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Dublin Metrolink (just Metrolink posts here -see post #1 )

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,059 ✭✭✭xper


    Think I'll wait there is a TBM in full swing before worrying about the service branding.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    In London you have :- London Transport and Underground. Both of these names are iconic. Privatisation of the rail services have diluted the name :- British Rail.

    Been replaced by TFL nearly 20 years ago


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    The branding is largely unimportant at this point, except for one minor thing that I've brought up in this thread before: if this project is called Metro North, it will have a lower chance of completing than if it is called Dublin Metro, or Metro North and Metro South. That southside sway is somewhat vital, I think.

    That said, I do think Metro North as an idea in the public consciousness is actually reaching a rather healthy state - the government are talking about it as a remedy for the housing crisis, which I think will appeal to many. The media seem to be largely buying into this narrative too (I'm calling it a narrative, but it's actually accurate - Metro North will be provide a fairly large relief in terms of housing, but it's so fúcking far away timewise) which is another vital aspect for selling it to voters (who ultimately don't need to be convinced, but if voters want it, opposition parties won't want to object, and it'll become much more secure in terms of expenditure).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    bk wrote: »
    MARTA in Atlanta (train + bus), Metro in LA (bus, light rail, subway), just some examples.

    I'm not saying we need to do the same here, but it certainly isn't unusual. What is important though is seamless integration between different modes of transport.

    I don't think change the name to just one would fix Dublins issues, but I do think it shows how siloed public transport is in Dublin and how badly integrated it is.

    Taking MARTA in Atlanta as an example is a real eye opener. Travel on the train similar to the DART into a station there, only to see a queue of buses waiting there to meet the train and continue your journey in the suburbs all on one ticket.

    Do you think IE would agree to that? Passenger railways in America are rare outside the big cities and all Amtrak services bar a few in the North East are ran on freight company owned track. A company like MARTA would own their own dedicated track free of Intercity, Commuter and freight trains similar to a metro/subway system.

    What I would suggest a model more similar to the German model and I would market the DART system similar to an S-Bahn which are generally overground and go further out to further out than an U-Bahn which would be more similar to what our proposed metro would be. Buses, trams and U-Bahn would be generally marketed under the one company and the S-Bahn operated by Deutche Bahn which as you will probably know as the German IE.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,055 ✭✭✭✭Tusky


    MJohnston wrote: »
    The branding is largely unimportant at this point, except for one minor thing that I've brought up in this thread before: if this project is called Metro North, it will have a lower chance of completing than if it is called Dublin Metro, or Metro North and Metro South. That southside sway is somewhat vital, I think.

    It will be renamed Dublin Metro on Friday. Watch this space.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,460 ✭✭✭✭MJohnston


    Tusky wrote: »
    It will be renamed Dublin Metro on Friday. Watch this space.

    Yeah I've heard that elsewhere - but also it seemed like they were heading that way when they registered the brand last year.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    DWHa5Q-WAAEGDgS.jpg

    Today's Irish Times. Metro North no more as expected, it's now Dublin Metro.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2018/0216/941116-govt-project-2040-plan/

    RTE saying that €3bn will be spent on the Metro project, which is quite significant compared to the 2.4bn cost mooted in 2015


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    Whatever about the Government's rebranding, I don't think that renaming this thread is such a good idea.

    At least 95% of this thread has been about the proposed metro line between the city centre and is Swords, via the airport.

    Yet there still much to be discussed about other potential metro projects, like the continuation of the first line (if it happens), and possible other metro lines. If Dublin builds the first stage it is unlikely that it is going to stop there and it will become like many other cities, with a second metro line and possibly a third.

    I think this thread should remain the place solely for discussion of the city-Swords metro section.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    marno21 wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2018/0216/941116-govt-project-2040-plan/

    RTE saying that €3bn will be spent on the Metro project, which is quite significant compared to the 2.4bn cost mooted in 2015

    That's barely ahead of inflation.


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  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Inflation is effectively zero and has been for a decade...


  • Registered Users Posts: 18 cojamocork


    Seeing report of the Metro being extended South to Sandyford. Does this mean it'll take over the Luas Green Line out from town? Wondering where that leaves Bride's Glen services - will they just terminate at Sandyford? Will the Luas to Cabra start out on a limb in Charlemont?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭Brian CivilEng


    L1011 wrote: »
    Inflation is effectively zero and has been for a decade...

    Not true for construction inflation.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,398 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    Linking with DART on the southside is interesting. Is that suggesting a Tara Street stop?


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Peregrine wrote: »
    Linking with DART on the southside is interesting. Is that suggesting a Tara Street stop?

    Surely extension to Bray in the mix as well.

    The route I saw last summer as put up here had a Tara and SSG East link.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    cojamocork wrote: »
    Seeing report of the Metro being extended South to Sandyford. Does this mean it'll take over the Luas Green Line out from town? Wondering where that leaves Bride's Glen services - will they just terminate at Sandyford? Will the Luas to Cabra start out on a limb in Charlemont?

    This is a very good example of why, in my opinion, this board should not be renamed.

    There is no consensus that Dublin should have a metro, but there does seem to be a consensus that if Dublin is indeed to have a metro, then the Swords/Airport/City axis is a good place to start.

    Almost all of this thread has been about a metro line along such a route. I believe this thread should be preserved for discussion of that axis.

    There will, presumably, be other stuff, later, about extensions to that proposed line, and other possible lines. In my opinion, they deserve their own threads.

    You probably wouldn't, for example, expect to see a discussion on a British board about 'The London Underground' or a German board about 'The Berlin U-Bahn system', dealing with specific issues relating to particular lines.

    Dublin, Ireland, and specifically boards.ie, should be no different.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,721 ✭✭✭Phil.x


    cojamocork wrote: »
    Seeing report of the Metro being extended South to Sandyford. Does this mean it'll take over the Luas Green Line out from town? Wondering where that leaves Bride's Glen services - will they just terminate at Sandyford? Will the Luas to Cabra start out on a limb in Charlemont?

    It's great to have those options.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,921 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    This is a very good example of why, in my opinion, this board should not be renamed.

    There is no consensus that Dublin should have a metro, but there does seem to be a consensus that if Dublin is indeed to have a metro, then the Swords/Airport/City axis is a good place to start.

    Almost all of this thread has been about a metro line along such a route. I believe this thread should be preserved for discussion of that axis.

    There will, presumably, be other stuff, later, about extensions to that proposed line, and other possible lines. In my opinion, they deserve their own threads.

    You probably wouldn't, for example, expect to see a discussion on a British board about 'The London Underground' or a German board about 'The Berlin U-Bahn system', dealing with specific issues relating to particular lines.

    Dublin, Ireland, and specifically boards.ie, should be no different.

    What consensus are you on about?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,099 ✭✭✭plodder


    If the Metro is now to be the jewel in the crown of public transport for Dublin, then I hope that Dart Underground doesn't get forgotten completely. In particular, they need to allow for it when building the Metro station at St Stephen's Green.


  • Registered Users Posts: 120 ✭✭fionnsci


    To be clear, are we expecting a route announcement along with this development plan today?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭Stephen15


    Are they actually going to build this or what. To be honest with you I won't believe it's happening until the day there is a TBM in place.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,819 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    Stephen15 wrote: »
    Are they actually going to build this or what. To be honest with you I won't believe it's happening until the day there is a TBM in place.

    It’s getting to the stage where they can’t not build it.....


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    Zebra3 wrote: »
    It’s getting to the stage where they can’t not build it.....

    I'm in favour of this proposed metro between Swords and the city, but there are many steps before it is delivered. I'm suspicious of these big plans.

    We had Martin Cullen's plan in Dublin Castle in 2005, almost none of which has been built.

    And we had the Dublin Transportation Office's join-the-dots-with-the-DTO's-crayons plan around 2000, which would have seen almost every nook and cranny of the city served by a LUAS or metro by 2016. Repeat, 2016. None of that built either. What was particularly galling about that one was that that organisation was specifically tasked with coming up with a realistic plan for the city for the next 15-20 years.

    Needless to say, the DTO staff are now retired on fat pensions, in the NTA - with fat pensions to come - or back in the Department of Transport, with fat pensions ahead, all having achieved nothing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,218 ✭✭✭markpb


    Needless to say, the DTO staff are now retired on fat pensions, in the NTA - with fat pensions to come - or back in the Department of Transport, with fat pensions ahead, all having achieved nothing.

    To be fair to those people, there's not much they can do in the face of persistent political indifference.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭strassenwo!f


    markpb wrote: »
    To be fair to those people, there's not much they can do in the face of persistent political indifference.

    Yes, you are quite right.

    The staff of the DTO should not have been put in a position where they had to come up with an impossible task, to basically create a comprehensive rail-based transport network in 15 years, and to implement that plan, something that Munich, perhaps the richest city in Europe, has taken around 40 years to do.

    It is very much for this reason that I think we should keep this thread for discussion of the City-Airport-Swords line. Baby steps.

    Later stuff should be discussed in another thread, or other threads. Lumping discussion of what might happen to the City/Airport/Swords in with other proposals would dilute what has already been written about that route.

    I, for example, think it would be a very serious error to continue it to Bride's Glen, but I don't think this thread should be cluttered up with my views. But where should I put them?


  • Registered Users Posts: 207 ✭✭madbeanman


    Yes, you are quite right.

    The staff of the DTO should not have been put in a position where they had to come up with an impossible task, to basically create a comprehensive rail-based transport network in 15 years, and to implement that plan, something that Munich, perhaps the richest city in Europe, has taken around 40 years to do.

    It is very much for this reason that I think we should keep this thread for discussion of the City-Airport-Swords line. Baby steps.

    Later stuff should be discussed in another thread, or other threads. Lumping discussion of what might happen to the City/Airport/Swords in with other proposals would dilute what has already been written about that route.

    I, for example, think it would be a very serious error to continue it to Bride's Glen, but I don't think this thread should be cluttered up with my views. But where should I put them?

    I think you may be somewhat jumping the gun. Let's wait for what is announced and then discuss what is appropriate for what thread.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    marno21 wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2018/0216/941116-govt-project-2040-plan/

    RTE saying that €3bn will be spent on the Metro project, which is quite significant compared to the 2.4bn cost mooted in 2015

    I assume that includes tying into the Green Line and upgrading it to Metro standard. 600 million to likely triple the capacity of the Green line, open up space and capacity for 10's of thousands of new apartments along the line, plus a bit for inflation too, seems like good value to me.

    Also I saw mention in one of the report of 4 new Luas lines, but no details! I assume extensions, but would be interesting to see more.


  • Registered Users Posts: 120 ✭✭fionnsci


    bk wrote: »
    I assume that includes tying into the Green Line and upgrading it to Metro standard. 600 million to likely triple the capacity of the Green line, open up space and capacity for 10's of thousands of new apartments along the line, plus a bit for inflation too, seems like good value to me.

    Also I saw mention in one of the report of 4 new Luas lines, but no details! I assume extensions, but would be interesting to see more.

    The 4 "new lines" were Lucan, Finglas, Bray and Poolbeg. I read it in one of the news reports this morning.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,142 ✭✭✭Middle Man


    bk wrote: »
    I assume that includes tying into the Green Line and upgrading it to Metro standard. 600 million to likely triple the capacity of the Green line, open up space and capacity for 10's of thousands of new apartments along the line, plus a bit for inflation too, seems like good value to me.

    Also I saw mention in one of the report of 4 new Luas lines, but no details! I assume extensions, but would be interesting to see more.
    ...and the metro line platforms must be at least 90m in length. 60m is laughable - sure the Luas is nearly that!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,247 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    So presumably Lucan is a branch somewhere off the red, poolbeg is an extension of the red underneath the Liffey I would hope, finglas an extension of the green line extension to cabra and bray an extension of the green line


This discussion has been closed.
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