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06-09-2011, 10:31   #31
TheUsual
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I have to say that Galway traffic always shocks me.
Dublin has the population but Galway doesn't.

Two things may help :

1. Multiple Park (for free) and ride around the city for free, where the council pay for short-hop buses to act like the Luas in Dublin (every 10 minutes). Bus lanes may be a problem, maybe a new bridge and a one-way traffic system like Cork are the answer.

2. Get some driving instructors to teach people how to use roundabouts. Galway is by far the worst town in Ireland to drive in my opinion. That and aggressive speeding for no reason on the bypass, and I have seen a lot of Gardaí stop speeders there.

Last edited by TheUsual; 06-09-2011 at 10:56.
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06-09-2011, 10:37   #32
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You are asking the wrong question, if such an "crisis" occurs then these people would not have a job/education to go to, but then again basic economics is often missing in arguments here


It's a thought experiment. My point is that that arguments for the GCOB are often based on alleged lack of choice, eg people can't walk, cycle or use the bus. It is certainly true that there are barriers to these modes of travel, but it is not tenable to suggest that they are impossible. If a dramatic event occurred tomorrow that made driving impossible or just very very difficult, I think you'd find that people would not be immobilised. They'd find a way to get to their job or education.

That's at the heart of the issue, IMO. At the moment, despite all the complaints, many commuters prefer to use their car, though many dress that up as "need".



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speaking of economics how many jobs are being lost due to the city not being able to grow? people not being able to get around to shops??

"People"? Careful now!
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06-09-2011, 10:48   #33
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while we are making doomsday style arguments, how will galway survive an asteroid strike? tidal wave?? carmagedon (oh wait)

I swear the doomongery and lack of practicality from "environmentalists" is driving me up the wall, while you are proud of your 10% reduction in CO2 emmisions or whatever 10 more Chinese are rising to middle class (and dumping their bikes for cars) standard of living wiping out your "savings"


You're missing the point, as is Dubhthach who thanked your post but did not acknowledge that the GCOB is itself a "what if" at this point in time.

So are you saying that the Chinese justify the GCOB and Galway's astonishing levels of car use and dependence?
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06-09-2011, 10:49   #34
ei.sdraob
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Have you actually cycled in Galway? Or used public transport??

I spend years cycling in Galway and would not wish it on worst enemy, unlike Dublin (which was pleasant to cycle on south side of city) in Galway it rains twice more than Dublin, often with galeforce gusts, and it is not flat either, and then there are the bloody roundabouts, why oh why is there a roundabout at terryland?

And of course there are people who work in the factories but have to get home on the west side of town, it is sort of hard nowadays to move home remortgage etc

And yes people do need to get to shops and businesses for an economy to function, was talking to a retailer yesterday who rolled his eyes at the driving rain outside and lack of customers who would not dare to take a trip in such conditions

And then there are people who simply do not have the health to cycle

I am not even going to mention the poor bastards who want to get around galway only to go onto Connemara and the West, for business or tourism

As for buses, they are often overcrowded, smelly and at times/destinations full of certain loud "minority" who make bus commuting a miserable experience for all, and of course they all go in and out of town, no buses going across town

Btw how would you propose to add 2 bus lanes on lets say the quincenteneal bridge? reduce traffic to one lane?? spend enough money widening the bridge spending as much money as the bypass bridge would cost?

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"People"? Careful now!
Yes people, people need to also shop and reach recreations not just commute to/from work
We are not all just some automatons in a Green Matrixian utopia were we should all be hooked up to a battery powering the robots
We are people who just want to get on with our lives and are bloody sick of others dictating how we should live and travel our lives

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So are you saying that the Chinese justify the GCOB and Galway's astonishing levels of car use and dependence?
1. No I think focusing so much energy and time on cutting CO2 is pointless as the rest of the world does not give a rats arse and want to live their lives, moving people to bycicles only to boast about reduction in CO2 is pointless when the Chinese build a new coal plant every week.

2. do you have any figures to backup your claims about "car dependence" in Galway, and as compared to whom exactly??

Last edited by ei.sdraob; 06-09-2011 at 10:55.
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06-09-2011, 11:11   #35
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A question for Iwannahurl are you from Galway? Do you take some perverse pleasure out of suffering of people here??

As seen from your posts here its obvious you are not here

@TheUsual
There is no plan, any attempts at planning in Galway get constantly knocked down by the Green lobby, this bypass should have been build 10 years ago

edit:
I dont know why cyclists are so against they bypass, considering it would take cars out and around the city out of the city, making it safer for cycling

Last edited by ei.sdraob; 06-09-2011 at 11:14.
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06-09-2011, 11:18   #36
dubhthach
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There was also a proposal to build a new bridge beside the Salmon Weir bridge so as to improve flow at this choke point. The idea been that each bridge would carry traffic in one direction and that there would be wider footpaths, cycle lanes.

The reality is that there are simply not enough river crossings, the vast bulk of all commuter traffic is forced onto either the Quincentenarial or Wolfe Tone Bridges.

For example Knocknacarra has about 12k inhabitants let there is no employment in the area (apart from Hibernian offices and some retail), all of these people have to commute generally to east side of city (ballybrit, Parkmore etc.)
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06-09-2011, 11:24   #37
TheUsual
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Originally Posted by ei.sdraob View Post
There is no plan, any attempts at planning in Galway get constantly knocked down by the Green lobby, this bypass should have been build 10 years ago
I don't think another bypass is the answer. Free quick buses for short hops and another bridge or two is the answer (in an ideal world).

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I dont know why cyclists are so against they bypass, considering it would take cars out and around the city out of the city, making it safer for cycling
Cycling in Galway is a non-starter (apart from the rain). What if you have a bad heart or leg ?
Cyclists are an angry bunch in my experience .. and yes I own a bicycle.
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06-09-2011, 11:33   #38
ei.sdraob
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I don't think another bypass is the answer. Free quick buses for short hops and another bridge or two is the answer (in an ideal world).



Cycling in Galway is a non-starter (apart from the rain). What if you have a bad heart or leg ?
Cyclists are an angry bunch in my experience .. and yes I own a bicycle.
Well thats the thing if you go to the expense of building a new bridge why not complete a bypass then? The main cost will be the bridge.

There is also an issue of space, there is none next to existing quincenteal bridge due to university buildings (brand new engineering building just poped up there)
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06-09-2011, 11:43   #39
TheUsual
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Well thats the thing if you go to the expense of building a new bridge why not complete a bypass then? The main cost will be the bridge.
See you have a proper bypass already, nearly Dublin M50 sized. Trust me once you sort the cause of the problem, you will see congestion drop by half.

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There is also an issue of space, there is none next to existing quincenteal bridge due to university buildings (brand new engineering building just poped up there)
The Government has lots of unemployed people and cheap labour, now is the perfect time to get more bridges up. Maybe they need to slap a CPO (compulsary purchase order) on a site or too but it has been done before. Plus if you look at the M50/M1 interchange in Dublin they used the same space to carry the two roads.

Last edited by TheUsual; 06-09-2011 at 11:46.
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06-09-2011, 11:44   #40
dubhthach
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The only viable bridge location is in Menlo which is the site of the bridge for the GCOB. There are no potential crossing points between the Salmon Weir Bridge and the sea, unless you cut a path through the Claddagh and use one of the Claddagh piers to join up with Merchan't road (beside the new museum) -- but that's pie in the sky.
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06-09-2011, 11:50   #41
Iwannahurl
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Originally Posted by ei.sdraob View Post
A question for Iwannahurl are you from Galway? Do you take some perverse pleasure out of suffering of people here??

As seen from your posts here its obvious you are not here

@TheUsual
There is no plan, any attempts at planning in Galway get constantly knocked down by the Green lobby, this bypass should have been build 10 years ago

edit:
I dont know why cyclists are so against they bypass, considering it would take cars out and around the city out of the city, making it safer for cycling

Where I'm from is of no relevance to this discussion, and is nobody else's business anyway.

"Suffering"? Do you really mean that? Sitting in our cars is "suffering"?
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06-09-2011, 11:55   #42
Iwannahurl
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I don't think another bypass is the answer. Free quick buses for short hops and another bridge or two is the answer (in an ideal world).

Cycling in Galway is a non-starter (apart from the rain). What if you have a bad heart or leg ?
Cyclists are an angry bunch in my experience .. and yes I own a bicycle.


You might be right in the former, but you are demonstrably wrong with the latter. Galway City is already doing well on the cycling front (thanks to NUIG and GMIT perhaps, as well as community and official efforts).

How many people with bad hearts and bad legs are commuting to work or education every day? BTW, depending on the stage of illness, cycling is a great method of secondary prevention of heart disease.
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06-09-2011, 12:02   #43
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edit:
I dont know why cyclists are so against they bypass, considering it would take cars out and around the city out of the city, making it safer for cycling
1. The cycle campaign does not have a stated position on the bypass. This is somewhat curious as normally a bypass would be an obvious measure to improve cycling conditions in a city.

2. If those in favour if the bypass want the support of other interest groups then they would want to start putting something on the table. Instead they want to keep the roundabouts, they are opposed to speed management, they oppose permeability improvements and seek to shut down existing access for cyclist and pedestrians, they oppose HGV management, they oppose tackling the one way streets.

In short the intent of the GCOBs proponents appears to be to make the city more dangerous and inconvenient cyclists and pedestrians rather than less.

Why would anyone expect the support of cyclists for that? Its a ludicrous idea.
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06-09-2011, 12:02   #44
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Where I'm from is of no relevance to this discussion, and is nobody else's business anyway.
Definitely not from Galway. so.
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06-09-2011, 12:03   #45
dubhthach
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See you have a proper bypass alreay, nearly Dublin M50 sized. Trust me once you sort the cause of the problem, you will see ongestion drop by half.
The M50 is 45km in lenght the GCOB is 21km's this about comparable distance between the "Mad Cow" and the N11.

What more only the section from the M6 to just after the N59 is of Motorway/Type1 dual carriagway standard. All of the route west of this point is of 2+2 standard

If you look at the distance of the "Limerick bypass" (eg. N7 from Annacotty via the tunnel to N18) it's abit short at 17.5km. Obviously Dooradoyle is outside of this ring road so the population within it not hugely different from Galway
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