[Sleepy]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

Fair enough. I’m a member of the Irish diaspora. You may appoint me to an unpaid position on an Irish state board at your leisure.

While I'm sure you're at least as qualified as some of the past appointees, I'd still like to see some form of rigorous selection used. Perhaps a formal interview with a Dail Committee? In the interests of both transparency and a individual's right tor privacy I'd see some sort of compromise of it being held in private with the transcript only made public on the appointment of the interviewee.

[southsiderosie]

Originally Posted by maninasia

Exactly, many of them are Irish passport holders. No matter what type of slight you want to apply to them they are actually Irish!
Even if they weren't Irish by the limited definition of passport holders, they see themselves as Irish Americans and are proud of their Irish heritage and want to do their bit.

They have a distinct Irish heritage just like Travellers or Irish in London or the nationalist community in the North. They are not interested in 'swooping in to take things over'. Many of these people are extremely well off indeed and do not need the small change they could earn in Ireland compared to the US. Southsiderrosie, don't do the typical defensive attitude for the sake of it.

Which typical defensive attitude? I'm an American.

If these guys have all the answers, then how about they fix some of the problems in their home state before worrying about Ireland? California is a disaster. Let them show they can fix their own house before they worry about anyone else's.

[BFDCH.]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

I don’t really care what the guy’s nationality is. It’s a side issue as far as I’m concerned.
Were he British, even with Irish ancestry, he’d be told to **** right off by many of the posters on this forum.
Fair enough. I’m a member of the Irish diaspora. You may appoint me to an unpaid position on an Irish state board at your leisure.

I don't get this British thing, why is that relevent? If posters on here would say that let them come and say it. If you think that being born in Britain but of Irish stock is a problem then say so. To me that link, the proven ability and desire to assist for free shows that they are motivated by something beyond making a quick buck or showing up the natives as clowns.

On your last point have you had a hand in running very successful companies? if not, no dice.

[djpbarry]

Originally Posted by BFDCH.

To me that link, the proven ability and desire to assist for free shows that they are motivated by something beyond making a quick buck...

Does it? So, Declan Ganley’s interest in Irish politics doesn’t have anything at all to do with his business interests?

Originally Posted by BFDCH.

On your last point have you had a hand in running very successful companies?

Is that the only criteria that should be met? Because if it is, then Ireland need look no further than this lot:
http://www.independent.ie/business/r...0-2116314.html

[Permabear]

The premise of this op-ed is that Ireland lacks businesspeople with the can-do entrepreneurial spirit necessary to get the country back on its feet again. It suggests that we should import such people from Silicon Valley so they can supply the knowledge and expertise that we presumably lack.

This is simply wrong. Ireland has a lot of indigenous business talent — but this talent is simply not welcome inside the cosseted state sector.

Californians probably wonder why, at the onset of the crisis, the Irish state chose to guarantee the liabilities of its collapsed banking sector. They probably wonder why we also chose to guarantee the wages of one of the world's highest-paid public sectors. Maybe they ask why we maintain some of the most generous social welfare benefits in Europe — all while running a budget deficit larger than Greece's. Maybe they even wonder why we teach only Irish at primary school level, at a time when companies such as Google and Facebook are forced to look abroad for multilingual employees. Or maybe they are curious to know why, despite increasing education spending by 83 percent between 2000 and 2008, we rank 26th out of 34 OECD countries for maths ability.

But if they even have to ask such questions, they don't understand how the statist, protectionist culture of Official Ireland, rotten to the core with nepotism and cronyism, is invested more in its own self-protection than the vaunted "national interest."

Offering to assist with political and economic reform presumes that the people you're offering to assist actually want your help. For the most part, they don't.

[djpbarry]

Originally Posted by Permabear

This is simply wrong. Ireland has a lot of indigenous business talent — but this talent is simply not welcome inside the cosseted state sector.

Denis O’Brien and Ben Dunne, for example, seemed to be fairly welcome. As was/is Seán Gallagher, apparently.

Originally Posted by Permabear

But if they even have to ask such questions, they don't understand how the statist, protectionist culture of Official Ireland, rotten to the core with nepotism and cronyism, is invested more in its own self-protection than the vaunted "national interest."

To be fair, I’m sure Americans are only too familiar with the concepts of nepotism and cronyism.

[BFDCH.]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

Does it? So, Declan Ganley’s interest in Irish politics doesn’t have anything at all to do with his business interests?
Is that the only criteria that should be met? Because if it is, then Ireland need look no further than this lot:
http://www.independent.ie/business/r...0-2116314.html

Have they offered to help?

[djpbarry]

Originally Posted by BFDCH.

Have they offered to help?

Well, Ganley offered to "help", didn't he? So did Sean Gallagher.

[BFDCH.]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

Well, Ganley offered to "help", didn't he? So did Sean Gallagher.

they're not on your list

[Welease]

Isn't the issue that we invited these people across to Farmleigh to help?.. They came (at their own expense). The government claimed it was a resounding success, and their experience and input was vital to Ireland's recovery...

Then when they offer their experience.. we ignore them..

As I understand it, that is what the writer was complaining about, and I tend to agree with him.If we had no intention of using their help, then why bother with the whole exercise?

[maninasia]

Originally Posted by southsiderosie

Which typical defensive attitude? I'm an American.

If these guys have all the answers, then how about they fix some of the problems in their home state before worrying about Ireland? California is a disaster. Let them show they can fix their own house before they worry about anyone else's.

Again why the attitude? They have huge pull in American multinational investment decisions, what's there to lose from getting them involved with Ireland more?
What's this got to do with California?

It doesn't make sense to not at least try getting some of them on board.

Djbarry- you are skipping all over the place in your arguments, questioning their irishness , then claiming you dont care, you may live overseas but you brought your parochialism with you.

[djpbarry]

Originally Posted by maninasia

Djbarry- you are skipping all over the place in your arguments, questioning their irishness , then claiming you dont care...

First of all, the "what if they were British" question was asked by southsiderosie, not me, but I agree with her point. I don't care what nationality they are, but I find the "oh, but they're big American multinational types - they'll fix everything" attitude ever so slightly amusing.

[Permabear]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

Denis O’Brien and Ben Dunne, for example, seemed to be fairly welcome. As was/is Seán Gallagher, apparently.

All three already had or have cosy relationships with the existing political establishment. They're far from outsiders, and they know better than to try to rock the boat.

To be fair, I’m sure Americans are only too familiar with the concepts of nepotism and cronyism.

Second- and third-generation Irish are often very distant from the country and its politics. Many don't fully realize what the political establishment is like here. Others have a tendency to view the "auld sod" through green-tinted glasses. There's a charming naiveté to the idea that people can waltz in from Silicon Valley to fix all our problems — but I don't think they've really thought this through.

[Reekwind]

I hate this attitude that assumes that the problem is a lack of intelligence at the top; ie, something that can be rectified by importing a few emigres. It both underestimates the scale of our problems and feeds into this fawning cult of the individual businessman

Here's the thing: Ireland's problem are structural in nature and can only be solved by a complete reform of the system. That is something that has to come from below, not by flying in a few highly paid suits to network in some stately house. That is no silver bullet. And even if there was I wouldn't trust a US businessman with the gun lest he outsource the HSE to China

[maninasia]

Originally Posted by djpbarry

First of all, the "what if they were British" question was asked by southsiderosie, not me, but I agree with her point. I don't care what nationality they are, but I find the "oh, but they're big American multinational types - they'll fix everything" attitude ever so slightly amusing.

I doubt very much they think that. I doubt they are going to love much sleep over this actually. It is the process of engaging people that are involved with investment that is the important thing here. I think the reaction to an offer of making some substantial input is amusing though.
But you'll take 100 billion euro bailouts from the EU without even a protest.