News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

pixbyjohn · 17-12-2010 12:20pm

pixbyjohn · 17-12-2010 12:22pm

danjo · 13-01-2011 2:26pm

Just noticed that the website is apparently gone. Maybe this is old news?

http://www.greystonesmarina.com/

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Charlie-Bravo · 13-01-2011 3:18pm

I know there was another website against the orignal proposals and that may have since ceased. This is the one you get from googling Greystones Harbour http://www.greystonesharbour.ie

Fiachra2 · 14-01-2011 9:04am

I today’s Irish times (sailing section) Derek Mitchell admits that the club buildings “may be delayed”. That’s the first time he has admitted that the plan isnt fully on schedule for completion by the year end

loyatemu · 14-01-2011 10:55pm

I expect the harbour will be finished but nothing else will be started until there's some prospect of selling the apartments and making some money off the whole project (when that'll be, lord knows)

taking the long view, if the harbour is built but the clubhouses are not, the clubs will still be better off as they'll be operating out of a functional harbour.

Blanchflower · 15-01-2011 1:51am

Fiachra2 wrote: »

I today’s Irish times (sailing section) Derek Mitchell admits that the club buildings “may be delayed”. That’s the first time he has admitted that the plan isnt fully on schedule for completion by the year end

The plan is dead in the water and will never be finished. At this stage they should landscape the area and make it into a peoples park. The smaller harbour option would have been the best option but the fools in Wicklow County Council were greedy and would not listen to the people.

Fiachra2 · 15-01-2011 5:51pm

loyatemu wrote: »

taking the long view, if the harbour is built but the clubhouses are not, the clubs will still be better off as they'll be operating out of a functional harbour.

True although the jury is out on that one even. The slip -apart from being way too steep- is in the wrong place and is very exposed so there has been a litany of damage to boats during the summer culminating in €2.5K's worth of wreckage to my own boat at the end of the season. (I thought of sending the bill to WCC but decided not to give them the pleasure of a good laugh at my expense!)

pixbyjohn · 16-01-2011 7:19pm

pixbyjohn · 16-01-2011 7:37pm

pixbyjohn · 16-01-2011 7:38pm

Blandpebbles · 17-01-2011 7:30pm

Was down in that exact spot yesterday. Looks great, really looking forward to the opening.

Huntthe · 18-01-2011 4:10pm

Blandpebbles wrote: »

Was down in that exact spot yesterday. Looks great, really looking forward to the opening.

Blanchflower · 18-01-2011 11:29pm

Blandpebbles wrote: »

Was down in that exact spot yesterday. Looks great, really looking forward to the opening.

Make sure you wear your strongest wellies to protect you from the muck.

Blanchflower · 19-01-2011 11:49pm

Fiachra2 wrote: »

I today’s Irish times (sailing section) Derek Mitchell admits that the club buildings “may be delayed”. That’s the first time he has admitted that the plan isnt fully on schedule for completion by the year end

Relevant extract from article as follows.....

New developments around the coast are, unsurprisingly thin on the ground. However, the Greystones Marina project is moving a step closer to completion as all the heavy engineering work of phase one is expected to conclude over the next week when earth and reclaimed land is finished.
But an actual marina facility is still uncertain, though Wicklow county councillor Derek Mitchell remains hopeful this could be in place by next year. A survey to assess demand has been completed but the findings haven’t been released. Mitchell reckons interest has been high, but as rental costs have still to be announced it will be difficult to be certain how strong demand is.
Meanwhile, the harbour is in place, but access is limited to a single public slipway and the various watersport club buildings may be delayed.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2011/0114/1224287487160.html

So Derek Mitchell is now extending the timing for the marina beyond 2011. What we need now is proper landscaping of the harbour area to allow the public access to their beach once again!

F3 · 26-01-2011 12:57am

There is too much distracting mis-information available to help with the excuses that will be forthcoming from local Councilors & Politicians when the truth is finally unveiled regarding the cessation of works at the harbour.
It is now more important than ever to keep up the mantra of the only question that matters:
When is the Harbour going to be reopened as an amenity to the people of Greystones?
We should as a community set our sights to an achievable level, which is simply to get WCC to take over the Harbour on a temporary [but long term] basis. This will resolve public liability and maintenance issues in the medium term and allow the amenity to be used. I think this could be a simple enough manifesto for any party in the forthcoming election. Once we get this commitment from WCC, we grass seed the entire site, put in a tarmac path and a few benches, and I think this should be sufficient lipstick to make this gorilla look attractive. I'm certain if this does not happen, we will be looking at the newly reinforced hordings for the next 10 years.

vinpaul · 26-01-2011 9:49am

F3 wrote: »

There is too much distracting mis-information available to help with the excuses that will be forthcoming from local Councilors & Politicians when the truth is finally unveiled regarding the cessation of works at the harbour.
It is now more important than ever to keep up the mantra of the only question that matters:
When is the Harbour going to be reopened as an amenity to the people of Greystones?
We should as a community set our sights to an achievable level, which is simply to get WCC to take over the Harbour on a temporary [but long term] basis. This will resolve public liability and maintenance issues in the medium term and allow the amenity to be used. I think this could be a simple enough manifesto for any party in the forthcoming election. Once we get this commitment from WCC, we grass seed the entire site, put in a tarmac path and a few benches, and I think this should be sufficient lipstick to make this gorilla look attractive. I'm certain if this does not happen, we will be looking at the newly reinforced hordings for the next 10 years.

I must say that I agree with you on this suggestion. Wouldn't it be lovely to have this terrific amenity available to all by the summer time?. I'm sure the people of Greystones and beyond would be more than agreeable to support this plan. How about getting the Tidy Towns Committee on board. They have done truly fantastic work in the last few years. This could be a project that would give their placing in next years competition a great bonus.
At a time of gloom and doom this suggestion is the most encouraging proposal that I have seen in a long time. Well done.

Alan_P · 26-01-2011 10:29am

vinpaul wrote: »

I must say that I agree with you on this suggestion. Wouldn't it be lovely to have this terrific amenity available to all by the summer time?. I'm sure the people of Greystones and beyond would be more than agreeable to support this plan. How about getting the Tidy Towns Committee on board. They have done truly fantastic work in the last few years. This could be a project that would give their placing in next years competition a great bonus.
At a time of gloom and doom this suggestion is the most encouraging proposal that I have seen in a long time. Well done.

I would tend to agree this is the best we can hope for, and in my opinion not a bad outcome at all.

As an aside, the local Wicklow Times freebie paper has a piece this week about the harbour. It confirms construction has stopped, and the next step supposedly is the construction of the medical centre. This is admitted to be dependent both on the Bord Pleanála decision and on NAMA giving the funding go ahead.

F3 · 26-01-2011 11:14am

NAMA are now only interested in financially viable solutions [business plans] to clear as many portfolios off their desks as they can. Unfortunately, they will not consider the construction of the medical centre as a solution to recovering the €80m or so spent on the harbour to date. They, I believe will not pump any more money into the scheme until they have a viable business plan approved, and this must include the completion and sale of the the residential units at a profit greater than what NAMA has paid the banks for this debt. NAMA will not provide monies for running the harbour for the people of Greystones as this will not generate a return. The most cost effective action for NAMA to take, is to secure the harbour from trespassers [hence, the recently reinforced hoardings and new pallisade fencing] and wait for a viable business plan, which I fear could take 10 years.

Our plan [as the concerned residents of Greytones] should be to get WCC to takeover the Harbour [public liability insurance, public lighting, maintenance etc] until such time as a viable business plan has been approved by NAMA.

We have an election coming up, we should use our voice.

F3 · 26-01-2011 7:23pm

Anyone know someone that has a copy of the PPP contract between Sispar & WCC / Dept of finance or do I have to go the freedom of information route?

Blandpebbles · 26-01-2011 9:05pm

contract was written on a beer mat in the beachhouse and has long since been beer stained and crumpled as our local politicians suckled on the celtic tiger.

Derek Mitchell couldn't even tell me what was agreed with relations to acceptance criteria, i.e. how does everyone agree the project is complete.

Classic...

recedite · 26-01-2011 9:50pm

They are currently fencing in another path linking the ugly part of the cliff walk with the "nurtured beach" just north of the harbour. I would imagine this newly surfaced route across the mud is the limit of their ambitions for this year.
The people have a new beach and a new slipway, what more would they want?

Blandpebbles · 26-01-2011 9:55pm

recedite wrote: »

They are currently fencing in another path linking the ugly part of the cliff walk with the "nurtured beach" just north of the harbour. I would imagine this newly surfaced route across the mud is the limit of their ambitions for this year.
The people have a new beach and a new slipway, what more would they want?

Cliff Walk is not in the PPP for the Harbour.

New path and fencing is a mess, why spend 15k on fences that will be washed away in a few years instead of putting the path next to the railway track because they have to protect the railway line from erosion.

F3 · 26-01-2011 10:10pm

Blandpebbles wrote: »

contract was written on a beer mat in the beachhouse and has long since been beer stained and crumpled as our local politicians suckled on the celtic tiger.

Derek Mitchell couldn't even tell me what was agreed with relations to acceptance criteria, i.e. how does everyone agree the project is complete.

Classic...

I understand your cynicism, but the facts are that there is a contract, and what's more it's been a carefully thought out contract. If there are deficits in the contract in respects of bonds or insurance guarantees for partial completion due to risks associated with the SPV failure to complete, then someone has been negligent in the procurement process. I want to find out who specifically is responsible. This would not happen on a PPP motorway for example, parent company guarantees would be in place under contract to complete, whats different about the harbour..........nothing

tennisplayer · 26-01-2011 11:31pm

F3 wrote: »

I understand your cynicism, but the facts are that there is a contract, and what's more it's been a carefully thought out contract. If there are deficits in the contract in respects of bonds or insurance guarantees for partial completion due to risks associated with the SPV failure to complete, then someone has been negligent in the procurement process. I want to find out who specifically is responsible. This would not happen on a PPP motorway for example, parent company guarantees would be in place under contract to complete, whats different about the harbour..........nothing

You won't get the answers on this forum. None of the 50 or so posters here would know who is specifically responsible. I don't know where you should go to ask these questions to receive a satisfactory answer.

recedite · 27-01-2011 12:04am

Blandpebbles wrote: »

Cliff Walk is not in the PPP for the Harbour.

New path and fencing is a mess, why spend 15k on fences that will be washed away in a few years instead of putting the path next to the railway track because they have to protect the railway line from erosion.

It was supposed to become a "linear park" where Darcy's field used to be. The path is quite close to the railway & The Grove cottages now. I'd say it will be the last line of defense this time. Beach "rock armour" would have to be tried before they could move it again.

F3 · 27-01-2011 7:37am

recedite wrote: »

It was supposed to become a "linear park" where Darcy's field used to be. The path is quite close to the railway & The Grove cottages now. I'd say it will be the last line of defense this time. Beach "rock armour" would have to be tried before they could move it again.

The external Coastal erosion is only part of the problem, the entire area from Sugerloaf to Jinx's hill, is being eaten from the inside out, with sub-terrane glacial streams that are scattered over the this area. The amount of swallow holes found in La touch park during construction of extensions etc has been quite extraordinary, ask any of the local builders. But I entirely agree about putting the path adjacent to the railway, at least Irish Rail ate duty bound to protect the line.

F3 · 27-01-2011 7:57am

tennisplayer wrote: »

You won't get the answers on this forum. None of the 50 or so posters here would know who is specifically responsible. I don't know where you should go to ask these questions to receive a satisfactory answer.

Many thanks, for the tip, but I'm working on finding out answers to my questions on many fronts. I'm living in GREYSTONES for only 23 years, my wifes family are old GREYSTONES for the past 2000 years if you get my drift. Anyway, I've 3 sons aged 6, 9 & 12, and I'm not sitting back anymore listening to crap from Councilers and Civil Sevants and the like whilst my sons are deprived of the Harbour. To me it's very simple, some person has been responsible for the failure to ensure this catastrophe should not have occurred. And I want to find that person. I also want the amenity back to the people of GREYSTONES.
With regard to your comments go regarding the posters in this forum, I've read a lot of what's been blogged, and it's support from the 50 or so bloggers is what is required to get this amenity back. We have an extraordinary opportunity with the election coming. If we peak with a single voice, we need only for Wicklow Council to take over the Harbour element of the development. I know this community will do the rest. We could have grass growing on the open areas by September if we put the effort in now.

cuddlycavies · 27-01-2011 8:28am

F3 wrote: »

There is too much distracting mis-information available to help with the excuses that will be forthcoming from local Councilors & Politicians when the truth is finally unveiled regarding the cessation of works at the harbour.
It is now more important than ever to keep up the mantra of the only question that matters:
When is the Harbour going to be reopened as an amenity to the people of Greystones?
We should as a community set our sights to an achievable level, which is simply to get WCC to take over the Harbour on a temporary [but long term] basis. This will resolve public liability and maintenance issues in the medium term and allow the amenity to be used. I think this could be a simple enough manifesto for any party in the forthcoming election. Once we get this commitment from WCC, we grass seed the entire site, put in a tarmac path and a few benches, and I think this should be sufficient lipstick to make this gorilla look attractive. I'm certain if this does not happen, we will be looking at the newly reinforced hordings for the next 10 years.

Good solution. It is possible. People who commenced these works (sisk/Sispar)should be burnt on the basis thta they are walking away leaving an eyesore.Thanks for the harbour walls lads, we'll finish the job and no, you cannot come back and finish the flats when you feel like it.

F3 · 27-01-2011 10:47am

cuddlycavies wrote: »

Good solution. It is possible. People who commenced these works (sisk/Sispar)should be burnt on the basis thta they are walking away leaving an eyesore.Thanks for the harbour walls lads, we'll finish the job and no, you cannot come back and finish the flats when you feel like it.

I've crunched a few figures, and save as to securing specific hazard areas that I can identify within the horadings for example the piles sticking out at the proposed boardwalk, which may need to be fenced off, €200 to €300k should open it up safely as an amenity to the people of Greystones, a relatively small public relations investment for both Sisk and Park Developents to pay vs the negative publicity that is sure to follow if nothing is done and the hoardings remain for the next 10 years. This will serve two key functions. 1. That NAMA can work in the background to find a solution to the overall problem whilst 2. Greystones can become the destination town that the harbour should bring. Local economic recovery will follow with the influx of visitors, restaurants, bed & breakfasts, shopping etc not to mention getting our annual festival back. All we need to do is to get WCC to agree to take over the harbour. It's a no brainer from laical chamber of commerce view point, local council viewpoint and local authority view point. This I believe is the solution to this problem, resolve it before it becomes too big and personalities get on the defensive!

News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

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