[KC61]

Originally Posted by Riskymove

but some bus routes start from there, hence they may be parked there before starting

No daytime bus routes start in D'Olier Street, only Nitelinks.

[KC61]

Originally Posted by gurramok

I concur with furtzy, some buses do rest there for long periods for whatever reason, day or night. Its a guessing game as to whether buses are going to pull out or not as they do not have their hazards on and sometimes never indicate.

The result is that 2 lanes are taken up for traffic turning left onto Dolier st which is ridiculous. (might be better now that the bus gate prevents the other lanes been used by cars!)

Buses stop in D'Olier Street to unload passengers and pick up more ones. For the Lucan Corridor routes (25/A, 26, 66/A/B and 67/A) their last set down stop is D'Olier Street, however their terminus and parking area is Pearse Street opposite the Garda Station.

As someone who travels home from D'Olier Street on a regular basis I am well acquainted with the routes stopping there, and it's true to say that the stops can be genuinely very busy with passengers getting off and on the buses.

[KC61]

Originally Posted by J_Dublin15

O'Connell Street Nortbound was pretty heavy half 5 tonight, possibly the worst I've seen it to be honest, Soutbound it was pretty good however.

The issue at D'Olier street often is a 46A goes from Mountjoy Square with pax on, the inspector there gets on and hold the bus from anywhere between 5-10 minutes on occasions.

Indeed he may but that stop is the far end of D'Olier Street and is not going to block the junction with Townsend Street as being suggested.

The issue is the number of routes servicing the stops on the street. And I've already pointed out that this is (in part) due to Dublin Bus losing many stops in other locations.

[markpb]

Originally Posted by gurramok

Just got back from Amiens st southbound(passing thru at about 5:40pm), it was blocked all the way up to the Five Lamps and passed it, first time in many months. I couldn't pinpoint why, no obvious reason.

Originally Posted by J_Dublin15

O'Connell Street Nortbound was pretty heavy half 5 tonight, possibly the worst I've seen it to be honest

U2 concert.

[J_Dublin15]

Originally Posted by markpb

U2 concert.

Yeah, of course, silly me,

[gurramok]

Originally Posted by markpb

U2 concert.

U2 concert is northbound, not southbound!!

Feck it, i'll report on whats it like tomorrow without any concert!

[Flukey]

I spoke to a 145 driver before getting off and asked how the new system had worked today, as I was only getting on at St. Stephen's Green outbound. He said there were some problems up around the taxi rank near the Gresham, that the quays were very slow and that it didn't seem to be working very well. I suppose it'll take a few days to sort it out.

As to the general situation relating to buses through the centre of the city, they could ease it a bit. There are too many using O'Connell Street. For buses that are going right across the city, they could look at a few other routes. Maybe it will have to wait until the Samuel Beckett bridge opens, but they should put some of those buses across bridges east of O'Connell Bridge. Take the likes of the 13 as an example. Couldn't it, and others, go across Butt Bridge and head up Gardiner Street and head into Dorset Street that way? It is coming in from the east side, up O'Connell Street and then back out, when a more direct route is available. It wouldn't put out passengers that actually did want to get off on O'Connell Street too much. You could even have some buses coming in from the southside, turning right just after Leeson Street Bridge and going onto Fitzwilliam Street - which strangely for such a significant street and blindingly obvious link, has no regular buses - right down to Merrion Square and doing something similar to cross the Liffey over the the Butt or Becket Bridge. The likes of the 11 would be a good candidate for that, as it is heading towards Dorset Street too. Again it wouldn't discommode those heading for the centre of the city too much. It could work for Airport buses too. Ideally you'd want the 16A and 746 going through the very centre of the city, but you would still have them close to the centre and they'd be passing Busaras and Connolly Station, so they could cross the Liffey east of O'Connell Bridge too. It would be easy for the 746, as it could just turn down towards Fitzwilliam Street after coming over Leeson Street Bridge. The 16 and 16A would take a bit more work, but you could find a good route, maybe along the canal or across Hatch Street, for it to get it to cross over the Butt or Beckett Bridge. You could at least have some of their buses or variations doing that, if not every 11A/B, 13/A, 16/A and 746.

It is not ideal for those that wanted to go to the centre of the city, as it is a bit far from the centre, but if they got rid of that ridiculous toll on the East Link, that could open up a whole new corridor for cross city bus routes. Looking westward, there could be opportunities for some routes to similarly avoid the city centre, using Church Street, Bolton Street and onto the Dorset Street or up through Phibsboro and on to the northern suburbs. In conclusion, maybe it is all waiting on the Beckett Bridge, but there are plenty of options for buses to cross the Liffey at points other than O'Connell Bridge, without putting passengers out too much.

[sdeire]

Originally Posted by faceman

There should be no bus terminus in the city centre whatsoever. It makes no sense.

With the exception of Nitelink I agree completely. Amalgamate city centre to Northside routes with matching city to Southside routes - eg

41 and 46A - Dun Laoghaire to Swords

etc.

The result will probably be a slight net gain on drivers and buses, and with any luck you wont need to pay 4.40 for the whole trip but maybe 3-4. I still maintain the best way to control traffic in Dublin is toll heavily those that make journeys in BOTH rush hours during the day; this allows for people who need to bring their car in for use during the day where the office is a base or whatever.

Unfortunately this would be unfair until capacity on the DART and LUAS is increased significantly.

[Cool Mo D]

The problem with that idea is that it will be very difficult to set accurate departure times from the city centre, because that would be the middle of the route. It's a great idea for all high frequency routes you don't need a timetable for though - every 15 minutes or more say. The less regular long distance services could then terminate at a few termini - Ringsend, Broadstone, Summerhill, maybe around Connolly, or Parnell Square.

I think that there should be two main types of Dublin Bus services - frequent QBC services that only run the length of one QBC, then through town, and out another one, every 10 minutes or more. No detours through housing estates, no route variations - simple high frequency services.

These could be supplemented by long distance rapid-type services (long distance = outside the M50, Swords, Blanch, Lucan, Clondalkin, North Wicklow, and past the end of a QBC) The long distance services would stop far out, then run onto a QBC, make one stop at the start before running mostly non-stop into a city terminus. Local and suburb to suburb services would fill in the gaps for areas not near a QBC, or for Dublin bus travel not involving the city centre.

Also, while I'm dreaming, Dublin Bus would put a single map on their website showing all the routes of all frequent services across the capital, preferably with stops/stages also marked.

[faceman]

Originally Posted by sdonn

With the exception of Nitelink I agree completely. Amalgamate city centre to Northside routes with matching city to Southside routes - eg

41 and 46A - Dun Laoghaire to Swords

etc.

The result will probably be a slight net gain on drivers and buses, and with any luck you wont need to pay 4.40 for the whole trip but maybe 3-4. I still maintain the best way to control traffic in Dublin is toll heavily those that make journeys in BOTH rush hours during the day; this allows for people who need to bring their car in for use during the day where the office is a base or whatever.

Unfortunately this would be unfair until capacity on the DART and LUAS is increased significantly.

I completely agree. How is it the powers that be in Dublin Bus and DCC dont get this?

Probably because they dont need to get the bus to work.

They also need to stop sending so many buses up Dame St. Many of the routes travel up there needlessly.

If you ask me, the issue with traffic on Dame St/College Green is in some part the fault of Dublin Bus and DCC.

[cast_iron]

40 mins to get off N4 Chapelizod bypass inbound to roundabout at Kilmainham.

I (used to) do this in 90 seconds every day.

No apparent reason except for the quays being backed up - now that a huge amount of College Green traffice has to divert via the quays.

[Stark]

There was also a little matter of a U2 concert. I believe most of the concert traffic was directed down the N4 towards town.

[Maldini2706]

It's not a case of being directed, most people just take that route. Any time there's anything on in Croke Park the North Quays and St. Johns Rd get jammed. It even happens for some of the o2 gigs and that's "only" 9-14,000 there were 80,000 in Croker!

[Stark]

Well there were signs up at the Red Cow saying "Concert traffic take M50 north". Not if there were further signs asking people to get off the M50 at the N4. They could have done with more Gardaí on duty but they all seemed to be busy at the non-event at IKEA!

[KC61]

Originally Posted by sdonn

With the exception of Nitelink I agree completely. Amalgamate city centre to Northside routes with matching city to Southside routes - eg

41 and 46A - Dun Laoghaire to Swords

etc.

The result will probably be a slight net gain on drivers and buses, and with any luck you wont need to pay 4.40 for the whole trip but maybe 3-4. I still maintain the best way to control traffic in Dublin is toll heavily those that make journeys in BOTH rush hours during the day; this allows for people who need to bring their car in for use during the day where the office is a base or whatever.

Unfortunately this would be unfair until capacity on the DART and LUAS is increased significantly.

The real problem with that sort of idea is that it can lead to serious reliability issues with the service. Merging the 41 and 46A would create a route that would be far too long, could have serious problems with reliability and would of course have more driver changes en route, which is another factor that passengers frequently complain about.

If you used a Travel 90 Ten Journey smart card for that trip the fare is already only EUR 1.80 per trip - not EUR 4.40.

Originally Posted by Cool Mo D

The problem with that idea is that it will be very difficult to set accurate departure times from the city centre, because that would be the middle of the route. It's a great idea for all high frequency routes you don't need a timetable for though - every 15 minutes or more say. The less regular long distance services could then terminate at a few termini - Ringsend, Broadstone, Summerhill, maybe around Connolly, or Parnell Square.

I think that there should be two main types of Dublin Bus services - frequent QBC services that only run the length of one QBC, then through town, and out another one, every 10 minutes or more. No detours through housing estates, no route variations - simple high frequency services.

These could be supplemented by long distance rapid-type services (long distance = outside the M50, Swords, Blanch, Lucan, Clondalkin, North Wicklow, and past the end of a QBC) The long distance services would stop far out, then run onto a QBC, make one stop at the start before running mostly non-stop into a city terminus. Local and suburb to suburb services would fill in the gaps for areas not near a QBC, or for Dublin bus travel not involving the city centre.

Also, while I'm dreaming, Dublin Bus would put a single map on their website showing all the routes of all frequent services across the capital, preferably with stops/stages also marked.

The whole rationale for city centre termini is to try to provide a reliable service. Cross-city routes tend to be the ones that get hit the most by major traffic snarl-ups. Having city termini enables buses to turn around and keep a reliable and predictable service operating all day. Long distance cross-city routes do not tend to work and it becomes increasingly impossible to predict when a bus will show up the further you are along the route, e.g. trying to predict when a 16A will arrive southbound in Terenure at rush hour using the departure times from the Airport is like searching for a needle in a haystack.

There is already a precedent for the sort of services that you suggest - the 128, 140, 145, 151, all operate directly along the QBC and continue a short distance through the city centre, but again there are limits as to amount of locations that buses can terminate at. Remember that already, Dublin Bus has lost a significant number of city termini:

- Middle Abbey Street
- Lower Abbey Street (South Side)
- D'Olier Street
- College Street
- Burgh Quay
- Wellington Quay
- Fleet Street

If the LUAS link up takes place they will lose Marlborough Street as well. There are serious problems with this. The garages at Summerhill and Ringsend are limited in terms of space, and as such are probably at capacity as it is in terms of terminating routes (46A Group/63/145 at Summerhill and 50/56A/77/77A at Ringsend).

I suspect that when the Beckett Bridge opens there may be scope for some routes that currently terminate in the city centre area to be extended to the Docklands.

Posters ask why so many buses serve O'Connell Street. The answer is simple. That is where people want to go. That area is where more people get on/off buses. Buses operating via Gardiner Street were re-routed via O'Connell Street because people asked Dublin Bus to do it.

The network review following the Deloitte report should see a redesigned network take shape with a core product of direct routes along the QBCs continuing a short distance across the city, supplemented by other routes that service the areas along each QBC.

Dublin Bus is in the process of developing spider maps for the network, similar to those used in London, the first high profile version being the one used in the City Centre fare leaflet. I would imagine these will be rolled out as the network is redesigned over the next 18 months.