[CDfm]

Funnily enough the same thing happened me years earlier -different course and it was a sociology module. There seems to be a lot of it about.

[citytillidie]

My view was expressed in the form of this post in the Discrimation thread
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showp...&postcount=232

I think feminist biased media is going to go to far and push men away.

In some cases men are punished either way. The media have gone the road of all men are evil.

Take this example A small girl wanders from a kindergarten in England; she drowns in a pond. A man-hunt looks for a van seen in the area. The man is found and cleared but is vilified for not stopping to help a wandering child. He says, “I was afraid to talk to a strange child and be accused of being a paedophile”.

This quote in bold is the media view on all men in my eyes which has been pushed on them by feminists.

Which I think also may have led to the downfall of the number of male teachers in primary schools. Men could be scared to teach at these schools as providing comfort and such could be seen as something else.

In todays world its so easy to ruin a guys life as CDfm said before a girl making false accusation against a guy and he spend time in prision for it. Even when exonerated people will think there is no smoke without a fire, because of the way men are viewed in today's media.

[CDfm]

Its hard to reconcile it. The popular mainstream feminists in education,social work and in NGOs really do have a very mono dimensional negative spin on gender and men.

Like citytillidie if I saw a kid wandering off in a shopping centre or down the street would I stop. Probably not. Is this why guys dont do school runs. Maybe. A little converstion I had with someone during the week was about telling a female colleague if her zipper was undone-apparently it can be construed as harrasment.

Lots of little things that if you reverse the genders -women would be very restricted in work. Do women doctors or nurse feel compromised when their patients are male?

Is there a genderphobia out there.

[Dr Galen]

We are meandering again people.

Seriously, threads don't exist to drop in every little anecdote or story we have. They have a purpose and a topic. Please try and stick to it. Its just not possible to have multiple conversations or what seem like randomly generated posts in a thread. It makes it very hard to read and follow.

Cheers

DrG

[CDfm]

Dr G - I agree with you mostly.

Is it a fair question to ask that given the OP was educated at a college training (primary) teachers with an obviously anti-man lecturer that gender bias exists in professional training.

Bassfish experienced bias in his professional training as a social worker

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showp...8&postcount=94

I do wonder how many other professions -medical, lawyers and police are trained this way and have others experienced it in their training.

[CDfm]

Well I am answering my own question here - on-line I found a document by Womens Aid on domestic violence training in Templemore Garda College

http://www.womensaid.ie/pages/what/r...evelopment.pdf

[iptba]

Originally Posted by CDfm

Is it a fair question to ask that given the OP was educated at a college training (primary) teachers with an obviously anti-man lecturer that gender bias exists in professional training.

Bassfish experienced bias in his professional training as a social worker

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showp...8&postcount=94

I do wonder how many other professions -medical, lawyers and police are trained this way and have others experienced it in their training.

I think if some proponents of a particular ideology can restrict courses men feel they can study*, that is in a way relevant to the subject of males and their attitudes to feminism i.e. it doesn't win it any favours with me and probably others - people might have a bit of a resentment for feminism but are not exactly sure where they picked it up. This issue isn't simply an academic discussion - it can be influencing individuals' lives. If I (or somebody else) are selecting a course, I'm looking for courses I can get a good result in it/the result my work and intelligence (for want of a better phrase!) merit and not lose out because I don't follow a particular way of thinking about the world.

* as I feel feminism (or some feminists anyway) might restrict what I might study in the future, as I mentioned in reply to another post http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=65583622&postcount=116 - I also mentioned male students dropping sociology

[goose2005]

Originally Posted by CDfm

Dr G - I agree with you mostly.

Is it a fair question to ask that given the OP was educated at a college training (primary) teachers with an obviously anti-man lecturer that gender bias exists in professional training.

Bassfish experienced bias in his professional training as a social worker

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showp...8&postcount=94

I do wonder how many other professions -medical, lawyers and police are trained this way and have others experienced it in their training.

I know that some male nurses are told to always ask female patients if they would prefer a female nurse - male patients aren't afforded the same privilege

[iptba]

Originally Posted by Bassfish

I work in predominantly female profession (Social Work) and even when i was in college training we did a module on feminist social work and me and the 3 other lads in the class were more or less told straight that we'd never ne brilliant social workers because we don't have the emotional depths of men, absolute Feminazi Crap.
-In work i have seen so many examples sexism against men. If a man gets a promotion it's because they're a man, not because of the merits of their abilities.
-I have seen good fathers stopped from seeing their children by terrible mothers because family law and the constitution gives absolutely no rights to unmarried fathers.
-The value of the more male characteristics is never recognised in Social Work whereas the value of female characteristics is espoused constantly. Men are generally that bit better at leaving their emotions out of a decision and looking at things objectively which is a crucial ability in Social Work and most of my female colleags would be the first to agree with me about that but the Feminazis would call me a hard-harted, unempathetic person for being that way because i'm a man.

One of the frustrations I have with some feminists is the logic in areas like you mention. Some of the time we are lectured that there are no differences (at this moment in time) between men and women in terms of their abilities.

Some of the time we are told that women are on average better at X or men are worse at Y.

These things are incompatible - people should stick to one line of reasoning.

Personally, I'm inclined to think there are average differences between men and women which make women on average better at some things and men on average better at others (note: this is not the same as saying any individual man or woman can't be good at it).

However, it seems unacceptable to say that men are on average better at women at things (except physical strengths) (and many feminists can argue quite vociferously about this suggestion) but it is acceptable to say that women are better than men at things, men are a greater danger to society (in particular areas) or, in the recent example, for our President to tell a meeting for the Women's Fund (what could be described as a feminist group), that testosterone (read: men) are the cause of our economic problems.

Those that are vociferous against any suggestions that men are better than women at anything have the effect that such suggestions are made less. So one ends up with a situation where women appear to be superior to men rather than simply different.

[iptba]

Originally Posted by Johnnymcg

Men who actively throughout their lives oppose patriarchy and work to further womens rights can't be?

The use of "patriarchy" in such a definite way sounds like a feminist to me all right.

[CDfm]

@johnnymcg do you mean it like in equality irrespective of gender,sexual orientation, race or religion, and more like an establishment that fraustrates those rights for individuals.

I know its semantics but this is an area where it helps to have an open mind or you get bogged down in weird theoretical arguments.

I can see where you are coming from. Maybe if debates like this were more inclusive more would be achieved.

[Zulu]

Here's a good example of where my attitude toward feminism & feminists comes from. There's a thread in the Ladies Lounge on the merits of feminism. I made the point that advertisements are equally derogatory to both sexes. The response given was:

Originally Posted by From other thread

I don't condone sexual objectification of any sex,but If you think men and women get equally objectified in the media,or indeed advertising, then I think you need to open you eyes.

Yes the stereotype of the bumbling idiot man is woefully offensive and unfair, but everyone knows its utter rubbish.

To the effect: "Derogatory advertisements toward men are aren't as bad because everyone knows it's utter rubbish."

How am I to take a feminist view point seriously if it perfectly prepared to ignore & disregard the issues other subsections of society? Isn't this exactly the thing we are thought is wrong when it's directed toward women/other races/other religions?
It's flippant attitudes like that that make me think, as a group, they're not interested in equality for anyone; their idea of equality is "women are more equal than others". I can't support that. That's not moving forwards - that's a step back to the shitty days.

I'm an egalitarian. Equality for all.

[source]

My personal views on feminism are, pretty negative. I was raised to be chivilrous towards women, i hold doors open, wait for a woman to be seated, rise when a woman leaves the table/room, walk on the outside of a foothpath when in female companu. It's the way i was brought up.

I was once seeing a girl and acted in my usual manner, which she percieved as being sexist, and went on a feminist rant about how disgraceful it was that i thought she couldn't even open a door for herself and how i was treating her like a kid and that women were stronger than men etc etc. I've had a couple of other occassions when things like this have happened with random strangers.

It's not sexist, it's polite, and mannerly.

Also i would agree with a lot of posters on this thread, it seems that feminsim is interested in equality only when tipped in its favour.

For instance, yesterday there was a piece on the last word where matt was talking to an advertising manager for hunky dory crisps who was talking about their latest advertising campaign involving scantilly clad women playing sports. He had a female frelance journalist on too, who was outraged by this, when matt asked her if she is outraged by the diet coke ads with the hunky males, of course her answer was that she wasn't as, the hunky male wasn't something that men were forced to strive towards by popular media......it's still objectifying the male body, something which she couldn't seem to fathom.

It would appear to me anyway that the popular modern feminist movement is not interested in equality, but more so in the advancement of the female sex. While there is nothing wrong with this per say. The manner by which it appears to be going about this is making enemies of men, the very men that they are trying to get to accept them into/remove from the upper echelons of government and business.

A quote from Casino Royale, which i think sums this up quite aptly.

James Bond: About you, Miss Lynd? Well, your beauty's a problem. You worry you won't be taken seriously.
Vesper Lynd: Which one can say of any attractive woman with half a brain.
James Bond: True. But this one overcompensates by wearing slightly masculine clothing. Being more aggressive than her female colleagues. Which gives her a somewhat *prickly* demeanor, and ironically enough, makes it less likely for her to be accepted and promoted by her male superiors, who mistake her insecurities for arrogance. Now, I'd have normally gone with "only child," but by the way you ignored the quip about your parents... I'm going to have to go with "orphan."

Also i don't agree that women have it hard in this country, since the foundation of the state women have had equal voting rights. The negativity towards women stemmed from the Catholic church, which discouraged contraception and expected women to sit at home shooting out babies. The church no longer has a foothold in Ireland, and as such women are now making it in business and politics, as they now have the choice. Whether they make the best of that choice is their own business, and not one of equality.

For instance, our presidents for the last 2 decades have been females, one of which became the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights o2 one of the biggest mobile phone providers in the world, has a woman, Danuta Grey as CEO of the Irish subsidiary of the company. There are many more which i cannot think of, but i believe that these example show that women in Irish society have just as much chance of making it in business and politics, despite the perceived barriers that women feel exist.

[CDfm]

Originally Posted by goose2005

I know that some male nurses are told to always ask female patients if they would prefer a female nurse - male patients aren't afforded the same privilege

I have a female GP as she was recommended to me as specialising in an illness I had. I wouldn't swap her for a guy who was just as qualified because I trust her completely.She worked in Austrailia.I will take my chances

I just wondered if any of the health professionals on here get training on guy stuff or even as Bassline said spotting situations where children are victims of women.

[stimpson]

Originally Posted by foinse

For instance, yesterday there was a piece on the last word where matt was talking to an advertising manager for hunky dory crisps who was talking about their latest advertising campaign involving scantilly clad women playing sports. He had a female frelance journalist on too, who was outraged by this, when matt asked her if she is outraged by the diet coke ads with the hunky males, of course her answer was that she wasn't as, the hunky male wasn't something that men were forced to strive towards by popular media......

The shrill neo-feminist hack was Una Mullaly. she was on Phantom yesterday afternoon with her half baked ideas. I checked out her blog last night, and what did I find 3/4 of the way down the front page? A topless picture of a 20 year old Peaches Geldof. See http://unarocks.blogspot.com/

She does the feminist cause no favours whatsoever with her ill thought out populist trite. Surely true equality is when you can have your diet coke and your Hunky Dory ads living side by side in peaceful sexy harmony. As long as it's consenting adults there should be no issue with it.