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"The Origin of Specious Nonsense"

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭mohawk


    At first I was shocked that the minister for science would go to a book launch for an anti-evolution book but, then I thought this is Ireland of course the minister for science would go to such a book launch.
    :mad::(:eek:


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,553 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dades


    amacachi wrote: »
    I'm really confused and don't want to ask the obvious question for fear of ruining the thread. :pac:
    Has anyone read the book? :p


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,611 ✭✭✭✭Sam Vimes


    Dades wrote: »
    Has anyone read the book? :p

    I read this in the synopsis:

    "These men appear to be intelligent good people who have sacrificed reason on the alter of , Chance , Mutations, Randomness which is a concoction for chaos. (I have read their excellent books)"

    In order to attack evolution people almost always do one of two things: Ignore mutation and say that nothing new can be created or more commonly ignore natural selection and say that evolution is nothing but chance. This guy has done the latter


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,905 ✭✭✭✭Handsome Bob


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Email sent. Had to reign in on the bad language....

    Very diplomatic, you also avoided any cheap shots, very classy indeed good sir. :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    I'm in two minds over this. On the one hand having the minister of science promote horse **** is just about what any minister does. The problem is that this particular horse **** is extremely dishonest and misrepresentative of actual scientific observations and facts.

    On the other hand there is obvious fact that this is what the creationist nutters want. They want there to be an outcry. Nothing will spark them more publicity, look what a tiny insignificant little church in Florida managed to accomplish last week. If we cause an uproar over this book we are doing the creationists more of a favour. The general public does not understand, indeed absurdly, many of them fear science. Creationist logic is pathetic, but it appeals to everyday lay peoples intuition and preys on it. The public see one guy in a labcoat (or Dr in his title) say something and another person opposes it. Letting the controversial opinion be taught in our schools suddenly becomes fair.

    Guys, I think we should ignore this, yes it is disgusting, but sometimes doing the thing that seems so glaringly obviously correct can in hindsight turn out to be glaring obviously wrong. Ignore it, the last thing we want is lay people hearing creationist lies, if this topic becomes media attention you can bet your arse that in a 30 second snippet it will be impossible to explain to the public how creationism is utterly wrong without appearing dismissive or arrogant - something that does not do you favours. Resist the urge of your instincts to show how appalled you are, and simply let this flow by with no notice given.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 ✭✭✭✭Zombrex


    Dades wrote: »
    Has anyone read the book? :p

    I've watched the Youtube videos. His argument against us descending from apes is "Have you ever tried living in a tree?" and his argument against us descending from the ocenas is "Sit in a bath for a few hours"

    This guys seems as nuts as the "Bananas: The Atheist Nightmare" guys


  • Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,195 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    Sent my own email there, debating isn't my strong point but it's the point that counts
    Dear Conor,

    It has come to my attention that you, our Minister for Science are helping to launch the anti-evolution book "The Origin of Specious Nonsense" . This strikes me as some sort of bad joke and I cannot overstate my anger, as a student of science myself. This book has no basis in science and at the very best should be ignored. Instead we see you appearing to endorse it, which is a shocking display from a man in your position. I find myself embaressed that our government is backing such nonsense.

    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,981 ✭✭✭monosharp


    Wicknight wrote: »
    I've watched the Youtube videos.

    linky ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,611 ✭✭✭✭Sam Vimes




  • Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭Cuddlytroll


    Malty_T wrote: »
    I'm in two minds over this. On the one hand having the minister of science promote horse **** is just about what any minister does. The problem is that this particular horse **** is extremely dishonest and misrepresentative of actual scientific observations and facts.

    On the other hand there is obvious fact that this is what the creationist nutters want. They want there to be an outcry. Nothing will spark them more publicity, look what a tiny insignificant little church in Florida managed to accomplish last week. If we cause an uproar over this book we are doing the creationists more of a favour. The general public does not understand, indeed absurdly, many of them fear science. Creationist logic is pathetic, but it appeals to everyday lay peoples intuition and preys on it. The public see one guy in a labcoat (or Dr in his title) say something and another person opposes it. Letting the controversial opinion be taught in our schools suddenly becomes fair.

    Guys, I think we should ignore this, yes it is disgusting, but sometimes doing the thing that seems so glaringly obviously correct can in hindsight turn out to be glaring obviously wrong. Ignore it, the last thing we want is lay people hearing creationist lies, if this topic becomes media attention you can bet your arse that in a 30 second snippet it will be impossible to explain to the public how creationism is utterly wrong without appearing dismissive or arrogant - something that does not do you favours. Resist the urge of your instincts to show how appalled you are, and simply let this flow by with no notice given.
    While I fully agree with your assessment of the fundamentalist creationists, the fact of the matter is our elected representative is giving credence to the book by attending the launch in his capacity as Minister for Science. People all over Europe could open a newspaper to see that Ireland let elected a man to that position who publicly declares his bat**** crazy rejection of fundamental scientific theory. In the current economic climate, it is massively detracting from our nation's credibility (whatever is left) and so the sensible option would have to be to oppose his attendance.

    Having said that, a part of me does want him to go, just so that FF's reputation will be dragged through the mud some more.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Make it big, sing it loud and sing it long.

    Toot on Creationists, you fuppin' lunatics, toot on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    While I fully agree with your assessment of the fundamentalist creationists, the fact of the matter is our elected representative is giving credence to the book by attending the launch in his capacity as Minister for Finance. People all over Europe could open a newspaper to see that Ireland let elected a man to that position who publicly declares his bat**** crazy rejection of fundamental scientific theory. In the current economic climate, it is massively detracting from our nation's credibility (whatever is left) and so the sensible option would have to be to oppose his attendance.

    Having said that, a part of me does want him to go, just so that FF's reputation will be dragged through the mud some more.

    Europe, won't read it in their papers unless it becomes a BIG story.;) With regard to Europe judging us on this because of our minister of Science apparently supporting Pseudo Science that won't even cause them a shudder. Many prominent ministers in Europe already support pseudo science. When I said public, I should have said human population, most people simply do not understand science and distrust it. In fact, Ireland is the country in Europe with the biggest amount of trust in science.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,517 ✭✭✭axer


    Sent in my complaint earlier on too.
    me wrote:
    Hi,

    I cannot believe that the Minister responsible for Science in this country
    is helping to promote a book that goes against the very nature of science.

    This is an absolute joke and makes a mokery of the Ministerial position.
    What type of message is this sending out?


    Regards,
    xxx

    Got back the standard:
    I wish to acknowledge receipt of your recent email to Minister Conor
    Lenihan.

    I will bring it to the Ministers attention at the earliest opportunity.

    I didnt want to contact the media because this eejit (the author) will end up getting free publicity instead.


  • Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,195 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 223 ✭✭davef1000


    Email'd:

    "Dear Mr. Lenihan,

    Can you please explain why, as Irish Minister of State with special responsibility for Science, Technology, Innovation and Natural Resources, you will be attending, and indeed officiating at, the launch of a book which aims to call into question the Theory of Evolution (The Origin Of Specious Nonsense by John J. May)?

    Your appearance at this event will lend credence to this man's delusions, and to his anti-intellectual book. It will also bring further disrepute upon this Government (and it isn't as though you haven't enough of that to go around already...).

    Do you even know anything about evolution? You do, after all, have 'special responsibility' for Science.

    Please reconsider this decision. Or at least read up a bit on why this man's book is errant nonsense. I suggest Charles Darwin's On The Origin Of Species as a good place to start.

    Yours sincerely..."

    How stupid(er) can this gov't get?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,353 ✭✭✭Goduznt Xzst


    Perhaps the author titled the book not to describe what he would discuss within its pages but rather he feels the book itself is the origin of Specious Nonsense.

    I'd tend to believe the latter.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 334 ✭✭Nemi


    davef1000 wrote: »
    How stupid(er) can this gov't get?
    Hmm. Almost a year ago to the day.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/coughlans-no-einstein-after-gaffe-at-smart-economy-launch-1890227.html

    Friday September 18 2009

    THE TANAISTE lived up to her 'Calamity Coughlan' nickname yesterday. The gaffe-prone minister was left red-faced after she erroneously referred to the theory of evolution as having been formulated by Einstein. To make matters worse, the Enterprise, Trade and Employment Minister had just mentioned the Government's strategy of Building Ireland's Smart Economy.

    Speaking without notes to an invited audience of entrepreneurs to promote IDA Ireland's "aggressive" new campaign to market Ireland aboard, Ms Coughlan touched on the idea of the survival of the fittest. She said the IDA would be marketing Ireland as the innovation island -- "like Einstein explaining his theory of evolution".


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Email sent. Had to reign in on the bad language....

    Is "the bad language" a place in which you can reign? :pac:

    All this nonsense is appalling but sad to say I'm not entirely surprised...


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,739 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    not sure when, but the posters been change "TD Minister of Science" isn't beside his name in the poster on his site http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67983608&postcount=15

    versus http://www.theoriginofspeciousnonsense.com/images/launch%20pic.jpg

    axer you took that screengrab just today?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,436 ✭✭✭c_man


    Email sent. Kept it decent. Well mostly.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,223 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    not sure when, but the posters been change "TD Minister of Science" isn't beside his name in the poster on his site http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=67983608&postcount=15

    versus http://www.theoriginofspeciousnonsense.com/images/launch%20pic.jpg

    Actually it seem to flash on and off again on the main page.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Oh good God, it's been picked up by pharyngula.

    And of course good old Mr Nugent is on the case.

    I can't wait for Lenihan's assistant to show him his inbox tomorrow morning.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,314 ✭✭✭sink


    Whatever merit the idea of keeping this contained had is now purely academic. PZ Myers picked it up on his latest Pharyngula blog post. The Irish Times and The Irish Independent are going to be inundated with letters.

    http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2010/09/how_about_the_irish_minister_o.php

    edit:- doh pipped to the post by Zillah


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Can't touch this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,739 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    King Mob wrote: »
    Actually it seem to flash on and off again on the main page.

    no the only difference between the two images is the 10,000 euros bit, maybe that was your cache refresh, axer you didn't alter anything else apart from the red mark, did you? obviously he's been asked to remove those bits to try and keep up the pretense that he wasn't asked to speak because he's the minister for science, thats he's just a friend.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    Have a feeling he'll pull out. This is actually worse then Nelson McCausland and the museum


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,371 ✭✭✭✭Zillah


    Have a feeling he'll pull out.

    I think so too. I bet he had no idea how much of a furore this would kick off. As our very own DeVore once said, we're angry nerds, and there are *millions* of us.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,247 ✭✭✭stevejazzx


    Anyone got Ennio Morricones (agents) email address? There's no way this f**cker has paid a royalty/gotten permission to use that music on his (appaling) site.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,815 ✭✭✭stimpson


    I don't see the point of emailing Kebabs Lenihan. He's not answerable to you:

    http://www.yourtechstuff.com/techwire/2009/04/index.html


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,247 ✭✭✭stevejazzx


    eeeeejit wrote:
    5: It is a toxic poisonous mind virus which destroys the hearts immune system against hope and common sense.

    :eek:

    He must be talking about either himself or religion.....surely.....?


This discussion has been closed.
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