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LED Downlights

  • 19-05-2015 10:37pm
    #1
    BarneyMc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭


    I've got some mixed messages about LED downlights. Is it true they're still in the development stage and blow easily? If so is there a good alternative?


Comments

  • #2
    Graham 1324
    Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭Graham 1324


    They last a lot longer than halogens anyway


  • #3
    Tony Beetroot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 640 ✭✭✭Tony Beetroot


    Leds are there, just to buy the right ones. Alot of crap ones being made in China that you want to avoid. Where were you reading that they are still in development and blow easy?


  • #4
    BarneyMc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭BarneyMc


    Tony Beetroot wrote: »
    Leds are there, just to buy the right ones. Alot of crap ones being made in China that you want to avoid. Where were you reading that they are still in development and blow easy?

    Well maybe not still in development but in a local electrical supplier they said some tend to blow... maybe these are the cheap ones.

    Can anyone recommend a particular one that they use and are happy with?


  • #5
    Tony Beetroot
    Closed Accounts Posts: 640 ✭✭✭Tony Beetroot


    BarneyMc wrote: »
    Well maybe not still in development but in a local electrical supplier they said some tend to blow... maybe these are the cheap ones.

    They haven't a clue what they are on about.


  • #6
    JonathonS
    Registered Users Posts: 702 ✭✭✭JonathonS


    I changed one room of downlighters and used Osram LED lamps. I had done some research and decided to avoid anything that had not got a good brand behind it. There are some horror stories out there about no-name brands. Philips and Osram have long guarantees on their LED products, and they seem to have the biggest range. Prices have dropped quite a bit in the past two years, so shop around and compare. I changed 16 and the price difference between brands at the time was up to 3 euro per lamp.


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  • #7
    BarneyMc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭BarneyMc


    What's the minimum service void required for these LED downlights?


  • #8
    BarneyMc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭BarneyMc


    I came across this downlight. It comes in 10w and 5.5w versions with heights of 43mm and 35mm depths respectively. Does anyone know if there's mounting on top of this and if so what depth to allow for?


  • #9
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,751 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Even if LED's blow, it can't be any worse than having 12v transformers that constantly fail, and the matching halogen bulbs............I have lost the will to live now, having gotten as far as the 30-something-th lamp now.............

    I did a quick tot: my sitting room had 9 x 50w halogens: Now with 9 x 5.5 LED's the consumption in room now is less than ONE halogen previously..........

    +1 on the branded ones though; too much junk on the market.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #10
    BarneyMc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭BarneyMc


    Can you remember what depth was required to house these 5.5w LEDs? In my link above the 5.5w LEDs are only 35mm in height but I'm not sure what mounting is required.


  • #11
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,751 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    BarneyMc wrote: »
    Can you remember what depth was required to house these 5.5w LEDs? In my link above the 5.5w LEDs are only 35mm in height but I'm not sure what mounting is required.

    Well I have a full joist depth as they're replacing std halogens, but physically they are the same depth as halogens anyway.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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  • #12
    JonathonS
    Registered Users Posts: 702 ✭✭✭JonathonS


    BarneyMc wrote: »
    What's the minimum service void required for these LED downlights?

    Mine are downstairs and fitted easily between ceiling and upstairs floor. The luminaires were about 9cm in depth. You may need 1-2cm for cable. Time for the measuring tape.:)


  • #13
    Kman123!
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭Kman123!


    Has anyone noticed the advantages of LED over CFL for Dome/Ceiling lighting in terms of electricity and maintenance costs?
    I live in an apartment development that is still using cfl and have wanted the mamangement company to make the switch to LED, given that I have heard that the cost savings over the current system are significant.
    Are there any companies out there retrofitting these apartment developments? It seems like a complete no brainer to move to led.
    Any thoughts?


  • #14
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,173 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    Kman123! wrote: »
    Has anyone noticed the advantages of LED over CFL for Dome/Ceiling lighting in terms of electricity and maintenance costs?
    I live in an apartment development that is still using cfl and have wanted the mamangement company to make the switch to LED, given that I have heard that the cost savings over the current system are significant.
    Are there any companies out there retrofitting these apartment developments? It seems like a complete no brainer to move to led.
    Any thoughts?

    More than lightly the maintenance contract is with a mate of one of the members of the mngt committee who probably gets a euro 100 for each call out to change the cfls so why would you go long life LED :eek:

    On a more serious note, as these are public areas, you need to ensure that the lumen levels meet the regs so watts for watts is not the issue when going LED, its lumens

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



  • #15
    JonathonS
    Registered Users Posts: 702 ✭✭✭JonathonS


    +1 on checking the lumens to assess light output. Colour is also important, in public areas you would probably be looking for a white light output, 3500K or more.

    As far as savings go LED bulbs should last around 3 times as long as CFLs (my downlighters have a stated 25 year life). A comparison of the watts will give you an indication of the possible energy savings. I replaced some 20w CFLs with 6w LEDs in lampstands, in theory they will cost about 70% less to run.

    Re whether the switch is a no-brainer I notice increasing numbers of pubs and hotels are changing the lighting in public areas to LED.


  • #16
    Kman123!
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭Kman123!


    I think this is what's happening in our place. The management company is making money on call outs and maintenance costs, not to mention the consumables, which I am sure they are adding a nice margin on.
    I want to know how you bypass the management company and get the development retrofitted with LED which appears to have significant advantages. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas, so how do you overcome this issue? We are being fleeced on electricity and maintenance and yet there is still this illogical attachment to CFL. The only reason this is so is because of the money to be made out of it.
    I've also noticed that hotels and pubs are switching to LED as well as lot's of other commercial premises. They don't have vested interests blocking the way. It stands to reason that residential should be on LED too.
    Any thoughts, ideas, solutions to this problem? How to overcome the blockers and what companies are the best at residential LED?


  • #17
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,173 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    Kman123! wrote: »
    I think this is what's happening in our place. The management company is making money on call outs and maintenance costs, not to mention the consumables, which I am sure they are adding a nice margin on.
    I want to know how you bypass the management company and get the development retrofitted with LED which appears to have significant advantages. Turkeys don't vote for Christmas, so how do you overcome this issue? We are being fleeced on electricity and maintenance and yet there is still this illogical attachment to CFL. The only reason this is so is because of the money to be made out of it.
    I've also noticed that hotels and pubs are switching to LED as well as lot's of other commercial premises. They don't have vested interests blocking the way. It stands to reason that residential should be on LED too.
    Any thoughts, ideas, solutions to this problem? How to overcome the blockers and what companies are the best at residential LED?

    Do the math and circulate it to all the residents.
    You need:
    number of luminaries
    number of bulbs per luminaire
    wattage of each bulb.
    Hours of use.

    Add on about 10% for ballast and other losses: see screen shot below

    get one of the bulbs and check with a local elec shop that you can get an exact replacement fitting wise: if apts are old, they may not make LEDs for that fitting.
    Then have a stab at the life of the existing stuff: say 5 years so that means they replace 20% on average each year.
    So allow 50 euro labour per replacement plus add on bulb cost

    Do math at new wattages and new life, maybe 50,000 to 80,000 hrs, depending on quality.
    Calculate the savings.
    If no go, suggest to other residents that they withhold their mango fee till it gets done.
    What state are the apt accounts in?
    Job done:D

    You might get more intel over in the elec forum, which also has a sticky on LEDs

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



  • #18
    Kman123!
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭Kman123!


    Thanks a million Lads there is so much B.S out there about LED but I agree our Management Company are fleecing us as they use there own Electricians and we have over 700 Lights on 24/7 both in the Car Park and Corridors and Hallways which is crazy.
    I googled Motion Sensing LED and found one which sounds fantastic and even has Videos to support there technology i.e the Lights stay off during daytime and illuminate on detection at Night! they claim 80-90% Cost Saving I bet my Agent wont like to hear this anybody heard of Microwave LED before?
    Regards Kman


  • #19
    Calahonda52
    Registered Users Posts: 12,173 ✭✭✭✭Calahonda52


    be careful with motion thingies in such a car park, higher risk of nefarious activity or worse ( e.g.: women on their own coming home late at night)

    “I can’t pay my staff or mortgage with instagram likes”.



  • #20
    caesarthechimp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 204 ✭✭caesarthechimp


    SMD LEDs are the best, these are the newer type with the small yellow dots or squares inside the glass. And warm white is nicer than cool white in a domestic situation, but not quite as bright.


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