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Separate uniforms for GR.. Yes/No....

245

Comments

  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    Yes I am, I don't go around blowing ****e about it like you do with your 4 hours a week with little powers or responsibility. It's the likes of you who have turned me fully against the reserve. There are good reserves out there who get on with their role and don't act as if they are full time or know it all and I'll work with them any day of the week, but I refuse to go out on the street with likes of you because your arrogant and a liability.

    Dont believe a word of it,. Four months ago you posted a question " what rank are you in the reserve" . Does that seem like a question a full time member would post. Dont think so..,,,.,.As for refusing to go out with a reserve. well as you are not a full time member dont think that will be a problem


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    Dont believe a word of it,. Four months ago you posted a question " what rank are you in the reserve" . Does that seem like a question a full time member would post. Dont think so..,,,.,.As for refusing to go out with a reserve. well as you are not a full time member dont think that will be a problem

    I was taking the piss out of you commissioner raider 190, ;) I won't work with people who are a liability


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    I was taking the piss out of you commissioner raider 190, ;) I won't work with people who are a liability

    Of course you were. I believe you


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    Of course you were. I believe you

    That makes my day!


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    That makes my day!

    Glad to spread some happiness as I go along my way. Now let discuss the original topic


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  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    Glad to spread some happiness as I go along my way. Now let discuss the original topic

    Ya, reserves should wear seperate uniforms so that the public can tell who the professional is if they want to be dealt with by the professional.


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    Ya, reserves should wear seperate uniforms so that the public can tell who the professional is if they want to be dealt with by the professional.

    Has it been an issue in the past. By saying this you are implying that GRS are not professional in their duties. Most reserves dealing with the public have a very clear understanding of what they can deal with and what they cannot. In this situation they would redirect the member of the public to a full time member. Do the reserves which are professional in their full time jobs leave their tprofessionalism at the door of the station when they go on duty I think not


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    Has it been an issue in the past. By saying this you are implying that GRS are not professional in their duties. Most reserves dealing with the public have a very clear understanding of what they can deal with and what they cannot. In this situation they would redirect the member of the public to a full time member. Do the reserves which are professional in their full time jobs leave their professionalism at the door if the station when they go on duty I think not

    You are not a professional police officer unless you are full time. Being a professional in another job means you are professional in that job. You can still be helpful and effective but you are not a professional and the public have a right to know, I know many reserves who don't want the public to know they are reserves and pretend they are fulltime, many who forget! to wear epaulettes. Yes they should wear a seperate uniform but like I said before if the government could use cardboard cut outs they would.


  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    You are not a professional police officer unless you are full time. Being a professional in another job means you are professional in that job. You can still be helpful and effective but you are not a professional and the public have a right to know, I know many reserves who don't want the public to know they are reserves and pretend they are fulltime, many who forget! to wear epaulettes. Yes they should wear a seperate uniform but like I said before if the government could use cardboard cut outs they would.

    For myself professionalism is applied to whatever endeavour you undertake. If GRS are been allowed to operate without their shoulder numbers then this should be addressed. Have never come across it myself. Our sarge would not allow it. As for uniforms can't see it happening and lets face it AGS need to address a number of more serious issues relating to full time members


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    For myself professionalism is applied to whatever endeavour you undertake. If GRS are been allowed to operate without their shoulder numbers then this should be addressed. Have never come across it myself. Our sarge would not allow it. As for uniforms can't see it happening and lets face it AGS need to address a number of more serious issues relating to full time members

    All issues need to be addressed including this one, the fact that AGSI have raised it as managers and it was unanimously passed means that it should be given serious consideration by the government. They just want the optics and don't want the public to know the reality on the ground


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  • Site Banned Posts: 819 ✭✭✭Raider190


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    All issues need to be addressed including this one, the fact that AGSI have raised it as managers and it was unanimously passed means that it should be given serious consideration by the government. They just want the optics and don't want the public to know the reality on the ground
    And how many AGSI and GRA motions fund their way to operations very very few. So in my humble opinion it will never happen so us lowley reserves will carry on doing our duties to the
    Best of our abilities


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Raider190 wrote: »
    And how many AGSI and GRA motions fund their way to operations very very few. So in my humble opinion it will never happen so us lowley reserves will carry on doing our duties to the
    Best of our abilities

    Maybe if more did we wouldn't have many if these outstanding issues!


  • Registered Users Posts: 383 ✭✭bluetop


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    Ya, reserves should wear seperate uniforms so that the public can tell who the professional is if they want to be dealt with by the professional.

    That is a ridiculous post to put up about any group, remember one thing all reserve members regardless of them being PT or unpaid are members of AGS as that is what it states on the ID card, and at all times operate to the best of their abilities in a very professional manner with the tools they have been given it is "not" the fault of the reserve force for the lack of powers they have, but to call them unprofessional is a disgrace to 1400 people who have volunteered their time freely, have you ever dealt with a reserve garda that was unprofessional or even spoke to one, maybe you would have a different opinion of them.

    A lot of FT members have a very high opinion of PT members yes you will get fools in every walk of life regardless of what employment they are in, but to call people unprofessional is totally out of order. I am wondering if you are or applied to be a reserve if not you have no incite into the workings of AGS, so you are unqualified to make remarks on the subject.


  • Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭timwynne


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    Ya, reserves should wear seperate uniforms so that the public can tell who the professional is if they want to be dealt with by the professional.

    is this a question of professionalism or rank recognition? because professionalism is a state of mind

    all ranks are differentiated in AGS so that you may recognise the role they play

    sgt - chevrons
    cig - red gold bar
    super- red gold bar and red pip

    so on and so on

    Reserve Gardai have a big GR on their shoulders so they are easily identified


    Our organisation wears a UNIFORM and everyone is UNIFORMED

    if a member of the public seeks help that a GR cannot provide well then the fulltimer at his/her side can deal with it

    a different uniform is rediculous. if anything it would prob attract more queries to the GR as he would be different to everyone and therefore seen as special!! such is the mindset of joepublic


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,778 ✭✭✭WilcoOut


    Ill wear a pink uniform if they want - ill still be as professional as any man and plenty of mules wouldnt know the meaning of the word

    bring it on I say - GRs are not afraid of change


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,223 ✭✭✭Canyon86


    Would the gougers / crims on the street target the GR more if the uniforms were different ?

    As they know they are different from their FT colleagues etc

    Just a thought I have


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,572 ✭✭✭msg11


    Canyon86 wrote: »
    Would the gougers / crims on the street target the GR more if the uniforms were different ?

    As they know they are different from their FT colleagues etc

    Just a thought I have

    They wouldn't target us, they would just tell us to **** off, what can you do all the usual you would expect. Which I could see causing tension with some Reserves as they might not know what to do or could say something and that may cause a normal situation to escalate quite rapidly.

    It wouldn't be wise to attack a Reserve, after all we are members of AGS, so it is technically assaulting a Garda. If anything it will be just more work for the Full time member, cause they will have to really be keeping a close eye on the Reserve.

    I think it's just a bad idea, like I understand why Garda are annoyed at it but the fact of the matter is, I am easily identified as a Reserve by the GR on my shoulders. If anything maybe they should give us different colors on our shoulder numbers light blue for around the station so other people know.

    Lads, all I am saying is this might seem like a great idea now, but if it is brought in I am still going to be around the station and someone will have to go out with me. I understand I am a bit of extra work, but if this is brought in, your going to be going around with someone more vulnerable not just down to the uniform but in terms of powers.

    I understand your frustration at the Reserves, but I am there just to try gain some knowledge in the hope of a job, but after the recruitment campaign I have no idea. Putting me in a different uniform is putting my safety on the line, it's attacking me as person if I get hurt on the job and not the position as a Reserve.


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    msg11 wrote: »
    They wouldn't target us, they would just tell us to **** off, what can you do all the usual you would expect. Which I could see causing tension with some Reserves as they might not know what to do or could say something and that may cause a normal situation to escalate quite rapidly.

    It wouldn't be wise to attack a Reserve, after all we are members of AGS, so it is technically assaulting a Garda. If anything it will be just more work for the Full time member, cause they will have to really be keeping a close eye on the Reserve.

    I think it's just a bad idea, like I understand why Garda are annoyed at it but the fact of the matter is, I am easily identified as a Reserve by the GR on my shoulders. If anything maybe they should give us different colors on our shoulder numbers light blue for around the station so other people know.

    Lads, all I am saying is this might seem like a great idea now, but if it is brought in I am still going to be around the station and someone will have to go out with me. I understand I am a bit of extra work, but if this is brought in, your going to be going around with someone more vulnerable not just down to the uniform but in terms of powers.

    I understand your frustration at the Reserves, but I am there just to try gain some knowledge in the hope of a job, but after the recruitment campaign I have no idea. Putting me in a different uniform is putting my safety on the line, it's attacking me as person if I get hurt on the job and not the position as a Reserve.

    I wore light blue epaulettes as a student garda and had no powers at all for 6 months on the street like nearly every serving gardai with less than 25 years service. We were easily identifiable and managed to get on with the job!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,778 ✭✭✭WilcoOut


    Canyon86 wrote: »
    Would the gougers / crims on the street target the GR more if the uniforms were different ?

    As they know they are different from their FT colleagues etc

    Just a thought I have

    Just like wearing the student blue tabs - massive target


  • Registered Users Posts: 258 ✭✭Hill St Blue


    timwynne wrote: »
    is this a question of professionalism or rank recognition? because professionalism is a state of mind

    all ranks are differentiated in AGS so that you may recognise the role they play

    sgt - chevrons
    cig - red gold bar
    super- red gold bar and red pip

    so on and so on

    Reserve Gardai have a big GR on their shoulders so they are easily identified


    Our organisation wears a UNIFORM and everyone is UNIFORMED

    if a member of the public seeks help that a GR cannot provide well then the fulltimer at his/her side can deal with it

    a different uniform is rediculous. if anything it would prob attract more queries to the GR as he would be different to everyone and therefore seen as special!! such is the mindset of joepublic


    +1


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  • Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭timwynne


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    I wore light blue epaulettes as a student garda and had no powers at all for 6 months on the street like nearly every serving gardai with less than 25 years service. We were easily identifiable and managed to get on with the job!

    we all managed to get on with the job but there is no doubt it was a target for our frequent fliers


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    timwynne wrote: »
    we all managed to get on with the job but there is no doubt it was a target for our frequent fliers

    It appears to me that reserves have a fear or are embarrassed at being identified as being a reserve. That shows a serious flaw in the reserve as a concept or indeed in some who have become members of the reserve. As I said before student Gardai spent 6 months easily identifiable with their blue epaulettes working full time hours and got on with it. To me the government want to give the illusion of more gardai on the street and many reserves want to pass themselves off as full time members, you are what you are accept the role and work within it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭timwynne


    WilcoOut wrote: »
    Ill wear a pink uniform if they want - ill still be as professional as any man and plenty of mules wouldnt know the meaning of the word

    bring it on I say - GRs are not afraid of change

    This reserve doesnt seem to have a problem being recognised shady tady, and as a member, you should know, student reserves wear the blues for 6months too

    I hated wearing them in certain parts of the district - It was an invite for abuse much to the amusement of the senior men. character building they called it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    timwynne wrote: »
    This reserve doesnt seem to have a problem being recognised shady tady, and as a member, you should know, student reserves wear the blues for 6months too

    I hated wearing them in certain parts of the district - It was an invite for abuse much to the amusement of the senior men. character building they called it!

    6 months x 4hrs per week as apposed to 6 months x 40 hours a week! Anyway I've made my points, all the best!


  • Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭timwynne


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    6 months x 4hrs per week as apposed to 6 months x 40 hours a week! Anyway I've made my points, all the best!

    still wear them - good luck!


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭Hooch


    Mod note - Shady Tady has identified himself and proven himself to me as being a member of AGS. (Incase people think he's not, I verified same yesterday).


    Adding to the discussion, what would reserves think of having Reserve written in small writing under Garda on the fleese, jacket and high vis. Similar to the Traffic Corps jackets??

    Am I right in saying this is how the UK police identify Reserves? (Ignore my ignorance, I'm not too well up on the UK system)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,957 ✭✭✭Hooch


    timwynne wrote: »
    I hated wearing them in certain parts of the district - It was an invite for abuse much to the amusement of the senior men. character building they called it!

    That's where the member who was with you should have stepped in and employed the powers for public order. Obviously they have an issue with reserves. I for one would not allow anyone to talk down to or abuse a reserve. That being said we mostly have top class reserves where I am


  • Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭Yogi Bear


    Hooch wrote: »

    Adding to the discussion, what would reserves think of having Reserve written in small writing under Garda on the fleese, jacket and high vis. Similar to the Traffic Corps jackets??

    Am I right in saying this is how the UK police identify Reserves? (Ignore my ignorance, I'm not too well up on the UK system)


    I don't think i would have a problem with Reserve written under Garda in small writing.

    I think the real issue with reserves is that at present is that they have little or no powers, and then to be sent out in a different uniform, where everyone would know they can't do anything or very little, would make them a target to the "regular clients".

    If they brought in these new powers, i think reserves would have no issue with a slight change in uniform. All we actually want to do, is to contribute a small bit to help out the full time members, and to make our time more interesting for us. Yes it is nice to go home on a Saturday night and have no paperwork,but after 7 years it wearing a bit thin.


  • Registered Users Posts: 383 ✭✭bluetop


    Hooch wrote: »
    Mod note - Shady Tady has identified himself and proven himself to me as being a member of AGS. (Incase people think he's not, I verified same yesterday).


    Adding to the discussion, what would reserves think of having Reserve written in small writing under Garda on the fleese, jacket and high vis. Similar to the Traffic Corps jackets??

    Am I right in saying this is how the UK police identify Reserves? (Ignore my ignorance, I'm not too well up on the UK system)

    Same uniform and same insignia on the shoulders as GR theirs say SC

    239_jf1nav09gq.jpg

    police-generic-1263974252-large-article-0.jpg


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,778 ✭✭✭WilcoOut


    Hooch wrote: »
    Mod note - Shady Tady has identified himself and proven himself to me as being a member of AGS. (Incase people think he's not, I verified same yesterday).


    Adding to the discussion, what would reserves think of having Reserve written in small writing under Garda on the fleese, jacket and high vis. Similar to the Traffic Corps jackets??

    Am I right in saying this is how the UK police identify Reserves? (Ignore my ignorance, I'm not too well up on the UK system)

    No problem whatsoever

    id actually like to differentiate more and that the public know i am a reserve with another profession and that I actually do work for a living :p


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