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22-10-2011, 23:23   #1
eth0
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Currently closed lines you'd like to see re-opened

Seeing the heavy opposition to a certain one being re-opened are there any that people have a more positive attitude towards? Or should they all be made into cycle paths?
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22-10-2011, 23:32   #2
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The "heavy opposition" is only successful propaganda-mongering. Kinda like the second votes on the Treaties of Nice and Lisbon.

When the funds for roads go dry, then they'll be begging for all of them back, and they'll be kicking themselves for not keeping the four-axle GMs (which could have been rebuilt almost an infinite number of times). I kind of favour Inny Junction to Cavan after the former MGWR line to Navan, myself...
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23-10-2011, 00:22   #3
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I'd much rather see new lines built to modern standards, with proper alignments between major centres of population. I'd like to see rebuilds and expansions of the Dublin commuter network, the area that carries the most passengers and makes the most money. Four-tracking of the Northern Line. Grade separated junctions at key points. Dublin Underground. Electrification. Removal of level crossings.

If an old line is to be reopened, it should be "in spirit". As in, a new alignment designed between the two endpoints to serve any areas inbetween that warrant it, new stations where needed and no old stations where not needed. As I see it, there was a reason these lines were closed in the past, and that should not be ignored. The reason may still be valid today.
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23-10-2011, 00:29   #4
eth0
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I'd much rather see new lines built to modern standards, with proper alignments between major centres of population. I'd like to see rebuilds and expansions of the Dublin commuter network, the area that carries the most passengers and makes the most money. Four-tracking of the Northern Line. Grade separated junctions at key points. Dublin Underground. Electrification. Removal of level crossings.

If an old line is to be reopened, it should be "in spirit". As in, a new alignment designed between the two endpoints to serve any areas inbetween that warrant it, new stations where needed and no old stations where not needed. As I see it, there was a reason these lines were closed in the past, and that should not be ignored. The reason may still be valid today.
It may be still valid today, or it might not depending on population changes. New direct services would be nice but CPO's are a pain and nobody wants to do them anymore. Some re-alignment might be possible here and there along old lines but the days of building brand new ones from scratch is over I'd say
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23-10-2011, 00:40   #5
Jehuty42
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It may be still valid today, or it might not depending on population changes.
Yep, but that is something that should be looked at very very closely before any decision is made.


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New direct services would be nice but CPO's are a pain and nobody wants to do them anymore. Some re-alignment might be possible here and there along old lines but the days of building brand new ones from scratch is over I'd say
Indeed, maybe they are over. But as I see it the only way to get a return on the investment in opening a railway line is to spend the money, do the hard work and make it a modern relevant line from day one. It's insane that railways should be constrained by the boundaries set up in the 19th century. Either do the job fully and to the highest standard or don't do it at all, since it seems that once a line is built, it'll be hanging around for the next hundred or so years. It should be as future proof as it can, and damn the expense.
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23-10-2011, 02:21   #6
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The "heavy opposition" is only successful propaganda-mongering. Kinda like the second votes on the Treaties of Nice and Lisbon.
If you're referring to the Western Snail Corridor I should think that the shambles of the current Limerick Galway services (which between Athenry and Ennis has FEWER passengers than Waterford-Rosslare had when it closed) ... does anyone really think that building the "Social Justice Express" through Mayo (on twisty, hilly victorian tramways, the line above Athenry was built as a series of Light Railways) is going to be a good idea?

There are lines I would like to see reopened.
  1. Limerick-Rosslare, including the recently decommissioned Waterford-Rosslare line, should be packaged up and leased to a private railway. Irish rail never wanted to run these services and from what I've read they did everything they could to scare passengers away. Yet it still carried more passengers than Ennis-Athenry. Time to take CIE/Irish Rail out of the equation where (what's left of) Limerick-Rosslare is concerned.
  2. Pace-Navan.
Obviously though there need to be new railways where demand (i.e. people who would actually use the service) dictates, cheifly the Dublin Metro North, DART Underground and new Luas lines in Dublin, maybe Cork and Galway.
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23-10-2011, 09:36   #7
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you see it as opposition to the re-opening of the WRC when it is nothing of the sort.

All the opposition I have seen on Boards (including my own) has been to the WAY it has been done. Re-instating a winding slow indirect line just because it used to be there instead of going the extra (few) miles to build a modern relevant railway.

As it is the money spent has been wasted and the proof is there for all to see in the usage figures. An average of 9 passengers (or two taxi loads) per train, using a service slower and more expensive than the express coach put on to compete with it.

Any money invested in the future should (after very careful scrutiny) be spent on improving radically InterCity (to compete with the motorways) and increasing the commuter capacity, mainly in Dublin but also in Cork and also Limerick and Galay to an extent
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23-10-2011, 12:15   #8
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For me:

On Intercity:

(a) A more direct line from Dublin to Derry "filling in" the gap in the Northwest, going via Navan (ex MGWR formation), then from there to Monaghan (Branch for Enniskillen), then Omagh-Strabane-Derry.

(b) Metro North to be full 1600mm gauge, and running from Stephens Green-Dublin Airport-Balbriggan, providing a "High Speed" alternate route to Drogheda, Dundalk and Belfast. The High speed limited stop services to Dublin Airport-Balbriggan-Drogheda-Dundalk-Newry-Portadown-Belfast would carry a premium fare and relieve congestion on the Northern Line from Connolly-Balbriggan.

(c) If only Harcourt Street - Bray had been rebuilt to DART standards. Then it would interact better with (b). Still.....we're stuck with it.

(d) Electrification of all suburban routes from Dublin. Reopening a spur to Naas as an end point for DART.

(e) Reinstating Double tracking on Dublin-Galway via Mullingar, to the condition it was pre 1927. That was the standard it was built to in the first place.
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23-10-2011, 13:40   #9
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sure I'd love to see them all reopen, but failing that any line that a private self funded company can come onto with a proper business plan should be considered. IE needs to be axed from rail control at this point and infrastructure splits from stock and routing.
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23-10-2011, 13:42   #10
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All 30 tram lines that covered Dublin.

And Cork's tramways too.
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25-10-2011, 11:29   #11
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The Cork, Blackrock and Passage for sure. A commuter line before the word 'commuter' was invented.
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25-10-2011, 12:33   #12
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The Cork, Blackrock and Passage for sure. A commuter line before the word 'commuter' was invented.
Probably would be reasonably sucessfull on a LUAS type basis but only as far as Carrigaline Id imagine. Would need to share its trackbed with a very popuilar footpath though and need a new bridge as the original over the harbour inlet near DOuglas has been replaced with a footbridge.

Quite doable and not too dear.

Also there could be a LUAS from the P&R that Isnt there yet near the tunnel via Heuston, the quays, western rd UCC CUH and CIT to Ballincollig. Also doable wuite cheaply if we had any money.
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25-10-2011, 12:49   #13
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The truncations with bypasses etc around Carrigaline would be problematic, as well as the missing bridge just beyond. The former double track section could possibly be shared with walkers/cyclists.

As a footpath it's well signposted on the Carrigaline-Crosser section. There's nothing to indicate its presence from Albert Rd./Pairc Ui Choimh (sp?) surrounds. Would make a nice extended trail for visitors with a little joined-up thinking.
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25-10-2011, 13:39   #14
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absolutely but you know road crossings arent really a problem if you think of a LUAS crossing as just being another phase in the traffic light sequence. In any case I don't think there are any really major crossing to contend with. The Road to the ferry port N28 before carrigaline and the relief road near the town. I don't see a need to go beyond Carrigaline. The whole section could be shared with the trams, its really not a problem integrating the two modes.

I dont know where the footpath starts but it certainly is there and in great condition passing Blackrock and Mahon and across the estuary

Last edited by corktina; 25-10-2011 at 13:41.
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25-10-2011, 15:17   #15
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It starts at the junction of Centre Park Rd/Monaghan Rd.
No signage. Breaks at Pairc Ui Caoimh and restarts at the eastern end through to Rochestown. Stops at Rochestown station and commences at the road to Hop Island and on to Passage West. Think it starts again after Monkstown until approach to Raffeen. Route overgrown from there to Carrigaline.
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