[Constab2]

One of the best posts I have read very informative from experience ,well said sir.

[Sparks]

Mod Note: Please review rule one of the forum charter before we have to close off the thread.

That said, a small comment:

Originally Posted by thelurcher

this is the important part -
Summer fox control is perfect fodder for the antis - so why post about it on a public forum.

Pretend at least that you're all responsible sporting country people - makes it easier for the NARGC and FACE etc. to defend us on the airwaves.

That quote, right there, does more harm to our community than any honest and open discussion ever does. This "quiet lads, hide it away, don't mention it in public" mindset does not work, is not clever, and has never worked.

You want to avoid giving someone ammunition against you?
Then stop doing things you know aren't right.
Just pretending to stop isn't going to cut it, it'll just get you in twice as much trouble, and from the point where you're caught onwards, nobody believes you when you point out the good you do or deny the bad.

With approaches like that, you don't need ICABS to go after you...

[Alan 1990]

@the lurcher
"
This is why I can't understand pricks that feel the need to start threads on public forums obviously proud of the fact that they shot a milky vixen."

My first fox I shot Was a milky vixen, had I of known this I wouldn't have pulled the trigger but thats near impossible to know when their in long grass and all you can see is the head. I am proud to have shot my first fox but wasnt very happy that she was milky.

By now the cubs would be big enough that they would survive, so I have been told anyway.

[crackcrack30]

I feel that there are a few different topics being discussed here at the same time, I probably can't cover them all so feel free to add.

- Fowl/phesant/ lamb protection (no problem there....)
- Problem fox (no problem there......)
- Greedy hunters thinking no one else other than them should be allowed control fox numbers (Stupid....)
- 12 Month recreational shooting ( regardless of cubs.... not for me)
- The feared Antis (No problem there....but this is a sporting forum)
- Peoples perception or vermin- yes fox are vermin.. Rats/ munjac/ mink are also vermin & i couldnt care less about there young? .

[landkeeper]

good post crackcrack.
that was how it started off different strokes for different folks
if you only shoot/hunt foxes as a pastime and that is what you enjoy then fine get on with it, within whatever season you set yourself. if you have nether sheep or fowl, then foxes really don't pose you any threat , but don't talk down to the lads who rear lambs pheasants and fowl or call them pricks and idiots and expect them to abide by the same seasons
12mnth recreational shooting is not for me either, but 12 mnth shooting foxes in our lambing fields or round the rearing pens where i keep my birds is .a problem fox is a problem fox irrespective of month or the year or lactation status
and yes it is down to perceived perception the lads doing the name calling i'm sure would go shoot crows or pigeon over crops without a second thought or kill a rat not caring if it had young or not

[.243]

Originally Posted by thelurcher

Summer fox control is perfect fodder for the antis - so why post about it on a public forum.

ANY form of fox control is fodder for the antis,better again..... the moment you saddle a horse for hunt,take your rifle from your safe or even pet your terrier before leaving your own house,its anti fodder

[thelurcher]

Lads if someone doesn't think the anti's could use this against us then look at how fox hunting in the UK was hammered by them for years over 'cub hunting' as we used to call it.
Also don't blame me for drawing attention to it on here - you're the ones posting the stories and pics :roll eyes:

Sparks - what are you on about. Is that directed at me or the summer fox hunters........if it was me I was being sarcastic - I'll have to be a bit more generous with the aul smilies in future!

Sensible post Landkeeper and I'd agree with most of what you say. There are however a finite number of foxes. If you have proper fox control in operation over a wide enough area then they do find it difficult to repopulate in a single season. I know what you're saying - 7 miles is a possibility a night so in theory they'd cover the largest of hunt countries in under a week - but it doesn't happen like that. Feck me I doubt there'd be many foot packs left if every fox under pressure gave you 7 miles in a straight line
Most lads on about last season were giving out that foxes weren't running - I suppose the mild winter meant better feeding and less pressure to push animals out.


Alan 1990 if a vixen is milky - then the cubs are not old enough to survive.
Some of the cubs are strong enough for the most part now and getting out and about but are in no way ready to survive on there own.

[Sparks]

Originally Posted by thelurcher

Sparks - what are you on about. Is that directed at me or the summer fox hunters........if it was me I was being sarcastic - I'll have to be a bit more generous with the aul smilies in future!

Directed at everyone, including you.
If you see a practice from fellow hunters that you disagree with and your response is to tell them not to talk about it in public, that's a bad response, for two reasons:

• Firstly, "hunters do something wrong and cover it up" is much more damaging a story for the antis to run with than "hunters do something wrong" because the latter is really "antis think hunters do something wrong" and the former is really "antis catch hunters thinking that hunters do something wrong and then covering it up" and while antis disagreeing with hunters isn't news, antis "catching out" hunters in something underhanded like that is.
  
  On a slow news day, that little lie can fill a tabloid spread.
  
• The second reason is internal - if other hunters really are doing something wrong and you're more worried about who knows about it than the something they're doing wrong, well, your head's in the wrong place alltogether. Argue your point, try to stop it. That's the ethical thing to be doing, not trying to cover up something someone else did which you don't agree with.

[landkeeper]

Originally Posted by thelurcher

Sensible post Landkeeper and I'd agree with most of what you say. There are however a finite number of foxes. If you have proper fox control in operation over a wide enough area then they do find it difficult to repopulate in a single season. I know what you're saying - 7 miles is a possibility a night so in theory they'd cover the largest of hunt countries in under a week - but it doesn't happen like that. Feck me I doubt there'd be many foot packs left if every fox under pressure gave you 7 miles in a straight line
Most lads on about last season were giving out that foxes weren't running - I suppose the mild winter meant better feeding and less pressure to push animals out.

yes there are a finite number of foxes but i can guarantee you, there is no where on this island where proper fox control is done on a wide enough area that you won't have repopulation of any area within a month

[Birdnuts]

Originally Posted by landkeeper

yes there are a finite number of foxes but i can guarantee you, there is no where on this island where proper fox control is done on a wide enough area that you won't have repopulation of any area within a month

Plus you have an enormous, basically uncontrolled urban fox population that will constantly spill out into surrounding rural areas.