Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

zol 2 · 14-06-2012 6:55pm

Just heard this evening Brendan "Cider"Landers broke his arm in a challenge game for Lismore last night. Just want to send him on my best wishes.

deisedude · 14-06-2012 7:57pm

Interesting to see if the minor who was cruelly dropped (name escapes me) will be in goals now

zol 2 wrote: »

Just heard this evening Brendan "Cider"Landers broke his arm in a challenge game for Lismore last night. Just want to send him on my best wishes.

tus.maith · 14-06-2012 8:08pm

Waterford team for Sunday

1. Stephen O’Keeffe Ballygunner
2. Aidan Kearney Tallow
3. Liam Lawlor Fourmilewater
4. Stephen Daniels De La Salle
5. Richie Foley Abbeyside
6. Michael Walsh (Captain) Stradbally
7. Philip Mahony Ballygunner
8. Kevin Moran De La Salle
9. Stephen Molumphy Ballyduff Upper
10. Maurice Shanahan Lismore
11. Seamus Prendergast Ardmore
12. Eoin Kelly Passage
13. John Mullane De La Salle
14. Shane Walsh Fourmilewater
15. Gavin O’Brien Roanmore

suitcasepink · 14-06-2012 8:10pm

deisedude wrote: »

Interesting to see if the minor who was cruelly dropped (name escapes me) will be in goals now

That minor started against Passage the last day out with Landers playing half forward!
Whatever quarrel was had has been forgotten anyway..

Deise Doodler · 14-06-2012 9:03pm

tus.maith wrote: »

Waterford team for Sunday

1. Stephen O’Keeffe Ballygunner
2. Aidan Kearney Tallow
3. Liam Lawlor Fourmilewater
4. Stephen Daniels De La Salle
5. Richie Foley Abbeyside
6. Michael Walsh (Captain) Stradbally
7. Philip Mahony Ballygunner
8. Kevin Moran De La Salle
9. Stephen Molumphy Ballyduff Upper
10. Maurice Shanahan Lismore
11. Seamus Prendergast Ardmore
12. Eoin Kelly Passage
13. John Mullane De La Salle
14. Shane Walsh Fourmilewater
15. Gavin O’Brien Roanmore

Happy enough with that, although not the most experienced looking half back line plenty of ability, with conners and fives unavailable think is about right, think we could see a swithch with moran and foley but would prefer to see Moran midfield at least to start

DublinGAA96 · 14-06-2012 9:05pm

Where's Tony?

Deise Doodler · 14-06-2012 9:25pm

DublinGAA96 wrote: »

Where's Tony?

Think Tony had a fitness test tonight, hope he passed it but happy enough that he is not starting, think he would be caught for pace in the first 20 min

Mountainlad · 14-06-2012 9:54pm

tus.maith wrote: »

Waterford team for Sunday

1. Stephen O’Keeffe Ballygunner
2. Aidan Kearney Tallow
3. Liam Lawlor Fourmilewater
4. Stephen Daniels De La Salle
5. Richie Foley Abbeyside
6. Michael Walsh (Captain) Stradbally
7. Philip Mahony Ballygunner
8. Kevin Moran De La Salle
9. Stephen Molumphy Ballyduff Upper
10. Maurice Shanahan Lismore
11. Seamus Prendergast Ardmore
12. Eoin Kelly Passage
13. John Mullane De La Salle
14. Shane Walsh Fourmilewater
15. Gavin O’Brien Roanmore

Interesting. Daniels was being touted in the observer to start so bit of fore warning there. Pity Fives isn't fit. Brave decision not to start Tony if he is fit, but I expect he isn't. Slightly worried about Foley, dunno how fit he'll be. My preferred midfield partnership, thing they will win their battle which will be crucial. Not a bad half forward line, and the full forward line has great scoring potential.

If we get good ball into them, I think we'll win.

zol 2 · 14-06-2012 9:57pm

DublinGAA96 wrote: »

Where's Tony?

With the utmost respect to Tony there has to come a time when we bite the bullet and go with someone else with long term prospects.Tony has been an unbelievable servant to Waterford hurling but at 39 years of age even he must acknowledge that we must plan for the future. I would still have him around the squad as his experience is invaluable to the 4 lads making their Championship debut.

suitcasepink · 14-06-2012 10:08pm

zol 2 wrote: »

With the utmost respect to Tony there has to come a time when we bite the bullet and go with someone else with long term prospects.Tony has been an unbelievable servant to Waterford hurling but at 39 years of age even he must acknowledge that we must plan for the future. I would still have him around the squad as his experience is invaluable to the 4 lads making their Championship debut.

I'd agree with this tbh. Not saying goodbye to Tony at all and far from it, but I do think we need to wean him off a bit. I'd say we'll still see him play parts of games but as great as Tony still is you'd have to think at 38(?) he cant be the best option to start..

redlead · 14-06-2012 11:10pm

deise_girl wrote: »

zol 2 wrote: »

With the utmost respect to Tony there has to come a time when we bite the bullet and go with someone else with long term prospects.Tony has been an unbelievable servant to Waterford hurling but at 39 years of age even he must acknowledge that we must plan for the future. I would still have him around the squad as his experience is invaluable to the 4 lads making their Championship debut.

I'd agree with this tbh. Not saying goodbye to Tony at all and far from it, but I do think we need to wean him off a bit. I'd say we'll still see him play parts of games but as great as Tony still is you'd have to think at 38(?) he cant be the best option to start..

Where's the evidence to suggest this? He's consistently one of our best performers. The championship isn't a time to break players in as some suggest. You play your best 15 and that's that. Fingers crossed the two lads go well at wing back. Foley hasn't set the world alight since he came back from injury. I suspect that Tony has not passed the fittness test.

suitcasepink · 14-06-2012 11:21pm

redlead wrote: »

Where's the evidence to suggest this? He's consistently one of our best performers. The championship isn't a time to break players in as some suggest. You play your best 15 and that's that. Fingers crossed the two lads go well at wing back. Foley hasn't set the world alight since he came back from injury. I suspect that Tony has not passed the fittness test.

I cant say anything about Foley because I dont think ive seen him play one game all year. But Tony isnt as great as he was, its naive to think he hasnt faded a bit and since 2010 especially I think you'd notice it more how his mobility is faltering. Like hes such an intelligent hurler it doesnt show as much as it would for others but realistically any good pacey forward should get a few points off him

redlead · 14-06-2012 11:29pm

deise_girl wrote: »

redlead wrote: »

Where's the evidence to suggest this? He's consistently one of our best performers. The championship isn't a time to break players in as some suggest. You play your best 15 and that's that. Fingers crossed the two lads go well at wing back. Foley hasn't set the world alight since he came back from injury. I suspect that Tony has not passed the fittness test.

I cant say anything about Foley because I dont think ive seen him play one game all year. But Tony isnt as great as he was, its naive to think he hasnt faded a bit and since 2010 especially I think you'd notice it more how his mobility is faltering. Like hes such an intelligent hurler it doesnt show as much as it would for others but realistically any good pacey forward should get a few points off him

Can you point to a recent game where this has happened? He was an all star nominee last year at 38. His form has not dipped from then in any game I've seen him play in. Players should be judged on merit and not on what peoples perception of what a man of that age should or should not be able to do.

The two lads selected are fine hurlers I may add. Id just be very surprised if Foley was selected ahead of Browne on form. Presumably Foley will be on frees? Does anyone know who will be taking them?

deisefolife · 14-06-2012 11:44pm

deise_girl wrote: »

I cant say anything about Foley because I dont think ive seen him play one game all year.

i seen him when Dungarvan / Abbeside played a few weeks ago. and he didn't impress me to much tbh

Morte · 14-06-2012 11:44pm

Tony has gone from being a Hurler of the Year winner to an All Star winner to an All Star nominee. He is naturally on the wane but from such a high level that he remains a fine player. There's not much to choose between him and the other half backs available.

suitcasepink · 14-06-2012 11:54pm

redlead wrote: »

Can you point to a recent game where this has happened? He was an all star nominee last year at 38. His form has not dipped from then in any game I've seen him play in. Players should be judged on merit and not on what peoples perception of what a man of that age should or should not be able to do.

The two lads selected are fine hurlers I may add. Id just be very surprised if Foley was selected ahead of Browne on form. Presumably Foley will be on frees? Does anyone know who will be taking them?

Nahh id only be kidding myself if I tried to pick out examples, I cont remember such detail long after the game, but I do remember thinking it afterwards. Its just the whole movement thing isnt as fluid as it was, and understandably so.
Like Im not saying overnight hes turned into a 2nd string player, far from it. But I think his age is finally starting to show.. Perhaps when hes 43 he'll start to play like a typical 35 year old

Professey Chin · 14-06-2012 11:59pm

Morte wrote: »

Tony has gone from being a Hurler of the Year winner to an All Star winner to an All Star nominee. He is naturally on the wane but from such a high level that he remains a fine player. There's not much to choose between him and the other half backs available.

Thats 14 years ago now....christ....careers have come and gone since :pac:

Mountainlad · 14-06-2012 11:59pm

redlead wrote: »

Can you point to a recent game where this has happened? He was an all star nominee last year at 38. His form has not dipped from then in any game I've seen him play in. Players should be judged on merit and not on what peoples perception of what a man of that age should or should not be able to do.

The two lads selected are fine hurlers I may add. Id just be very surprised if Foley was selected ahead of Browne on form. Presumably Foley will be on frees? Does anyone know who will be taking them?

I can't see him being able for 70 minutes myself any more against a Kilkenny or a Tipp playing at the level I witnessed first hand in the All-Ireland finakl last year. He remains a very good hurler, and some say you should finish with your best team, so holding him in reserve for the final 20 maybe a good plan.

I think Mahony and Daniels deserve their chance as most people have been crying out to see them in the Waterford team these last few years. Not so sure about Foley, if Fives was fit though there'd be no question for me.

I reckon Maurice will take them up front.

Mountainlad · 15-06-2012 12:09am

Commitee room on in a minute for anyone still up, Marty Morrissey should give us a perfectly unbalanced Clare perspective on things!

glick6 · 15-06-2012 12:20am

redlead wrote: »

deise_girl wrote: »

redlead wrote: »

Where's the evidence to suggest this? He's consistently one of our best performers. The championship isn't a time to break players in as some suggest. You play your best 15 and that's that. Fingers crossed the two lads go well at wing back. Foley hasn't set the world alight since he came back from injury. I suspect that Tony has not passed the fittness test.

I cant say anything about Foley because I dont think ive seen him play one game all year. But Tony isnt as great as he was, its naive to think he hasnt faded a bit and since 2010 especially I think you'd notice it more how his mobility is faltering. Like hes such an intelligent hurler it doesnt show as much as it would for others but realistically any good pacey forward should get a few points off him

Can you point to a recent game where this has happened? He was an all star nominee last year at 38. His form has not dipped from then in any game I've seen him play in. Players should be judged on merit and not on what peoples perception of what a man of that age should or should not be able to do.

The two lads selected are fine hurlers I may add. Id just be very surprised if Foley was selected ahead of Browne on form. Presumably Foley will be on frees? Does anyone know who will be taking them?

Challenge v Dublin three weeks back. Tony was marking conal keaney just back from cruciate. Keaney scored 4 points from play off tony in first half and it as plain to see he could not keep with the pace. Davy knows where to target and he would target tony if he started.

glick6 · 15-06-2012 12:21am

Maurice will take frees yea. Probably Kelly for penaltys.

Mountainlad · 15-06-2012 12:34am

The more I think about it, given how he employed it religiously with Waterford, surely Davy is going to try and isolate either Colin Ryan or Conor McGrath on Liam Lawlor. How do people feel it's best that we address this? I reckon that the corner backs can't follow their men out, they need to stay put. Leave the corner forwards go out, but get the midfield to sit deeper and provide extra cover. It would suit Moran and Molumphy who like driving out with the ball. The Waterford half forward line could then drop deeper, leaving more space for the very dangerous inside forward line. Could work well for us if we get it right, course there's an element of risk with anything you decide to do. Thoughts?

glick6 · 15-06-2012 12:42am

Mountainlad wrote: »

The more I think about it, given how he employed it religiously with Waterford, surely Davy is going to try and isolate either Colin Ryan or Conor McGrath on Liam Lawlor. How do people feel it's best that we address this? I reckon that the corner backs can't follow their men out, they need to stay put. Leave the corner forwards go out, but get the midfield to sit deeper and provide extra cover. It would suit Moran and Molumphy who like driving out with the ball. The Waterford half forward line could then drop deeper, leaving more space for the very dangerous inside forward line. Could work well for us if we get it right, course there's an element of risk with anything you decide to do. Thoughts?

I dont think either Maurice or Eoin are the right players to sit deeper. Both are better attacking on the front foot. What we'l probably see, as we saw quite a bit in the league, is Gavin coming out around midfield and the half forward line to give that extra body. This isolates Mullane and Shane Walsh and gives them space to thrive as well as allowing Kevin Moran to sweep back into the half back line helping to snuff out their half forwards. Perfect example of this was the galway legue game. Worked really well.

Gavin moving out also frees up more space for Maurice and Eoin to exploit without sacrificing cover around the centre of the field.

I'd expect Gavin to alternate in and out depending on how things are going. Also don't be surprised to see seamus go in around the square with walshy and Mullane off either side at some stage just to shake things up.

Another possible switch might see Philip Mahoney moving into midfield with Kevin coming back wing back. Tried and worked well in the challenge v limerick last week.

As for the backs, I can see brick sitting deeper than usual to try to limit the amount Clare can isolate lawlor. Ringo and Daniels will very much stick to man marking but the most important area for me is wing backs. Really hope Richie and whoever it is that lines up on the other side play well and, with brick, limit their half forward lines influence.

Mountainlad · 15-06-2012 1:11am

glick6 wrote: »

I dont think either Maurice or Eoin are the right players to sit deeper. Both are better attacking on the front foot. What we'l probably see, as we saw quite a bit in the league, is Gavin coming out around midfield and the half forward line to give that extra body. This isolates Mullane and Shane Walsh and gives them space to thrive as well as allowing Kevin Moran to sweep back into the half back line helping to snuff out their half forwards. Perfect example of this was the galway legue game. Worked really well.

Gavin moving out also frees up more space for Maurice and Eoin to exploit without sacrificing cover around the centre of the field.

I'd expect Gavin to alternate in and out depending on how things are going. Also don't be surprised to see seamus go in around the square with walshy and Mullane off either side at some stage just to shake things up.

Another possible switch might see Philip Mahoney moving into midfield with Kevin coming back wing back. Tried and worked well in the challenge v limerick last week.

As for the backs, I can see brick sitting deeper than usual to try to limit the amount Clare can isolate lawlor. Ringo and Daniels will very much stick to man marking but the most important area for me is wing backs. Really hope Richie and whoever it is that lines up on the other side play well and, with brick, limit their half forward lines influence.

Yeah fair point about Maurice and Eoin. Mightn't be a bad idea to drag out Prender even just to give there centre back something to think about.

I thought Moran was anonymous wing back against Limerick last year, would prefer he stays in midfield even if he is sitting deep.

Yeah that has to happen and it will cause Davy a lot of problems if they do, because I don't think man for man that Clare are better than Waterford yet. Hope so too. I'm confident enough in them though. Conlon is a good hurler and I always thought more of Clancy than others, but they don't present a massive aerial threat, and I think Brick should be able to tie up Quinn with out too much trouble.

ballykev · 15-06-2012 8:26am

Whats the verdict on the new lads?

Waterford (SH v Clare): S O'Keeffe; A Kearney, L Lawlor, S Daniels; R Foley, M Walsh, P Mahony; K Moran, S Molumphy; M Shanahan, S Prendergast, E Kelly; J Mullane, S Walsh, G O'Brien.

calvin_zola · 15-06-2012 9:31am

This is great that we have 4 championship debutants this year. Coupled with the the debutants against limerick last year the avg age of the team is 26 i think.
Im sure the Dublin press and RTE will still be saying we are an ageing team.

Black Suir · 15-06-2012 10:56am

deisedude wrote: »

Interesting to see if the minor who was cruelly dropped (name escapes me) will be in goals now

Seanie Barry played in goal the last day against Passage. Cider was in the forwards but failed to shine there.

Black Suir · 15-06-2012 11:02am

deise_girl wrote: »

I cant say anything about Foley because I dont think ive seen him play one game all year. But Tony isnt as great as he was, its naive to think he hasnt faded a bit and since 2010 especially I think you'd notice it more how his mobility is faltering. Like hes such an intelligent hurler it doesnt show as much as it would for others but realistically any good pacey forward should get a few points off him

If hes not, I would have serious concerns for Mount Sions future. I know they were short last time out in the championship against Fourmilewater, but he was there best player on show, hitting two points from the half back line.

Black Suir · 15-06-2012 11:04am

deisefolife wrote: »

i seen him when Dungarvan / Abbeside played a few weeks ago. and he didn't impress me to much tbh

Saw him against Ballygunner as well and you would not know he was on the field.

hardybuck · 15-06-2012 11:12am

Black Suir wrote: »

Saw him against Ballygunner as well and you would not know he was on the field.

Probably enjoying his social life a little too much for an intercounty hurler also...can't see Tony being out on the town in the weeks leading up to championship.

Speaking to a good few people from various places around the country this week. Literally only one person out of about 15 I spoke to thought Waterford would win. Amazing.

Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

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