Dublin Marathon 2011 Novices Mentored Thread

oceanfish2008 · 27-09-2011 3:59pm

Folks,

Due to an IT band issue recurring at the start of August my marathon training plan has been shot to pieces. I'm thinking about packing it in as I'm way behind on long runs. My longest was 16m on Aug 12th. I did the Half marathon last week in 2:08 and had no issues but I need to do 16m this week and 18m the week after before I taper. I only want to finish the marathon at this stage but I'm wondering if thats even feasable at this point. The following is my training since Aug -

Total Miles LSR
W/C 08/08/2011 37 16
15/08/2011 0 0
22/08/2011 11 5
29/08/2011 5 5
05/09/2011 13 7
12/09/2011 16 13.1
19/09/2011 11.5 8.3

Is my goose cooked? Thanks for any advice

RayCun · 27-09-2011 4:11pm

That's a lot of missed training. Were you happy with the 2.08 half marathon? Were you slowing a lot towards the end? Would you be happy with a marathon that's close to 5 hours? Because I think the only way you're going to get around is with slow running and walking breaks.

oceanfish2008 · 27-09-2011 6:00pm

Raycun, thanks for the reply.

I was happy enough with the 2:08 HM. I did the 2nd half quicker than the first but slowed during the last 1/2 mile (started to get cramps in the calves).

At this stage I'd be happy to finish in any time at all and would aim to be running at 12min miles in the Marathon. I normally run my LSR's at 11min miles so with all my missed training that's about as ambitious as I can be. You've confirmed what I suspected that I may well be walking for some of it. After all the training I've missed its about all I can expect, considering that its my first attempt

Younganne · 27-09-2011 6:10pm

Oceanfish, don't lose sight of the fact that doing a marathon is a huge undertaking and a lot of runners i know have never done a marathon and would never consider it.
The time of 5 hrs is not the worst time and the finishing the marathon is a fantastic achievement so keep that in mind as you continue your training for the next 5 week.. I walked the marathon 5 yr ago in 7.30 hrs so aim to beat that;)

oceanfish2008 · 27-09-2011 6:15pm

Younganne wrote: »

Oceanfish, don't lose sight of the fact that doing a marathon is a huge undertaking and a lot of runners i know have never done a marathon and would never consider it.
The time of 5 hrs is not the worst time and the finishing the marathon is a fantastic achievement so keep that in mind as you continue your training for the next 5 week.. I walked the marathon 5 yr ago in 7.30 hrs so aim to beat that;)

Cheers younganne, thats a good perspective to have on it:)

Concerned2 · 27-09-2011 7:21pm

Hi guys, I'm bowing out of the marathon I'm afraid

I've lost over 3 weeks training due to an Achilles problem which I can't seem to shake. I did an 8 mile run last weekend & my ankle was pretty sore the next day so it hasn't healed much with 3 weeks of rest & stretching. Only consolation is I hadn't yet entered so at least I saved myself €90 . All the best on ye're marathon exploits & I hope to read many a happy race report from ye

run44 · 27-09-2011 7:26pm

Concerned2 wrote: »

Hi guys, I'm bowing out of the marathon I'm afraid I've lost over 3 weeks training due to an Achilles problem which I can't seem to shake. I did an 8 mile run last weekend & my ankle was pretty sore the next day so it hasn't healed much with 3 weeks of rest & stretching. Only consolation is I hadn't yet entered so at least I saved myself €90 . All the best on ye're marathon exploits & I hope to read many a happy race report from ye

Aw no, sorry to hear that

Hope it clears up soon and perhaps you could target a Spring marathon..?

Mr Slow · 27-09-2011 7:38pm

oceanfish2008 wrote: »

Folks,

Due to an IT band issue recurring at the start of August my marathon training plan has been shot to pieces.

Have you had the IT Band stripped?

Nules10 · 27-09-2011 8:03pm

Concerned2 wrote: »

Hi guys, I'm bowing out of the marathon I'm afraid I've lost over 3 weeks training due to an Achilles problem which I can't seem to shake. I did an 8 mile run last weekend & my ankle was pretty sore the next day so it hasn't healed much with 3 weeks of rest & stretching. Only consolation is I hadn't yet entered so at least I saved myself €90 . All the best on ye're marathon exploits & I hope to read many a happy race report from ye

Aww no way concerned2

your training was going so well. Nearly in the same boat myself only i have entered :rolleyes: But i am sure i will be back running on saturday Positive Mental attitude is the only thing keeping me going. Hopefully you will be back training soon

oceanfish2008 · 27-09-2011 11:05pm

Mr Slow wrote: »

oceanfish2008 wrote: »

Folks,

Due to an IT band issue recurring at the start of August my marathon training plan has been shot to pieces.

Have you had the IT Band stripped?

No, what is stripping?

PDCAT · 28-09-2011 8:50am

RayCun wrote: »

Your running fitness takes a long time to build up - it won't just disappear overnight either. There are just under 5 weeks to the marathon - if you miss this week completely you still have two weeks where you can build up your running before tapering back down again for the race.
It isn't an all-or-nothing deal anyway. There's no point at which the marathon becomes impossible, but the more your training is interrupted the less fit you are on the day and the harder you'll find it.

Thanks Ray.

I thought that if i missed two weeks, especially around now as the LSR's are longer, that it would mean, my ability to complete the marathon would be severely hampered, even though i have completed nearly all the rest of the training plan and had a decent enough base fitness starting the plan.

My plan is to try out the leg again either tonight/tomorrow night with a 5 miler on grass. If it's fine, i will do an LSR (10 - 12 miles) on Saturday. If not, will rest the leg again and try to run a recovery run on Monday and continue plan from there hopefully.

PDCAT · 28-09-2011 8:52am

Mr Slow wrote: »

Just to add to the above, if you are out for this week too, you'll get away with a shorter taper (2 weeks) because there will have been an effective rest period while you were off your feet.

Thanks Mr Slow

If i can get back to running next week, i might use a shorter taper period to get some mileage up.

justdoit · 28-09-2011 9:29am

Hi guys,

Apologies in advance for long post.

I guess I'm looking for reassurance, but any home truths are welcome too.

Training for DCM, which will be my first marathon. I've been told not to concern myself toooo much with a time, and that my main goal should be to get round injury free.

I've taken that on board and am trying to train sensibly etc, but in my head I am still aiming for sub 4, and would dearly love to do 3h45.

Training has been mixed, and the furthest I have run is 30km, but that was during a duathlon, so was 20km, with a cycle in the middle, and then a final 10km. After that event (Sept 11), I rested up and took two weeks with almost no exercise (some pool sessions, but no running) and I got back in to it on Sunday, with 10km, followed by 10km Monday and 15km last night.

My legs are definitely feeling it this morning, which is a first, and I'm starting to get concerned about October 31st. Post-duathlon I felt confident I could get around, but now I'm nervous and not sure how I should structure my training for the next three weeks.

For what it's worth, my best 10km time is 43m, my best (only) HM is 1h44 and my 10km splits in the duathlon were 55m, 54m and a very slow 1h5.

I play rugby too, which I know is not ideal leading up to a marathon, so I have stepped back from this as much as possible, but will probably have to play two games between now and October 31st.

Any advice on how to attack training would be most welcome.

Thanks

Tec Diver · 28-09-2011 9:37am

RayCun wrote: »

That's more or less marathon pace, for a 4 hour marathon. Your long runs should be somewhere between 6.00 and 6.30 (have a look at this calculator) You are probably just running out of energy.

Are the stomach issues new?

Had a look at that and I put in my last HM time, so it give my long run pace as "5:36 to 6:13". Not too far off what I was doing, but I'll try and reign it in for the next one.
Yea, I think I had something dodgy on the Thursday and the effects of it came on during Friday, so on Saturday I wasn't 100%. Hydrated fine, just couldn't stomach gels etc.

BobMac104 · 28-09-2011 9:46am

Concerned2 wrote: »

Hi guys, I'm bowing out of the marathon I'm afraid I've lost over 3 weeks training due to an Achilles problem which I can't seem to shake. I did an 8 mile run last weekend & my ankle was pretty sore the next day so it hasn't healed much with 3 weeks of rest & stretching. Only consolation is I hadn't yet entered so at least I saved myself €90 . All the best on ye're marathon exploits & I hope to read many a happy race report from ye

ah sh1t man sorry to hear that:( ! rest up get it sorted and as said, target a spring marathon maybe.!! best of luck!

RayCun · 28-09-2011 9:54am

Tec Diver wrote: »

Had a look at that and I put in my last HM time, so it give my long run pace as "5:36 to 6:13". Not too far off what I was doing, but I'll try and reign it in for the next one.
Yea, I think I had something dodgy on the Thursday and the effects of it came on during Friday, so on Saturday I wasn't 100%. Hydrated fine, just couldn't stomach gels etc.

Your half marathon time is pretty fast compared to your planned marathon time - Macmillan is giving a 3.30 marathon based on that, and so the training paces are all for a 3.30 marathon.
But if you're having trouble every time you go over 2 hours, and your last marathon was well over 4, you really don't have the endurance for a 3.30 marathon.

PDCAT · 28-09-2011 10:54am

Hi Guys

Just entered my wife in for the Dublin Marathon.

Her half marathon time two weeks ago was 2.02.10. I'm thinking she should be ok for a 4.30 marathon. She has been following Hal Hidgon Novice 1 plan, missed no run's and has completed all LSR's to day (18, 16.5, 15, 13.1) running at 11 minute miles.

Just checking to see that 4.30 is the one, she would be capable of. Does this sound correct. She can just run with the pacers.

RayCun · 28-09-2011 10:58am

Yep, 4.30 should be fine.

run44 · 28-09-2011 11:05am

Hi all,

Seeking a bit of advice/reassurance if ye don't mind. I'm planning to run with pacers during the marathon so want to make sure I pick the right group! My first experience of running with pacers was in the half marathon and honestly I found it a fantastic help and it meant I didn't have to look at my watch all the time and could enjoy it!

My HM time was 1.56 , which I was both delighted and surprised by. Putting that into McMillan's calculator, it gives me whats seems like an unrealistic time of 4.05ish. Should I run with the 4h15m pacers and hope stamina and adrenaline keep me there or would running with the 4h30 group make more sense?

Thanks for all the help and wise words guys, its much appreciated!

RayCun · 28-09-2011 11:11am

run44 wrote: »

My HM time was 1.56 , which I was both delighted and surprised by. Putting that into McMillan's calculator, it gives me whats seems like an unrealistic time of 4.05ish. Should I run with the 4h15m pacers and hope stamina and adrenaline keep me there or would running with the 4h30 group make more sense?

Go with the 4.30 group. Best to be conservative in your first marathon.
If you go with the 4.30s, you might be able to speed up after Fosters Avenue, pick up a few minutes like that. I can guarantee that if you do, you'll spend the last few miles passing out people who went with the 4.15 group and couldn't hold on

It is much better to be the guy finishing fast than the guy everyone is passing out at the end.

run44 · 28-09-2011 11:14am

RayCun wrote: »

Go with the 4.30 group. Best to be conservative in your first marathon.
If you go with the 4.30s, you might be able to speed up after Fosters Avenue, pick up a few minutes like that. I can guarantee that if you do, you'll spend the last few miles passing out people who went with the 4.15 group and couldn't hold on It is much better to be the guy finishing fast than the guy everyone is passing out at the end.

Thanks Ray. No point putting myself under too much pressure!

TomD101 · 28-09-2011 11:35am

I ran the half in 1hr 45mins. Felt I could have went faster if I wasn't under the weather, had a cold/flu.

What time should I be targeting for DCM?

Also what time should I target for Athlone 3/4 at the weekend?

RayCun · 28-09-2011 11:52am

TomD101 wrote: »

I ran the half in 1hr 45mins. Felt I could have went faster if I wasn't under the weather, had a cold/flu.

What time should I be targeting for DCM?

Also what time should I target for Athlone 3/4 at the weekend?

I'd say go with the 4 hour pacers in Dublin (and speed up at the end if you can). In Athlone they have pace groups based on your planned Dublin time, not your planned Athlone time, so go with the 4 hour group there too.

ger664 · 28-09-2011 2:27pm

PDCAT wrote: »

Hi Guys

Just entered my wife in for the Dublin Marathon.

Her half marathon time two weeks ago was 2.02.10. I'm thinking she should be ok for a 4.30 marathon. She has been following Hal Hidgon Novice 1 plan, missed no run's and has completed all LSR's to day (18, 16.5, 15, 13.1) running at 11 minute miles.

Just checking to see that 4.30 is the one, she would be capable of. Does this sound correct. She can just run with the pacers.

I agree she should be fine especially if she comes along with us in that pace band.

PDCAT · 28-09-2011 2:33pm

ger664 wrote: »

I agree she should be fine especially if she comes along with us in that pace band.

Thanks Ger. She'll be delighted with that.
I was trying to get her to run with sub 5 hour pacer's and would be easier for her. She was adamant that she wanted to run 4.30.

househunter · 28-09-2011 5:12pm

Another similar question. I ran 1:48 in the half in Dublin. I was thinking of going with the 4 hour pacers. Is this a bit too ambitious or do you think I'll be safe enough?

brownian · 28-09-2011 5:39pm

Househunter, it all depends on how much training you've done, specifically your longer runs and how you've run them. If you've at least a couple of runs at 18 miles or more, then I'd say you could give it a go for sub-4. If you found things tough early on, though, you might consider dropping off the pace.

Others might be less optimistic, but if you think you can give it a decent shot, I don't see why you wouldn't try.

househunter · 28-09-2011 5:48pm

brownian wrote: »

Househunter, it all depends on how much training you've done, specifically your longer runs and how you've run them. If you've at least a couple of runs at 18 miles or more, then I'd say you could give it a go for sub-4. If you found things tough early on, though, you might consider dropping off the pace.

Others might be less optimistic, but if you think you can give it a decent shot, I don't see why you wouldn't try.

Thanks for the feedback. I've done 2 20 mile runs and they went well. Also a couple of 18 miles runs. My last LSR was 18 miles with 14 at PMP which went pretty well I think.
I think I'll give 4 hrs a go and see how I get on

Marathon2011 · 28-09-2011 5:54pm

Hi Ray

Firstly great thread which I have been following all along.

Running around 2/3 years and have completed 2 half marathons including the park this month. I am following Hal Novice 1 but have missed at least one short run each week.

I'm doubting myself now. My goal is to finish the 26.2. My half marathon time was 2.03 and my 18 mile went well on Sunday, as in I was still running at mile 18.

Are the missed short runs going to hurt me?

brownian · 28-09-2011 5:56pm

househunter wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback. I've done 2 20 mile runs and they went well. Also a couple of 18 miles runs. My last LSR was 18 miles with 14 at PMP which went pretty well I think.
I think I'll give 4 hrs a go and see how I get on

Seems fair enough to me. 18 with 14 at (I presume sub-4) PMP is a decent workout.

Couple more weeks of solid careful training, and we're all in taper-land. Best of luck with it.

Dublin Marathon 2011 Novices Mentored Thread

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