The Next XBox - Rumour Thread

Kinski · 10-03-2012 2:14pm

Don't want a download-only future, but if this effectively means a return to cartridges then I'm for it (been longing for that!)

McGrath5 · 10-03-2012 3:02pm

It stinks of a very Apple-esque approach, control, control and more goddam control.
This all benefits the likes or Microsoft, Sony & whoever else decide too jump aboard this ship. No benefit for the average punter or the local game store where I have been purchasing my games from for years now.
I love having my game's in a physical format, great for giving a lend of it too mates, or bringing around a copy of said game for a few hours multiplayer craic.

Stercus Accidit · 10-03-2012 3:05pm

I guess I am never going to be a console gamer again. Most games lost replay value long ago, now the majority are 8-12 hours one play affairs, killing the second hand market kills those games value, people stop buying games altogether then. Could you f*cking imagine not being able to trade in Duke Nukem Forever immediately after paying €60 for it?

gizmo · 10-03-2012 3:07pm

Perfect Choice wrote: »

It stinks of a very Apple-esque approach, control, control and more goddam control.
This all benefits the likes or Microsoft, Sony & whoever else decide too jump aboard this ship. No benefit for the average punter or the local game store where I have been purchasing my games from for years now.
I love having my game's in a physical format, great for giving a lend of it too mates, or bringing around a copy of said game for a few hours multiplayer craic.

While I much prefer having a physical copy on my shelf too, to say that there's no benefit to the customer in the long term is incorrect. Steam has proved that there are many benefits to a digital download service. The issue is the platform monopoly MS would have and how that would affect the pricing on the service.

Of course since the article states the console won't come with a disc drive and not a physical storage format, it's all kind of irrelevant.

McGrath5 · 10-03-2012 3:20pm

gizmo wrote: »

Steam has proved that there are many benefits to a digital download service. The issue is the platform monopoly MS would have and how that would affect the pricing on the service.

Would you say one the main reasons you find Steam to be benefical to the consumer is because they do not have a monopoly on the products they are selling? We all know they are a business, and like any other business they are there to make money.
The pricing structure on the likes of the PSN is quite ludicrous, for example last October I purchased FIFA 12 in a bricks and mortar store for €44.99 while up on PSN it was €69.99.
I know the article has no reference to Sony, but if this is a taste of things to come then I doubt I will be buying into the next generation of consoles.

gizmo · 10-03-2012 3:23pm

Perfect Choice wrote: »

Would you say one the main reasons you find Steam to be benefical to the consumer is because they do not have a monopoly on the products they are selling? We all know they are a business, and like any other business they are there to make money.
The pricing structure on the likes of the PSN is quite ludicrous, for example last October I purchased FIFA 12 in a bricks and mortar store for €44.99 while up on PSN it was €69.99.
I know the article has no reference to Sony, but if this is a taste of things to come then I doubt I will be buying into the next generation of consoles.

Nope, I was referring to the ability to have your entire library of games accessible to you with a few clicks of a button (and a couple of gigs download of course) combined with automated patching when required.

Other Steam specific benefits are their crazy sales during the year and other community-based features.

Overheal · 10-03-2012 4:35pm

Perfect Choice wrote: »

I for one really hope this does not happen. You can't beat the feeling of going into town to get your new game on launch day, something about ordering online is not the same.

Yeah, here's how that works:

Me | Pre-Order PC Game, discounted price/free Publisher's title on Steam | Pre-load content 3 days earlier |Play the pre-order bonus (Darksiders with Space Marine Pre-Order. Brilliant)||Comfortable PJs, warm aromatic fire||TV/Video Games|Countdown with a beer|Midnight happens | Micro-update | Playing!||Unlock 1st Achievement||||Unlock 2nd Achievement||||get on forums and say how great/terrible this game is|||tired, sleep
You | Buy PC Game, Full price in Gamestop with Re-skinned horse armor | Wait anxiously | Spend fuel driving to store | Go wait outside a store in the cold | Huddle inside a warm store with sweaty nerds | Take in the smell of sweaty nerds | Exchange stories about World of Warcraft | Wait in line for Pre-vouch | Midnight! | Wait in line for copy | Drive home | Expend more fuel | Unlock the front door | Lock the front door | Open CD Tray | Close CD Tray | Spinning... Please Wait | Install | Downloading patches | Read lackluster game manual | Downloading Patches | read forum feedback from people who have already started playing | Play hours later | Too tired, Sleep

My example might be PC but in a future where you can pre-load playstation games to your hard drive, it's really the same thing. You still end up having to "Install" the fupping things.

gizmo · 10-03-2012 4:44pm

See that "Me" column Overheal? I see you that and raise you the joy of cracking open the cellophane on a case followed by that lovely new game smell. :pac:

Antar Bolaeisk · 10-03-2012 4:49pm

It's just a glorified cd holder which serves to only take up space on the shelf, there's next to nothing in them these days bar the single, A5 "manual" and the advertisements for other games you should be buying.

Overheal · 10-03-2012 4:58pm

There has to be something special about the box to warrant that. BF3? ****ed that into the bin. Code was got, that was all I needed (Christmas gift). Skyrim, sure, I did that, just to see if pre-ordering wasn't terrible. It is. Foldout map, and the reverse side of the box art served as 2 nice additions to the wall, but the rest was thrown out, including the CD.

Myrddin · 10-03-2012 4:58pm

The download only model was grazed somewhat with the PSP Go, & we all know what a roaring success that was.

jaykhunter · 10-03-2012 5:21pm

Overheal wrote: »

My example might be PC but in a future where you can pre-load playstation games to your hard drive, it's really the same thing. You still end up having to "Install" the fupping things.

Gosh if you could download food you'd never need to talk a human ever again! I love going into a store and buying a sealed new copy to bring home. Not looking forward to 'unwrapping' a steam download code come Christmas morning.

Overheal · 10-03-2012 5:29pm

jaykhunter wrote: »

Gosh if you could download food you'd never need to talk a human ever again! I love going into a store and buying a sealed new copy to bring home. Not looking forward to 'unwrapping' a steam download code come Christmas morning.

-No, I would still buy food? Remember Tesco delivery has been around for years. Who actually uses it? I pick out my own produce thanks; but we're talking about a homogenous product here: a video game.

-Christmas would be the only time I would gift a physical copy of something. Though often not even then. It's impractical. Though I typically don't only gift someone a game. And in receiving a game, oh no, one less thing to rip open and discard? I don't exactly recall any particular instance of ripping open a video game and being over the moon about it anyway. Want to be cool? Buy the game guide and stick the Steam Receipt in it.

gizmo · 10-03-2012 5:48pm

Antar Bolaeisk wrote: »

It's just a glorified cd holder which serves to only take up space on the shelf, there's next to nothing in them these days bar the single, A5 "manual" and the advertisements for other games you should be buying.

And? There are plenty of people who like getting something physical for their money, opening it and enjoying it and then having it sit there on the shelf. I'm not saying either approach is better in any way, I'm simply saying that the death of the physical copy will be a disappointment to many folk.

Overheal wrote: »

-No, I would still buy food? Remember Tesco delivery has been around for years. Who actually uses it? I pick out my own produce thanks; but we're talking about a homogenous product here: a video game.

Amusingly enough, me.

Overheal · 10-03-2012 6:33pm

gizmo wrote: »

Amusingly enough, me.

Antar Bolaeisk · 10-03-2012 6:41pm

gizmo wrote: »

And? There are plenty of people who like getting something physical for their money, opening it and enjoying it and then having it sit there on the shelf. I'm not saying either approach is better in any way, I'm simply saying that the death of the physical copy will be a disappointment to many folk.

I'm completely with you on the physical stuff when it comes to proper special editions (not those crappy ones that come with extra in-game skins), in fact I'm very tempted to bump my contribution to Double Fine's Adventure Venture just to get the box (and the snazzy t-shirt) but when it comes to the generi-box which oft-times contains little or nothing extra, I just don't see the appeal. For me the plastic box is opened once when the game is installed and that's generally it. It adds nothing to the experience (bar that new game smell you just don't have with downloads

) and just sits on a shelf gathering dust thereafter (although that's what the collectibles do as well but in a much cooler way...).

gizmo · 10-03-2012 7:01pm

Overheal wrote: »

On the basis that I haven't received an unacceptable item from them since starting about three years ago, here's how it works...

Me | Decide to do shopping whenever I have a few minutes to spare in front of a computer | Login to Tesco website | Order items having alternate/cheaper/similar items only a click away | Know how much shopping costs as I add items to my basket | Choose time and day for shopping to be delivered | Checkout | Open door when delivery guy rings during delivery time | Help him bring in one or two boxes of bags | Take bags out of box and put them on counter | Unpack shopping from bags and put away | Put feet up | Play video games | Play more video games | Begin to consume purchased items
You | Choose a time to go to Tesco either after work during the week or during ones precious weekend | Waste money on petrol driving to Tesco | Make sure you have a euro coin for the trolley | Navigate the aisles of the shop avoiding the usual array of inconsiderate shoppers | Ensure you have everything on your list either by remembering it or carrying a list around with you | Get to the checkout and queue | Unload your shopping onto the counter to pay for it | Repack your shopping and put it back in the trolley | Go back out to your car and unload the shopping into your car | Drive home wasting more money on petrol | Take shopping out of the car and bring it into your house | Unpack shopping from bags and put away | Realise you've just wasted an hour or two of your life | Begin to consume purchased items

:pac:

Antar Bolaeisk wrote: »

I'm completely with you on the physical stuff when it comes to proper special editions (not those crappy ones that come with extra in-game skins), in fact I'm very tempted to bump my contribution to Double Fine's Adventure Venture just to get the box (and the snazzy t-shirt) but when it comes to the generi-box which oft-times contains little or nothing extra, I just don't see the appeal. For me the plastic box is opened once when the game is installed and that's generally it. It adds nothing to the experience (bar that new game smell you just don't have with downloads ) and just sits on a shelf gathering dust thereafter (although that's what the collectibles do as well but in a much cooler way...).

That box just sitting there is enough for me, at least for now until I rid myself of the desire to own them. I guess that's what it is, a stronger feeling of ownership of something when you can hold it in your hands. I'm the same way with music and books, moreso with the latter, I just don't get the same level of enjoyment out of an ebook. The former is just because I'll never ever pay for a song encoded with a lossess codec.

noodler · 11-03-2012 1:49am

You're a strange person Overheal.

ShadowHearth · 11-03-2012 10:49am

I used to LOVE having Boxed version for my games, but if i have a choice i will go for digital.

steam makes you FAT! yes, it does! you dont even need to go to shop and get some exercise anymore!

Anyway a much as i agree that there are tons of people who still love to have physical copy i personally dont care bout it much when it comes to PC.
When you buy a pc game, you buy a code and nothing more. When i enter that code online in to steam and install game, then i can just throw away box with disc. if i uninstall the game i usually just get steam to redownload ( yes, fat and lazy to get it of the shelf! :pac: )
problem is, that any way you look at it you need internet connection to play pc game. you need the damn authorisation to even install it, so if you got internet connection in the first place then why on earth bother with boxes anymore.

when it comes to consoles i like my boxed games, because they dont need internet connection and in 20 years i will be able to pop that fecker in and show my kids what sort of looser theyr daddy was!

( i dont trade in my games! )

now Vita is different for me. for that platform i try to go digital as much as possible. games are so little and fragile! its so easy to break them! It is a handheld console to, so if you are outside and drop it on a ground and not carpet, then it will be fecked! really stupid design by sony!
Then ofc swaping games is a pain in a hole! the bay is really annoying, even worse when you are not in comfort of your home.
PS vita feels like some iphone to me, so i can just click and play game i have on my screen! So thats why i prefer my digital games on it, i dont need to click then go find a game and swap it!

Azure_sky · 11-03-2012 1:08pm

Corporatism at it's worst. If this is true then, combined with the "DLC" fiasco, many people will just get fed up with video games. Lots of job losses in high streets too due to the death of the second hand market and it being the next evolutionary step towards intangible media.

The only business people (except the giant corporations)who will benefit will be people who set up small second hand retro game shops, as people like myself become disillusioned with modern gaming.

sports_ · 11-03-2012 1:12pm

I heard you cant hare games?

Mr E · 11-03-2012 1:37pm

Thread renamed to something a little less incendiary.
Read the article, peeps....

It's still rumour mill territory, so take with a grain of salt.

stevenmu · 11-03-2012 2:14pm

There was a rumour a while ago that they would prevent trade-ins by writing something back to the game media which ties it to the console or live account. A solid state distribution method would make writing information back the game media very easy. If you join the hypothetical dots ...

Blowfish · 11-03-2012 2:29pm

Azure_sky wrote: »

Corporatism at it's worst. If this is true then, combined with the "DLC" fiasco, many people will just get fed up with video games. Lots of job losses in high streets too due to the death of the second hand market and it being the next evolutionary step towards intangible media.

The only business people (except the giant corporations)who will benefit will be people who set up small second hand retro game shops, as people like myself become disillusioned with modern gaming.

Out of curiosity, given that moving to digital distribution has been an inevitability for years now, why exactly would you 'become disillusioned with modern gaming' because of it? It just seems a little OTT to stop gaming because the distribution method changes, particularly since it's moving to a method that has already proven to be sucessful.

Otacon · 12-03-2012 1:12pm

Blowfish wrote: »

Out of curiosity, given that moving to digital distribution has been an inevitability for years now, why exactly would you 'become disillusioned with modern gaming' because of it? It just seems a little OTT to stop gaming because the distribution method changes, particularly since it's moving to a method that has already proven to be sucessful.

Many gamers use trading in as a way to finance new game purchases. I rarely buy second-hand but I have traded in some games in order to get new ones.

With DD coming in, I can certainly understand people feeling that 1. they will not be able to buy as many games as they used to because of the above reason and 2. because there is very little reason for publishers to reduce their prices on a digital market.

noodler · 12-03-2012 1:19pm

Really, we need retailers to still provide download codes for such games in order to ensure some element of competition.

V9 · 12-03-2012 2:11pm

Can't see the physical copy of games going away tbh. Is there not money to be made from various collectors editions and the like?

gizmo · 12-03-2012 2:55pm

Otacon wrote: »

Many gamers use trading in as a way to finance new game purchases. I rarely buy second-hand but I have traded in some games in order to get new ones.

With DD coming in, I can certainly understand people feeling that 1. they will not be able to buy as many games as they used to because of the above reason and 2. because there is very little reason for publishers to reduce their prices on a digital market.

The bigger question is whether the lost revenue from the diminished new sales due to a possible elimination of the second hand market outweighs the current loss of revenue from the second hand market itself.

My guess is a resounding no.

Blowfish · 12-03-2012 4:52pm

gizmo wrote: »

The bigger question is whether the lost revenue from the diminished new sales due to a possible elimination of the second hand market outweighs the current loss of revenue from the second hand market itself.

My guess is a resounding no.

True, but if you add in the cost reduction due to no third party, no physical medium, no transport, reduced labour etc., it's not quite such a straightforward answer.

gizmo · 12-03-2012 5:39pm

Blowfish wrote: »

True, but if you add in the cost reduction due to no third party, no physical medium, no transport, reduced labour etc., it's not quite such a straightforward answer.

I'm not really talking about digital distribution. I was referring to the argument that sales of new games will fall because the people who trade their games in to fund their purchases will no longer be able to do so. While this will probably be true, as I said above, I don't think the revenue drop will be larger than the amount lost due to the actual sale of those second hand titles.

Or, to be more precise, I think there would be a net increase in new sales should the second hand market be eliminated. So while retailers will obviously lose out, publishers/developers would benefit.

The Next XBox - Rumour Thread

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