[drunkmonkey]

Originally Posted by The Minstrel

Interesting post. IMO, though, no candidate can survive the sort of onslaught that the Independent has run against MMcG. It just seems to be relentless.

Perhaps we are too quick to write Norris off also?

What does surprise me is the level of support for Gallagher. Having him win it would be akin to having a Fianna Fail Trojan Horse in the Aras. We all jeered Micheal Martin for his perceived weakness in failing to put a candidate forward, but a Sean Gallagher win could be a masterstroke on the part of Micheal Martin.

He survived taking on the British Army i'm sure he can handle the the independent.

Norris and Dana probably won't hit the quota and will probably drop out this week.

I can't see the people putting Gallagher in power, the ff vote is not that strong, the republican vote on the other hand...!

[celticcrash]

Originally Posted by Liam Byrne

Maybe he meant the real one ?

Poor Liam was left out in the cold.

[CDfm]

I think the MMG/SF approach the press handling has contributed hugely to this issue.

Take his teams approach to a Sindo journalist and post show confrtontation with Miriam.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...n-2904839.html

[Dotsey]

Originally Posted by The Waltzing Consumer

In our law, and most laws, a person is as guilty of murder even if they did not pull the trigger or press the button for the bomb themselves but planned the murder and had some hand in it.

McGuinness rose through the ranks of the PIRA to its highest levels according to pretty much anyone. Someone at such a high level would have been privy to huge amounts of information and planning of activities such as murder and bombings.

He was caught with explosives and bullets in the early 70s, what was this for?

Being accused by a tv presenter of murdering someone and actually murdering someone is completely different. There is no proof to suggest that MMcG ever murdered someone or has been involved in ordering or planning the deaths of innocent people.

I have seen him described as IRA chief of staff by newspapers during the course of this election but other information suggests that Seán Mac Stíofán, Joe Cahill, Seámus Twomey, Ivor Bell and Kevin McKenna were at the helm for practically the whole period of the Troubles.

He said he left in 1974 after reflecting on the struggle in prison, and you said he was caught with explosives etc in.... the early 70's which reinforces exactly what MMcG was saying.

Originally Posted by todolist

McGuinness is a thug.Adams is a thug.They condoned and explained away murders.The south with their cults of Collins/De Valera inspired those Northern thugs.Collins and De Valera were murderous gunman.How can Fine Gael criticize the monster they created?

What really inspired "those northern thugs" was brutality of the oppressive regime in the north which they lived under. There was an anti-catholic fascist system in place which treated them as second class citizens and had a manipulated voting system which insured that the ruling protestants always kept a comfortable majority.

Fine Gael had no problem twice running Seán Mac Eoin in presidential elections in 1945 and 1959. Unlike MMcG there is actual proof that he murdered people and directed others to do the same. Enda Kenny has a picture of Michael Collins hanging over his desk and he was pretty much the architect of modern guerrilla warfare.

Why don't the Labour party divulge exactly the role of Gilmore, Rabbitte and De Rossa in the Workers Party and Official IRA.

[Monty Burnz]

Originally Posted by Dotsey

Being accused by a tv presenter of murdering someone and actually murdering someone is completely different. There is no proof to suggest that MMcG ever murdered someone or has been involved in ordering or planning the deaths of innocent people.

The problem with this is that your definition of innocent and someone else's definition of innocent might be very different. Can we at least agree that he was certainly involved in participating in, planning or ordering the killing of some people? Or are we going to maintain the notion that he was in charge of the IRA creche?

Originally Posted by Dotsey

Fine Gael had no problem twice running Seán Mac Eoin in presidential elections in 1945 and 1959. Unlike MMcG there is actual proof that he murdered people and directed others to do the same.

I can assure you that I wouldn't have voted for him either, if that's any good to you.

[Wider Road]

Originally Posted by Monty Burnz

The problem with this is that your definition of innocent and someone else's definition of innocent might be very different. Can we at least agree that he was certainly involved in participating in, planning or ordering the killing of some people? Or are we going to maintain the notion that he was in charge of the IRA creche?

I can assure you that I wouldn't have voted for him either, if that's any good to you.

What's your opinion on a present govt employee being released on a technical issue, rather than serving time after being convicted of murder?
You can't have it both ways.

[Monty Burnz]

Originally Posted by Wider Road

What's your opinion on a present govt employee being released on a technical issue, rather than serving time after being convicted of murder?
You can't have it both ways.

I can't have what both ways?

Re. Mr. Kathleen Lynch - if he was guilty, he certainly should have served all the time he was due. But under the GFA, he probably would only have served a couple of years anyway, no?

[Dr Galen]

Unfortunately, what could have been an interesting thread/discussion on the role of the media in this election, has descended into the usual entrenched positions and the same tired arguments on BOTH sides.

We do not need another thread around the issues in general of the MMG campaign and his past. If tomorrow morning, thats the line this thread continues down, then I'll be closing it.

Cheers

DrG

[Wider Road]

Originally Posted by Monty Burnz

I can't have what both ways?

Re. Mr. Kathleen Lynch - if he was guilty, he certainly should have served all the time he was due. But under the GFA, he probably would only have served a couple of years anyway, no?

Kathleen is not a mans name, it's Bernard Lynch that's the story, remember!!
The Mail on Sunday first reported the story & then had a follow up with Bernard's employment by the current govt.
We owe the media & especially The Mail On Sunday a great thank you for this story.
It tells us about a murder in 1975 & a conviction in 76. Why Monty says that Bernard Lynch would only serve a couple of years in jail under the GFA is beyond me, considering it came into effect in 1999, (I think).
The media has done us a service here.

[Einhard]

Originally Posted by Wider Road

Kathleen is not a mans name, it's Bernard Lynch that's the story, remember!!
The Mail on Sunday first reported the story & then had a follow up with Bernard's employment by the current govt.
We owe the media & especially The Mail On Sunday a great thank you for this story.
It tells us about a murder in 1975 & a conviction in 76. Why Monty says that Bernard Lynch would only serve a couple of years in jail under the GFA is beyond me, considering it came into effect in 1999, (I think).
The media has done us a service here.

Wasn't his conviction overturned?

[charlemont]

Originally Posted by todolist

McGuinness is a thug.Adams is a thug.They condoned and explained away murders.The south with their cults of Collins/Dev Valera inspired those Northern thugs.Collins and Dev Valera were murderous gunman.How can Fine Gael criticize the monster they created?

So its all one sided in your world, Yea ?

[Wider Road]

Originally Posted by Einhard

Wasn't his conviction overturned?

Not because of innocence.
Read the story again & reply.
Why has Kathleen (wife) & Ciaran (brother) no comment to make on the matter of murder?
Their silence is deafening!!
Bernard is now employed by the current govt!!
Are you happy with that?

[Wolfe Tone]

Originally Posted by Einhard

Wasn't his conviction overturned?

Astatement (which may have been beaten out of him by the Gardaí, not unusual during the troubles) was taken after the period they were allowed hold him expired. The Judge then deemed it inadmissible so the conviction was quashed.

[The Scientician]

The Sindo has always been virulently anti-SF. I don't read the paper myself but it's plainly evident that its coverage differs from other Irish newspapers. It also hides behind printing its OP/ED piece titles on the cover, so even if there's no news they can stir shít. It's plain as day, I don't think I'd need to do a content analysis to confirm.

I often wish there were an Irish equivalent of the Guardian, with fewer spelling errors. The Indo is a rag but the Irish Times is too dry, it can be a hard slog getting through it.

[Hootanany]

The more people talk him down the more I want to vote for him. This spin has to stop youbhave been found out.