[Thoie]

I think if I was asked on a flight if I was willing to man the exits I'd just say "No, not unless I'm sitting there for the entire duration of the flight to allow myself to become familiar with their operation".

If everyone said that, they'd be a bit screwed and would end up having to move *someone* (not necessarily me) into those seats.

[AfterDusk]

Ryanair can't bring out these new policies and procedures without contacting the IAA and getting their approval in the first place. You can't just invent rules & practices all on your own & just implement them whenever you want. The IAA have to approve it all first. They wouldn't be doing it if it was against safety rules & regs.

[MYOB]

Originally Posted by neil2304

Ryanair can't bring out these new policies and procedures without contacting the IAA and getting their approval in the first place. You can't just invent rules & practices all on your own & just implement them whenever you want. The IAA have to approve it all first. They wouldn't be doing it if it was against safety rules & regs.

I think the IAA investigation shows us that Ryanair did not contact the IAA; and that it is against their rules. You may want to read the whole thread.

And as I mentioned earlier, the IAA issued a reminder notice of the regulations 7 weeks ago:

http://www.iaa.ie/index.jsp?p=93&n=9...nn=283&lID=948

[scudzilla]

From the IAA report

3.2.1 It is IAA policy that passenger seats immediately adjacent to self help emergency exits are occupied during taxi, take-off and landing. This will ensure a speedy and efficient response should a situation arise which warrants an emergency evacuation of the aeroplane. Operations Manual procedures shall take into account the suitability criteria and any restrictions for certain categories of passengers.

It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if Ryanair asked someone to sit in the seats for just taxi, take off & landing, but told them to move back to there own seats during the flight!

[bkehoe]

I'm wondering though if "IAA Policy" is legally defined as a regulation or if its a 'best operating practice' or something similar that while requested by them doesn't have a legal basis and is thus the reason Ryanair claim they're complying with all safety regulations?

[bk]

Yes, the Ryanair flight I was on also had the tables deployed at these seats, to block passengers from using them.

Also, again, despite me sitting at the aisle directly behind the empty emergency exit row, I wasn't asked or instructed in how to use the emergency exit doors, nor was anyone else.

I will report this to the IAA. I travel Ryanair often, but for the first time I really did feel unsafe traveling with them.

[cson]

This unfortunately is probably the kind of thing that will only be taken care of once an incident happens. Same as the seatbelts on the buses thing.

[coylemj]

The last time I sat right beside the exit door, one of the cabin crew came up to me and my travelling companions before takeoff and asked me if I was ok to open the door in an emergency. I took it that the request was made for a number of reasons...

1. That she had some interaction with me to make sure that I wasn't p**ed drunk

2. That from the brief conversation I appeared intelligent enough to read the instructions on the panel and carry them out

3. To assess that I was physically able to lift the panel and push it out if needed i.e. that I wasn't physically disabled or carrying an injury like my arm in a sling

Leaving the row of seats empty clearly means that there is no knowing who is going to get to the emergency door first and if there is any smoke, even a physically able person might have a problem reading the instructions, something which could delay the evacuation and ultimately costs lives.

What I'm thinking of is that someone who is the worse for drink ends up first at the emergency exit, can't figure out how to open it without a handle to turn and causes a pileup in the panic.

[cml387]

Having an manned exit does not guarantee a speedy exit.
In the Manchester air disaster,one of the passengers was seen attempting to open an overwing exit by trying to pull on the "EXIT" light above the door.
When it was finally opened by another passenger it fell back onto her,trapping her temporarily underneath and causing more delay.

There is a case for only having strapping six foot men trained in opening and throwing out the door in case of emergency,but of course we never expect an accident to happen,do we?

[coylemj]

Originally Posted by cml387

Having an manned exit does not guarantee a speedy exit.
In the Manchester air disaster,one of the passengers was seen attempting to open an overwing exit by trying to pull on the "EXIT" light above the door.
When it was finally opened by another passenger it fell back onto her,trapping her temporarily underneath and causing more delay.

Neither of which would happen nowadays provided that someone was seated beside the emergency exit during the flight in which case they woud have time to study the pictorial instructions showing how the panel is removed and then chucked out.

If there is nobody seated beside the exit during the flight then there is a major risk that precisely what you described happened in Munich could happen again, especially if there is smoke in the cabin when the passengers need to exit and some poor soul has to try to read the instructions with panicking people behind him.

[APM]

Originally Posted by cml387

Having an manned exit does not guarantee a speedy exit.
In the Manchester air disaster,one of the passengers was seen attempting to open an overwing exit by trying to pull on the "EXIT" light above the door.
When it was finally opened by another passenger it fell back onto her,trapping her temporarily underneath and causing more delay.

There is a case for only having strapping six foot men trained in opening and throwing out the door in case of emergency,but of course we never expect an accident to happen,do we?

On the 737-800 you do not need any great strength to open the overwing exit, and it opens outward and upward away from the passengers, self contained to the aircraft. So it does not need to be thrown away etc

[LLU]

I see they've now been ordered to fill those seats :

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-3112300.html

RYANAIR has been told that passengers must sit beside emergency exits -- even if they haven't paid the €10 charged by the airline for the seats, which have more leg room.
The Irish Aviation Authority (IAA) says the seats must have a passenger sitting in them at all times to open the safety doors in case of an emergency.
Having nobody beside the exits could result in an "inadequate level of safety" and "hinder or delay" evacuation, the air safety chiefs said.
Ryanair and other airlines charge passengers extra to sit on these seats, but the IAA was worried the budget airline was leaving the seats vacant if no customers paid the charge.
It has now directed the airline to change its policy.
"They have to make sure the seats are occupied, whether they are paid for or not," an IAA spokeswoman said.
A letter from IAA, sent to other European airline regulators and the European Commission, says it has no objection to the extra €10 -- but does not want the seats left empty.
And it has now directed Ryanair to have people in the emergency aisles at all times, meaning some passengers could get a more comfortable seat without forking out €10, if the seats haven't already been taken.
The letter, seen by the Irish Independent, says: "An Irish air operator introduced a procedure which does not permit passengers to occupy certain seats if an extra charge is not paid".
Not allowing people in the seats "resulted on occasions in seats at overwing emergency exits (self help) being left unmanned for taxi, take off and landing. The authority has identified this as a problem resulting in an inadequate level of safety that can hinder or delay the passenger evacuation process in the event of an emergency."
Emergency exit seats are usually in the first four rows and in the middle of a plane. The seats are popular because they offer more leg room. Because of the IAA's ruling, Ryanair said it will change its rules. Stephen McNamara, the airline's spokesman, said: "We are revising our boarding procedures and briefing our crews at all bases to comply with this requirement from June 1, 2012".
- Fiach Kelly Political Correspondent

[IngazZagni]

An absolutely correct decision by the IAA I think. The new IAA directive states that at least one passenger must be seated at each of the 4 overwing exit rows.

[Su Campu]

Ryanair really are a pack of chancers, and will try anything if they can get away with it. And why wait until June 1st to implement it? Do it NOW!

Just something I noticed. The briefing is to determine the passengers' suitability to assist in an emergency. So imagine Joe has paid his money to sit there but they deem him not suitable? Do you really think they're going to ask him to vacate it and have to reimburse him the 10 quid he paid for the seat? Nope. That's money in their pocket, so they'll leave him where he is and hope he isn't called into action. Cutting corners for safety's sake. Luckily they've been found out.

Prior to the commencement of taxi, an operator shall ensure that cabin crew conduct an appropriate awareness briefing for those passengers seated immediately adjacent to self help emergency exits. This abbreviated briefing shall determine the passengers’ suitability to occupy the seats and seek their consent to assist in an emergency evacuation should the need arise. The passengers shall be advised to read and understand the operating instructions for the self help emergency exits, which are located on the exit placards and the passenger safety briefing cards.
It shall be made clear to the passengers in the briefing that such exits are designated as “self help emergency exits” and there will be no cabin crewmember presence at them.

On a more general note, I really don't see why people are so hung up on what seat they get anyway, unless they're traveling with young kids, etc. People willingly pay extra for "Priority" boarding, yet complain about other charges they have to pay. If you're at the end of the priority queue then you could have just instead gotten to the front of the "Other Pax" queue and you'd save yourself a few quid!

[View Profile]

So imagine Joe has paid his money to sit there but they deem him not suitable? Do you really think they're going to ask him to vacate it and have to reimburse him the 10 quid he paid for the seat? Nope.

Actually saw this happen yesterday. Lets say a large gentleman had booked an emergency exit seat. The CC asked him to move for takeoff and landing to another seat due to his size. He had no problem with it and she mentioned he could return to his seat after takeoff which he didn't bother doing.

Point is when you book an emergency exit seat it states you must be an able bodied passenger. He clearly wasn't so its his fault.