working on the floor shortly afterwards shouldn't be allowed to happen. Cork Prison is the worst - the next lads due for transfer in there are over 13 years waiting - but all 'Country' prisons have a transfer waiting time of a few years.

Right now, all of the Clerks are originally Prison Officers who were promoted to Office grades or ended up there by circumstance. All of these people are being redeployed back to Prison posts and the PASO grade will be taking over the office work.

Any PASO grade that would agree to being redeployed to the floor on their money would want to have their head examined IMO. As things stand you will have dealings with prisoners but mostly on a 1 to 1 basis with very little threat. You do however need to be able to assist any colleagues with any disturbance in your area which is likely to be rare and of a minor nature but can happen. The last thing that you want is to be known as the one that stood back!!
It can be complex and busy work depending on your post and where you'll be stationed. It involves dealing with Courts, Gardai, IPS Headquarters, Welfare, Teachers and a host of other outside agencies. Dealing with warrants can be the greatest PITA of all time. A lot of the work is routine but there's some sort of spanner thrown in almost every day. You also have to bear in mind that almost every piece of paper that you handle can end up being part of a legal challenge at some stage.
Serving Officers that have ended up working in the Clerical areas actually have an advantage over the likes of the new PASO grade as they have hands on experience of dealing with prisoners, Gardai and Courts by the time they end up in the offices so are familiar with different warrants and legal terminology etc.

Good luck to anyone that's going for it. Interesting times ahead!!!!

(Serving Officer BTW, NOT in the office area...)

Do you not see this grade as yellow packs? The support part of the title and the uniform hints at control room, keys office, waiting room, SSU etc., etc.,.

I would be hugely surprised if they are limited to admin roles only, all non confrontational posts will be fair game I'd say.

For €67 a week you would want to be mentally ill to leave a nice air conditioned office with flexi-time and all the other perks to work in a kip of a general office dealing with uneducated oafs of Governors trying to bully you because they lack the education or intellect to converse with you like a normal human being.

[twowheelsonly]

Originally Posted by Rawhead

Do you not see this grade as yellow packs? The support part of the title and the uniform hints at control room, keys office, waiting room, SSU etc., etc.,.

I would be hugely surprised if they are limited to admin roles only, all non confrontational posts will be fair game I'd say.

For €67 a week you would want to be mentally ill to leave a nice air conditioned office with flexi-time and all the other perks to work in a kip of a general office dealing with uneducated oafs of Governors trying to bully you because they lack the education or intellect to converse with you like a normal human being.

I can see them doing some roles such as Waiting Room but I'd be kicking up a major fuss if they were in any non-confrontational Security Posts such as the Control Room, Keys Office, Main Gate etc. That's a whole new ball game and you need people that are 'Jail Wide' for those posts. Even the detail needs 'Jail Wide' staff - much as you mightn't think so at times

I agree with you BTW, think they're all mad to give up flexi-time and handy numbers and I doubt that most of them will make a real gain of €60+ a week or anywhere near it.