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Shannon supplying water to Dublin?

1356

Comments

  • #62
    Boardmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 54 ✭✭Boardmaster


    "This Shannon Water Scheme wouldn't be an issue in Germany....

    Problem:Loads of water and flooding in location A. Lots of thirsty people in location B.
    Solution: Pipe."

    True and not true as in Germany they would just fix the leaking pipes first instead of digging a big trench across the country.

    The Germans did build Ardnacrusha though. :)


  • #63
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Jayuu wrote: »
    +1

    The amount of wasted water is nothing short of a national scandal. Fixing and replacing outdated pipes would surely not only be a good way of creating employment but also be kinder to the environment. Fresh drinkable water is becomming an increasingly more scare and valuable resource. We should be acting now to preserve our supply. But no, our reaction is to throw more water at the problem.

    Reminds me of when the Millennium Clock was put in the Liffey and you couldn't see it clearly because the river was too dirty. The suggested solution was to make the display brighter. Nobody ever suggested trying to make the river cleaner! :rolleyes:

    The Liffey is that colour because it passes through bogland, not because it is polluted.


  • #64
    aDeener
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,487 ✭✭✭aDeener


    dubhthach wrote: »
    Indeed, alot of these people are the ones crying when their houses get flooded and shout "Drain the Shannon", however I think they prefer that the water was drained into the ocean instead of by thirsty Dubliners.

    Personally from a local goverment point of view I think counties should be abolished and replaced by provinces. It's kinda funny that Dublin corporation has an equivalent population within it's boundary as the whole of Connacht. Another good example of "GAA mentality" is the issue of Limerick and Waterford city boundaries.

    :rolleyes:


  • #65
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    Draining the shannon simply shouldn't be tolerated, half the water would probably leak and flood some village. Dublin is like a sponge draining the nation's resources, just fix the leaks in dublin and there won't be a problem.


  • #66
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »
    Draining the shannon simply shouldn't be tolerated, half the water would probably leak and flood some village. Dublin is like a sponge draining the nation's resources, just fix the leaks in dublin and there won't be a problem.

    Said "sponge" is providing the money to the rest of the country.

    If I can stop paying tax to subvent the midwest, I'll happily pay that money to source water from somewhere else. It'll still be a massive net saving.


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  • #67
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    You'll be a long time paying for anglo and all the other IFSC bankers that have ruined the country. LOL


  • #68
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »
    You'll be a long time paying for anglo and all the other IFSC bankers that have ruined the country. LOL

    That has no relevance to my post, whatsoever.


  • #69
    helimachoptor
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 21,639 Mod ✭✭✭✭helimachoptor


    MYOB wrote: »
    That has no relevance to my post, whatsoever.
    Their HQ's are in Dublin :)


  • #70
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    Correct helim.

    Incompetence stemming from dublin has ruined the country, be it the bankers or the likes of bertie ahern.


  • #71
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    helimachoptor wrote: »
    Their HQ's are in Dublin :)

    Still irrelevant. The entire country outside the greater dublin area is reliant on transfers from the GDA.

    In return, we take water. Live with it.


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  • #72
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    Factually incorrect.

    The entire country is dependent on borrowings to the tune of circa €20bn annually. Where the government decides to place IDA companies is of little relevance. They are in ireland for low corporation tax rates.


  • #73
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »
    Factually incorrect.

    No its not.


  • #74
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    Without borrowings from abroad the country goes under.
    Without MNC's every region in the country will see massive unemployment.
    No county in the country is self sufficient apart from Mayo (had bertie ahern and ray burke not signed the deal of the millenium from Shell's point of view).

    What we need is to maximise our resources, and fixing leaking pipes imo is a far more productive solution than draining a river.


  • #75
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    ...you're still rabbiting on irrelevantly

    Ireland minus Dublin is bankrupt. Gone. Done for. When there was no need for borrowing, everywhere outside of Dublin survived off Dublin's tax. Now it'd not be able to get the loans it survives without Dublin's remaining commercial/industrial/services base.

    You're deluding yourself if you think Dublin isn't supporting the entire country. I'd invite any of the "hands off our water" people to opt out of taking any benefits they get from Dublin.


  • #76
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    You are unfortunately still failing to grasp the concept.

    Take dublin out of ireland, and cork will readily take the intels, ibms, govt hq, etc, etc. Shannon has many MNC's. I don't think they can claim to be sustaining other regions because say, if Intel didn't move there, they'd be elsewhere.

    It's only natural resources that seperate the haves from the have-nots.


  • #77
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »
    You are unfortunately still failing to grasp the concept.

    Take dublin out of ireland, and cork will readily take the intels, ibms, govt hq, etc, etc. Shannon has many MNC's. I don't think they can claim to be sustaining other regions because say, if Intel didn't move there, they'd be elsewhere.

    It's only natural resources that seperate the haves from the have-nots.

    no, its you that is flailing around, I'd suspect deliberately refusing to understand my point

    The "intels, ibms, govt hq, etc, etc." are in Dublin. They need resources such as water. They provide the support that allows the midwest, etc, to remain inhabited, hence they can quite justifiably take water from the midwest and not expect the midwest to get whimpery.

    However, they're getting whimpery for some reason.


  • #78
    Boardmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 54 ✭✭Boardmaster


    MYOB wrote: »
    ...you're still rabbiting on irrelevantly

    Ireland minus Dublin is bankrupt. Gone. Done for. When there was no need for borrowing, everywhere outside of Dublin survived off Dublin's tax. Now it'd not be able to get the loans it survives without Dublin's remaining commercial/industrial/services base.

    You're deluding yourself if you think Dublin isn't supporting the entire country. I'd invite any of the "hands off our water" people to opt out of taking any benefits they get from Dublin.

    Not sure i agree with this but also think this might be for another thread. If we keep this on track as we are one country and should balance the nations needs not just our own area, but having said that I think we all agree that Dublin has leaky pipes which causes a lot of waste. I would be under the impression that the pipes should be fixed first rather having more water thrown at a system which is not 100%.

    Just imagine you had a water tank at home which supplied your water but before it reached you a lot of water leaked along the way. Would throw more water at it or fix the pipe as a starting point?

    Then you can start looking at other options...


  • #79
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The problem of leaky pipes isn't something you can wave a magic wand it. Its a problem that water utilities, private and public, across the entire world cannot solve properly and they've been trying for hundreds of years.

    Its not the solution to the problems in Dublin and even if it was, it'd only solve it short term. The Shannon plan is to cover growth for decades, just as the Wicklow ones were before.


  • #80
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    Exactly Boardmaster.

    Who is to say in a few years time the new pipes wouldn't be leaking, and my concern is the affect it would have on the ecosystem of the river.


  • #81
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users Posts: 6,699 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    liammur wrote: »
    Exactly Boardmaster.

    Who is to say in a few years time the new pipes wouldn't be leaking, and my concern is the affect it would have on the ecosystem of the river.

    The plan is to take the water from Lough Derg which is a very deep lake (36m at its deepest) and is quite close to the mouth of the river (the river becomes tidal at Limerick, so you end up with "Brackish" water which isn't drinkable) so it will have very little effect on the ecosystem of the Shannon. With the new reservoir in Offaly to store the water it could be argued that this project will have a possitive net effect on aquatic ecosystems in this country.

    Fixing the leaks is an ongoing process and it is being improved gradually every year. It is not possible to dig up all the roads around Dublin and lay all new pipes because of the disruption it would could. And even if you did get your way and they fixed all the leaks around the city you would complain that Dublin is getting such an upgrade to its water network at the expense of somewhere else!


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  • #82
    Sponge Bob
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭Sponge Bob


    Dublin would need water even if there were no leaks, the leakage in Dublin is a LOT lower than in most rural counties not least because money was spent to fix them. But having fixed many of the leaks they need water and this scheme would sort not only Dublin but Kildare and Meath and Laois too.

    ecosystem of the river , pahhh :(


  • #83
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    'The plan is to take the water from Lough Derg which is a very deep lake (36m at its deepest) and is quite close to the mouth of the river (the river becomes tidal at Limerick, so you end up with "Brackish" water which isn't drinkable) so it will have very little effect on the ecosystem of the Shannon. With the new reservoir in Offaly to store the water it could be argued that this project will have a possitive net effect on aquatic ecosystems in this country.

    Fixing the leaks is an ongoing process and it is being improved gradually every year. It is not possible to dig up all the roads around Dublin and lay all new pipes because of the disruption it would could. And even if you did get your way and they fixed all the leaks around the city you would complain that Dublin is getting such an upgrade to its water network at the expense of somewhere else!

    --



    Nonsense

    And the worrying part of it is you may actyally believe it.


  • #84
    Sponge Bob
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 25,234 ✭✭✭✭Sponge Bob


    The intake will be in Offaly not on Lough Derg, read the thread properly :(


  • #85
    markpb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,239 ✭✭✭markpb


    liammur wrote: »
    Who is to say in a few years time the new pipes wouldn't be leaking

    You could worry about that. Or you could accept that a lot of the really bad pipes under Dublin are Victorian era and that they're leaking because of their age. The new pipes will be... well... new.
    liammur wrote: »
    Nonsense. And the worrying part of it is you may actyally believe it.

    That's a well-constructed argument!


  • #86
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »
    '


    Nonsense

    And the worrying part of it is you may actyally believe it.

    I'm starting to suspect you're a troll.


  • #87
    Lu Tze
    Registered Users Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭Lu Tze


    markpb wrote: »
    You could worry about that. Or you could accept that a lot of the really bad pipes under Dublin are Victorian era and that they're leaking because of their age. The new pipes will be... well... new.

    Its not strictly true. A lot of the 80-90 year old cast or spun iron pipes are still structurally sound. The DoEHLG in their latest WSIP budget have pushed for network rehabilitation across the country.

    This shouldn't be done yet as far as I am concerned.

    I heard (i work in the industry) that DCC did a trial on a discrete area of the water network, replacing every pipe in the area, and leakage was still high (they did it to show the departments plan for network renewal wasn't the magic bullet for reducing leakage that it has been made out to be).

    The most of the leakage is on supply pipes to houses, within private property, and won't be fixed until the domestic meters are in i.e. people are paying for the water which is pissing out underneath their driveway into the nearest sewer.

    All that said, they should have a budget every year to renew 5-10% of their water networks, as it is needed in conjunction with the private side leaks being fixed.


  • #88
    markpb
    Registered Users Posts: 9,239 ✭✭✭markpb


    Lu Tze wrote: »
    The most of the leakage is on supply pipes to houses, within private property, and won't be fixed until the domestic meters are in i.e. people are paying for the water which is pissing out underneath their driveway into the nearest sewer.

    I'd well believe that but I don't think DCC are sitting on their laurels. I was in a rented property five years ago that had a leak underneath which was spotted by DCC. We got two warnings (which the landlord ignored) before they cut off our water supply.


  • #89
    liammur
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,461 ✭✭✭liammur


    MYOB

    'I'm starting to suspect you're a troll. '

    ---

    You have a canny knack of getting everything wrong


  • #90
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,523 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    liammur wrote: »

    You have a canny knack of getting everything wrong

    Another fantastically detailed argument there...


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  • #91
    paulm17781
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,858 ✭✭✭paulm17781


    I don't remember the report, I thought Dublin leaked less than the rest of the country. I am near certain every county (even the ones around the Shannon!) had leaking pipes.

    DCC wrote to my parents about a leak in their house recently, it has since been fixed. Seemingly they are trying to fix all the leaking problems.


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