Massive issue with childminder

LegacyUser · 06-07-2012 12:31pm #1

I have 2 beautiful children, aged 3.5 and 1 year. Both girls. Both my husband and I work full time. When I had my first child I wanted to put her in with a lovely childminder locally who has great feed back and a number of my friends use and love her . She is HSE reg and very into Arts & crafts. Goes the extra mile with the kids. Keeps records and stays within the HSE guidlines on numbers.

My husbands sister also minds kids, always has to many in my view and not a great service. I had my child booked in with the first lady long before my little girl was born as I wanted to be sure I would get a place.

When my little girl arrived, the family took it that my sister in law would be minding my daughter, when I said I had arranged a childminder, holy hell broke out. It was all out war.
My husbnd didn't want the rows and made it very clear he was happy with his sister minding our little girl. In the end I couldn't cope with it and went along with it. I was never very happy with it. Everytime I spoke to her about something I was not happy with world war 3 broke out within the family. Like when she was left in a dirty napy to long and got a sore bum, i was told she didnt have the time to be just running after my child LWTF?? Or when I asked did she change the sheets on the cot after each child, she laughted at me and told me I was reared far from clean sheets every 5 minutes and to cop. I then had my Mother in law on the phone to me in work giving out about ho I had upset her daughter who really does so much for me and how could I. My husband would also get it as well.

My sister in law is not trained, no insurance and not HSE reg. She has 8 small kids most days and a nuumber of after school kids. The house is dirty and the smell would knock you down, the kids are all snotty nosed and dirty looking, very few toys to suit the age groups. In fact she and the place is totally unsuitable. No safetyat all, no toys i the garden but a old swing and somef ootballs.

My husband really does not want a big fall out and take the its grand line, to be honest it is totally not what I want. I feel it is not good for the kids and I want the best for them. My 3.5 year old hates it and crys every morning which breaks my heart.

She also charges far more than any other provider in the area. Most are 30 to 35 euro per day with all food included and a 10% discount for a second child. We are charged 40 euro a day per child and NO discount. Thats 400 euro a week for a service that is awful. The first thing I do when I get home each night is bath the girls as they are flithy and give them dinner, which is a joke as I have to take in a cooked dinner for each child every day along with shopping from a list that my sister in law gives me on a friday and the food MUST arrive on Monday morning with the children (for teas, snacks etc) today the list was 2 tins of beans, loaf of bread, 2lts Milk, bag of apple, punnet strawberries, grapes, rich tea biscuits, 12 eggs, pack of ham, cheese, 6 yogurts, rice cakes and a bag of treats. At least 20 euro more each week. To be honest I would not mind if the service was good and my children got to eat some of this stuff. My 3.5 year old tells me my sister in law, her husband and own kids eat this and that the dinners I take in are fed to her kids and she gets a sandwich. I have said this to my sister in law and she said my child was lying, it causes war in the family. My husband said he didnt believe she would do that, I am not so sure and the fact the kids are starving when they get home. All the other parents get a shopping list as well. It feels like we are doing her family shop for her and the list changes week by week.

I had hoped to move the kids when my little lady starts her free pre school year in Sept and was going to say that it would be far handier for me to have both in the same place but she got in before me and said she had arranged for my Mother in law to drop the kids (my daughter and others starting free year) to the play school and pick up. She also made it clear fees would be staying the same. Again if I was happy I would not have a issue with that. Plus my MIl only has a small car and seats are going to be a issue.

Anyway it all came to a hed on Monday when a little boy who is just over 2 fell and got a really bad cut on his head, he ended up in hospital over night and got 7 stitches. She said he was sitting on her knee when she was reading a story to the kids and he leaned forward and fell onto the side of the coffee table. My 3.5year old told me that My sister in law was in the sitting room with the door closed watching tv and the kids where in the kitchen with no adult and the little boy climed up onto the kitchen table and fell off. To be honest I believe her. My husband claims his sister would never leave the kids alone. Knowing her form I would believe she would.

Anyway myself and my husband had a big row over it and he dos not want to fall out with them but after a lot of me pushing agrees that they would better someplace else but is not perpared to move them and cause "upset" to his Sister and Mother.

Anyway I feel I can't and won't have the kids in that place any longer so this morning I rang the HSE pre school inspector who is going to call this afternoon, the HSA who are also going to call and the revenue as she does not pay any tax. I am not doing it to be a bitch but I can see no other way, husband wont move the kids, she is not fit to mind children and my kids have to come first and the only way I can move them is if she is closed down.

I dropped mine at 9-30am this morning and she had 8 under 4 and 5 school aged kids plus 3 of her own. It was like a zoo.

I can't tell my husband what I did or it will cause hell and I feel bad. Was I wrong? I know the parents of the child who got hurt are going to get the blame and I feel relly bad about this and also about lying to my husband but to be honest I feel he needs toman up and stand up to his family. I have been bullied by them all over childcare and it has to end. I am only sorry I didnt do it before.

I am sitting here in work feeling sick as a dog and worried as hell.

Did I do the right thing and what would you have done?

Squiggler · 06-07-2012 12:51pm

I don't think you did the wrong thing. From your post you are paying too much for a very poor service and have been bullied into doing so by your husband and his family.

I am shocked that your husband would put his mother and sister above his wife and children. In your shoes I'd be walking.

liliq · 06-07-2012 12:52pm

Squiggler wrote: »

I don't think you did the wrong thing. From your post you are paying too much for a very poor service and have been bullied into doing so by your husband and his family.

I am shocked that your husband would put his mother and sister above his wife and children. In your shoes I'd be walking.

100% what Squiggler says.
I really think your husband should be putting your kids welfare over the feelings of his sister in law. I'm sure she'd get over it if you just took the kids out of her care.

stargazer 68 · 06-07-2012 12:57pm

Your husband won't move your children from her care? So YOU MOVE THEM!! You aren't happy with them staying there - I wouldnt be either - but yet you are letting him dictate that they stay there so as not to upset his sister!

Seriously OP stand up for yourself and the welfare of your children.

Scarlet42 · 06-07-2012 12:58pm

Good for you .. you must think about your kids and nothing else .. they are your priority

scully74 · 06-07-2012 1:02pm

You'e done the right thing, what if the child that pulled a boiling pot or kettle down on its self, if your husband can't see this is child abuse (minor but abuse all the same) tell him to get his head out of his arse

cynder · 06-07-2012 1:04pm

You did the right thing, good for you. Have. A sugary tea to calm the nerves, and act shocked when you learn the hse has paid her a visit....

I hope she doesn't find your post on boards.... You might need to edit it....

tinkerbell · 06-07-2012 1:06pm

good god OP, your kids are in a hell environment. Get them out of there, I don't care what your husband thinks - he sounds like an absolute idiot that he is happy to let his kids be in that unsafe environment just because he doesn't wanna cause friction with his mother and sister. Well tbh to hell with them, he should be putting you and his children as his first priority. If I were in our shoes, i would be telling him you've had enough of this crap and you are deciding where they will be minded. You've given his nutso sister enough time to prove herself and she keeps failing, so I would be taking them out of that situation. Your husband needs to get a sense of reality too.

uck51js9zml2yt · 06-07-2012 1:29pm

Congratulations Op.
You did your kids and other parents kids a favour by reporting her..and probably your sister in law in the long run before something really serious happens a kid in her care
There is legislation in place for a reason and she chose to ignore it as does your husband.

You may never be able to say anything to anyone about the phone call and you will probably have to deny it if you get asked and don't want a row.

But as a parent you did the right thing. Just be careful how you react when it gets said to you about the visit from the authorities.

GarIT · 06-07-2012 1:31pm

If it was me I'd move them somewhere else and tell the husband you'll look for a divorce if he can't man up about it. I'd also own up about calling, tell them what they were doing was illegal and to sue you if they have a problem.

Your sister is doing f all, taking in €1,600 per week and not paying tax, what you did was right.

Abi · 06-07-2012 1:35pm

Absolutely did the right thing. You might still be in the line up for the blame for it though, so prepare yourself.

I would not have stood for the bullying and interference you got from his family. You've raised so many concerns about his sisters idea of child care and the cleanliness, if it was not a relatative do you think you and your husband would have the girls there? Damn right you wouldn't.

Look at it this way, if everything is in check she has nothing to worry about, so why should she be angry or raise hell over been checked on unless she knew she wasn't doing things by the book?

If you ask me she has a damn nerve. Regardless of the out come I'd still remove the girls from that place. They are YOUR children, so don't be dictated to by the sister in law and the mother. Let your husband deal with the shït afterwards seeing as he wasn't man enough to stand up to them in the first place.

LegacyUser · 06-07-2012 1:39pm

I think that is an incredibly sly and underhanded thing to do.

Why not just take your children out, rather than ratting on a family member like this.

When your husband finds out what you did to his sister, be prepared for the consequences....blood is thicker than water.

seamus · 06-07-2012 1:48pm

You've definitely done the right thing, without a shadow of a doubt. You're concerned about the quality of care that your child is getting. Remember your child is related to the childminder - so what level of care are the other kids getting? And you have significant problems with other aspects of her business. If the various agencies call in and give her a clean bill, then no harm done and you can maybe rest a little easier. If they call in and shut her down, then you've done a service to all other parents and kids. Either way it's win-win.

Overall, I would have recommended that you remove the child from her care as soon as your mother-in-law called you about it. This woman is running a business from her home and discussing the details of her clients with 3rd parties is way out of order. It doesn't matter that she discussed it with the child's grandmother. You are the mother, the woman if she had half a professional brain in her head would know that for your child, of all cases, she needs to maintain professional boundaries.

I wouldn't tell your husband what you did, but I would just tell him that you're moving the child because his sister is a terrible childminder. There's no point in pussyfooting around the issue, just tell him upfront that she's really bad at her job and you're going to hire someone better.
You may end up falling out with his family over it, but that may be unavoidable.

January · 06-07-2012 2:22pm

GJH Tatts wrote: »

I think that is an incredibly sly and underhanded thing to do.

Why not just take your children out, rather than ratting on a family member like this.

When your husband finds out what you did to his sister, be prepared for the consequences....blood is thicker than water.

His children are his blood and he's leaving them in a situation where they could be seriously hurt and are probably seriously bored all day with no activities to do.

OP done the right thing. I probably wouldn't have been so brave but fair play to you.

cynder · 06-07-2012 2:33pm

GJH Tatts wrote: »

I think that is an incredibly sly and underhanded thing to do.

Why not just take your children out, rather than ratting on a family member like this.

When your husband finds out what you did to his sister, be prepared for the consequences....blood is thicker than water.

Oh it is, but it's also a means to an end. She was at the end of her tether, reasoning with the husband got her nowhere.

She may not be sussed out, could aways be a neighbour or friend if a friend, that reported the sister in law, the only way for sure of tracing it back is if they find the above post.

The op should act dumb, otherwise the fallout will be like ww3.

irishbarb · 06-07-2012 2:34pm

I think you did the right thing OP! Even if you just took your own children out, the other children still have to suffer on under her care, and it sounds far from ideal! I think a lot of the time it's better just to avoid getting services (mechanics, plumbers, electricians etc.) from any family members because it just causes too much arguments and hassle. I would be interested to know what the outcome of the HSE visit was, if you feel comfortable with sharing it.

Good luck!

farmchoice · 06-07-2012 2:54pm

What you have done is very much the nuclear option. It is going to bring a world of trouble down on your sister in law. Now personally I think you were well within your rights and had little option.

Here is my bit of advice.
Under no circumstance admit what you have done. Deny it to the ends of the earth. When you are accused of it deny it outright and claim to be most offended that they would even think you capable of such a thing.

you might feel you have done nothing wrong and have noting to be ashamed of but the reality is you have most likely brought about the end of your sister in laws source of employment and income. not only that but if the revenue become involved she could be looking at a massive tax bill and penalties. She could in theory be prosecuted by a couple of different state bodies.

Get your story straight and stick with it.

pickarooney · 06-07-2012 3:09pm

You sound like you're making a huge drama out of something that doesn't need to be. Your responsibility is to your child and it's a bit pathetic that you can't stand up to him and he can't stand up to his sister and that your child should suffer for the sake of these ridiculous histrionics.

'World War 3' 'holy hell' 'all out war' - no, there was a disagreement between your immediate family and your extended family about something which is none of their business.

You do what you need to do for your children, plain and simple.

irishbarb · 06-07-2012 3:12pm

farmchoice wrote: »

you might feel you have done nothing wrong and have noting to be ashamed of but the reality is you have most likely brought about the end of your sister in laws source of employment and income. not only that but if the revenue become involved she could be looking at a massive tax bill and penalties. She could in theory be prosecuted by a couple of different state bodies.

That's not the OPs fault, that is the SIL's fault for operating illegally.

farmchoice · 06-07-2012 3:42pm

irishbarb wrote: »

That's not the OPs fault, that is the SIL's fault for operating illegally.

very true, but im not sure the sister in law or her family are going to see it that way.

carolinespring · 06-07-2012 3:51pm

The OP had nothing wrong and I find it amazing that some people think she has.

Her sister in law can mind 3 pre school children without notifying to the HSE but must as soon as she takes on the 4th child and with 8 under 4 years she is well out of line.

OP is also right in informing the HSA. By the sounds of it no Health and Safety was in place, plus a injury happened in the workplace and must be reported. The childminder should have a safety statement, training, policies and procedures and a copy given to all parents. It sounds like a joke of a set up. My heart bleeds for the poor children who had to go to this awfu plac every day.

As for the childminder tax affairs, I am glad the OP reported her. 1600.00 per week from the pre schollers without counting what she was charging for the 5 after schools, who I am sure are full time during the holidays so she was taking in at least 8000.00 a month and not paying a red cent on it.... and not spending any of it on the welfare of the children in her care.
She deserves all she gets. No wonder Ireland is in such a state with that kind of crap going on. I personally hope she gets the full force of the law.

I am self employed and make sure my take affairs are in order.

Personally OP you did your children, yourself and all the other kids and parents a massive favour by reporting her. Its totally up to you if you decide to tell your husband. I am sure he won't be saying it to the in laws and he has no reason to be mad at you. You did what was right for your little girls. I do think your husband is a major whim who needs to man up.

I hope all goes ok when you collect this evening and try and relax.

Was a wonderful thread on here a while ago about how amazing a childminder was. Might be worth reading. Think it was called heartbroken.

If you feel you can let us know what happens, but do move you kids to someplace they will be safe and happy.

Well done you!! xx

yellowlabrador · 06-07-2012 3:53pm

I would advise you to take time off and stop sending your children to an unsafe environment. I would do this now, not wait. Maybe unpaid leave? it's an emergency after all. There may be hostility towards your children after this and they are too small to cope. You can then arrange alternative care. Tell your husband that he can go on financing his sister if that is what he wants.

Calhoun · 06-07-2012 4:16pm

GarIT wrote: »

If it was me I'd move them somewhere else and tell the husband you'll look for a divorce if he can't man up about it. I'd also own up about calling, tell them what they were doing was illegal and to sue you if they have a problem.

Your sister is doing f all, taking in €1,600 per week and not paying tax, what you did was right.

Couldnt agree more with this what are you unoffical dole for your crazy sister in law? I mean you are paying for a service and from the sounds of it an expensive one at that. If she doesnt cut the mustard move your kids you owe her nothing.

You need to be more assertive when it comes to your kid, when it comes to raising your kids there is no time for arguments or discussion with anyone but your husband advise them that who you send them to is none of their business and the conversation is over.

Finally, i would strongly consider cutting contact from his family members. They have been nothing but disrespectful and think how they have treated your kids, could they be spiteful or mean to them in the future if left in contact with them? this whole situation would be a dealbreaker for me i would not trust any of them to be around them again.

If your husband doesnt agree well like Gar said divorce him, if he is more worried about keeping the peace than his families welfare he isnt worth anything.

daenerysstormborn3 · 06-07-2012 4:22pm

unhappy out wrote: »

Did I do the right thing and what would you have done?

Yes, you did the right thing and I would have done the same.

Not reporting carry on like this is what makes it so easy for people to scam the system in this country. Too many people worried about what the neighbours might think if it comes out that you reported someone carrying out illegal activity. Some of you may not believe this but this level of scamming the system is rife and it has a knock on effect on all of us.

Skid · 06-07-2012 4:28pm

unhappy out wrote: »

my husband had a big row over it and he dos not want to fall out with them but after a lot of me pushing agrees that they would better someplace else but is not perpared to move them and cause "upset" to his Sister and Mother.

Your Husband really need to sort out his priorities.

You did the right thing, given the circumstances.

secman · 06-07-2012 4:37pm

GJH Tatts wrote: »

I think that is an incredibly sly and underhanded thing to do.

Why not just take your children out, rather than ratting on a family member like this.

When your husband finds out what you did to his sister, be prepared for the consequences....blood is thicker than water.

And you would still feel this way if God forbid a more serious accident happened and a child died ? If it was your child ? Some people are thicker than planks ! The childeren here are the priority not his sister who does not seem to give a flying fcuk.

OP you did the right thing.

Secman

GarIT · 06-07-2012 4:44pm

Calhoun wrote: »

If your husband doesnt agree well like Gar said divorce him, if he is more worried about keeping the peace than his families welfare he isnt worth anything.

I wouldn't jump on a divorce straight away but your children should be more important to you than anything, including being more important than your husband.

The safety of your children should be more important to your husband than his family. If he can't realise that maybe he isn't fit to be a father.

DublinWriter · 06-07-2012 4:50pm

unhappy out wrote: »

My sister in law is not trained, no insurance and not HSE reg.

Your children come first, end of story.

CrazyRabbit · 06-07-2012 5:07pm

The only mistake 'unhappy out' made was allowing her kids to be minded by this sister-in-law in the first place. Relative or not, I would not have someone mind my kids if they were not up to the task.

And your husband should be ashamed of himself for putting the welfare of his kids second to his sisters employment status.

You've done the right thing.

Moonbeam · 06-07-2012 5:28pm

Is she registered with childminding Ireland?
She needs to be she registered for that amount of kids,is she insured?
I would report her to the she and social services.

username123 · 06-07-2012 5:39pm

You did the right thing. Im not sure you did it for the right reasons.

I do not understand why you did not put your foot down about where your child was being sent and ignored interference from the in laws.

I do not understand why you continued to send your child, then children there while clearly so unhappy with the service.

As for reporting her - should have been done years ago.

Massive issue with childminder

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