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Living off the grid...

24

Comments

  • #32
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    There's an absolute bollox load of investment required to build and maintain the generating capacity (I presume we're talking renewable?), and then another fat sum for the batteries. You need about 1 weeks peak supply apparently in batteries to manage a continuous supply of electricity.

    Not worth the investment from a financial point of view, but may be fun I guess...


  • #33
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    enda1 wrote: »
    There's an absolute bollox load of investment required to build and maintain the generating capacity (I presume we're talking renewable?), and then another fat sum for the batteries. You need about 1 weeks peak supply apparently in batteries to manage a continuous supply of electricity.

    Not worth the investment from a financial point of view, but may be fun I guess...

    if you use old car batteries then you can cut out a lot of the investment. what you'd save on standing charges from the ESB will buy you a fairly decent solar panel every year

    an awful lot of it will be cutting out electricity usage. no dishwasher, immersion heater or anything of the sort. you can use 12v lights and appliances where possible so you can get away with a lower power inverter

    you'd need backboiler & solar water heating, bottled gas cooking or if you consider that cheating a solar concentrator or roast your meat on the spit.


  • #34
    GavRedKing
    Registered Users Posts: 53,262 ✭✭✭✭GavRedKing


    Spore wrote: »
    Right, I've quit my job and just got my train ticket otta' here. Gonna give it a try, see how long I last before I crack...

    I'll ease myself into it, get a small apartment some place. Get rid of the phone first. Close all my internet accounts. Get myself site-wide banned from boards.ie. Take out all my savings in cash. Cut up credit cards / laser cards. Get a cash-in-hand job (though savings should see me through a few months). I'll keep a diary for when I do crack and end up posting all on boards.ie...

    So boards, cheerio, take care. It's been swell!

    You site-banned yet nah? May I suggest winding up a Mod or post something risky go out all guns blazing.


  • #35
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    Daegerty wrote: »
    if you use old car batteries then you can cut out a lot of the investment. what you'd save on standing charges from the ESB will buy you a fairly decent solar panel every year

    an awful lot of it will be cutting out electricity usage. no dishwasher, immersion heater or anything of the sort. you can use 12v lights and appliances where possible so you can get away with a lower power inverter

    you'd need backboiler & solar water heating, bottled gas cooking or if you consider that cheating a solar concentrator or roast your meat on the spit.
    Batteries don't work to well with wind power. You know how if you don't let the battery in you phone go down to empty and fully charge it again it shortens the life span of your battery? It ends up not being able to hold much of a charge for any amount of time.

    This is a big problem with wind power storage, because it may only fill half the battery and then the wind dies, it kills batteries rapidly.


  • #36
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    ScumLord wrote: »
    Batteries don't work to well with wind power. You know how if you don't let the battery in you phone go down to empty and fully charge it again it shortens the life span of your battery? It ends up not being able to hold much of a charge for any amount of time.

    This is a big problem with wind power storage, because it may only fill half the battery and then the wind dies, it kills batteries rapidly.

    solar is a more reliable source of power, you are guaranteed some bit of power every day.

    ideally car batteries should be kept above 80% charge so you'd need a fair few of them but plenty of them available for free.


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  • #37
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    ScumLord wrote: »
    Batteries don't work to well with wind power. You know how if you don't let the battery in you phone go down to empty and fully charge it again it shortens the life span of your battery? It ends up not being able to hold much of a charge for any amount of time.

    This is a big problem with wind power storage, because it may only fill half the battery and then the wind dies, it kills batteries rapidly.

    I think this situation is less bad for NiMh than for Li Ion though. Also depending on how you manage your battery stack plays a large importance. For example if you take from all batteries simultaneously or deplete them one by one would be quite influential.

    At least I know it's possible to do as a colleague of a close friend has done exactly this in Wicklow somewhere.


  • #38
    Celly Smunt
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 9,464 ✭✭✭Celly Smunt


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HHCe4c2h_VA


    skip to 7:20,sounds perfect.


  • #39
    hardCopy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    Would you need electricity though? If I was trying to 'get away from it' I probably wouldn't want a PC or TV. Maybe a waterwheel to charge powertools for occasional repairs or something? Heat the house with locally cut wood.


  • #40
    Fukuyama
    Registered Users Posts: 3,023 ✭✭✭Fukuyama


    http://www.instructables.com/id/Cheap-Solar-Water-Heater-for-your-Home-300/

    Fairly basic. No electricity. A nice hot shower and maybe even a heating system if you're feeling creative.


  • #41
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    hardCopy wrote: »
    Would you need electricity though? If I was trying to 'get away from it' I probably wouldn't want a PC or TV. Maybe a waterwheel to charge powertools for occasional repairs or something? Heat the house with locally cut wood.

    Just because you want to live off the grid doesn't mean you want to live in the stone age


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  • #42
    yellowlabrador
    Registered Users Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭yellowlabrador


    I did it for 15 years, as a single parent with 2 kids. I had a wind generator and it's not cheap. You need NEW batteries every year and also you need solid copper wiring. The wind generator itself needs lots of maintenance and expect to spend quite a lot of time on the roof. Would I do it again? yes but without children, children are very conservative and want to be the same as everyone else. so they want tv, light to do the homework, clean clothes, let alone computers, xboxes etc. It's definitely a lifestyle choice and hard work. Chopping wood every morning to cook and heat water, washing clothes with water carried from a well, bathwater etc. In the winter, the most you can expect from alternative energy is a radio and 1 or 2 strip lights for an hour.
    A good energy source that gets overlooked is a waterturbine. If you've got land, a height difference, a good supply of water it would be more reliable than wind.


  • #43
    R P McMurphy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭R P McMurphy


    yellowlabrador wrote: »
    I did it for 15 years, as a single parent with 2 kids. I had a wind generator and it's not cheap. You need NEW batteries every year and also you need solid copper wiring. The wind generator itself needs lots of maintenance and expect to spend quite a lot of time on the roof. Would I do it again? yes but without children, children are very conservative and want to be the same as everyone else. so they want tv, light to do the homework, clean clothes, let alone computers, xboxes etc. It's definitely a lifestyle choice and hard work. Chopping wood every morning to cook and heat water, washing clothes with water carried from a well, bathwater etc. In the winter, the most you can expect from alternative energy is a radio and 1 or 2 strip lights for an hour.
    A good energy source that gets overlooked is a waterturbine. If you've got land, a height difference, a good supply of water it would be more reliable than wind.

    Why did you opt for that lifestyle and why did you leave it? I can see how it would be difficult with children given they don't want to stand out


  • #44
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    enda1 wrote: »
    At least I know it's possible to do as a colleague of a close friend has done exactly this in Wicklow somewhere.
    I have a friend who was an early adopter I have another friend who claims the battery issue has become a lot better lately. I still think storing the energy is it's biggest problem. If some creative person could find a way to convert wind energy into potential stored energy by maybe moving water so it could utilise gravity later they'd be onto a winner but a water method sounds very expensive and would have a fairly large footprint.

    I still think pooling a small towns bio waste if the best solution we know we'll always be producing tonnes of bio waste, from our own bodies output to left over food we would have a guaranteed cycle of energy and fertilizer for all time.


  • #45
    yellowlabrador
    Registered Users Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭yellowlabrador


    R P McMurphy wrote: »
    Why did you opt for that lifestyle and why did you leave it? I can see how it would be difficult with children given they don't want to stand out

    I was involved in the 'green' movement as a teenager and I've always been interested in alternative lifestyles. I speak 4 languages, have an economics degree and an engineering degree so I'm not a dropout or even a hippy.
    I started off living in a cooperative housing scheme, where we all helped build our own houses in a city, then moved to the country when my son was severely ill with asthma. I felt an outdoors, healthy lifestyle would benefit both my children. I lived first in a little wooden house on the edge of a nature reserve, with no running water or mains, but surrounded by lovely woods, cliffs and beaches. I had a variety of neighbours who were ordinary folk, but also interested in a different way of living. My kids had an idyllic childhood and they still feel privileged. The hard bit was the integration in school. I took my son and daughter out of mainstream education when my son was 7 and daughter 10. They both went back to secondary here in Ireland at 13. Mainly because I don't think it's good for children to be secluded from the 'outside' world.
    It was mainly for them that I moved back to town and all the luxuries.
    Children don't want to be different and also doing homework by candle light is quite horrible. Also teenagers want lot's of clothes and things like mobile phones etc.
    Both my children are grownup now, we're still alternative culturally but they both have good jobs and share a house in the city.
    There are more ways than one to save the planet. I'm carefull with my energy use, I'm careful in what I buy, I try to figure out hidden costs in what I consume, I make my own clothes etc.
    The cheapest way to produce electricity is to be connected to the mains, also It's always there.


  • #46
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    Imagine all the Turlough Hills throughout the country!
    Though that's very true. Batteries are a huge cost and probably the biggest investment and maintenance cost.

    Perhaps hydrogen in the future and fuel cells will provide a good storage solution. Time will tell.


  • #47
    Mr Benevolent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    Pace2008 wrote: »
    A friend of mine knows a hippy lad who lives alone completely self-sufficiently. Tends and eats his own crops, has a little well dug (bit dubious about that part as crusties are pretty averse to water), grows weed like it's nobody's business and even makes his own DMT!

    Happy as a pig in ****e by all accounts.

    He doesn't bother making his own soap then.


  • #48
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    enda1 wrote: »
    Perhaps hydrogen in the future and fuel cells will provide a good storage solution. Time will tell.
    the problem with hydrogen is it's a futuristic solution that will require the most advanced of human science to achieve and run. It'll be great for machines but on a local and home basis it's not going to be accessible to the average Joe, I don't think they'll be easily rechargeable in the home. Maybe I'm wrong and maybe they'll be dirt cheap but I doubt it.

    On a local level bio-waste is simple science that anyone could build and maintain.


  • #49
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    ScumLord wrote: »
    the problem with hydrogen is it's a futuristic solution that will require the most advanced of human science to achieve and run. It'll be great for machines but on a local and home basis it's not going to be accessible to the average Joe, I don't think they'll be easily rechargeable in the home. Maybe I'm wrong and maybe they'll be dirt cheap but I doubt it.

    On a local level bio-waste is simple science that anyone could build and maintain.

    That's why I said in the future.

    Hydrogen vehicles are not such a distant eventuality. The interesting mid-term solution will be the possibility to use your car as a storage solution. When electric cars become more popular they will act as a very useful sink of energy and source when the wind aint a blowin'.


  • #50
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    Aoifey! wrote: »
    1. Get massive loan form the bank
    2. Buy boat
    3. Acquire good quality hooker
    4. Bring boat to mysterious location nobody has ever heard of
    5. ?????
    6. PROFIT!

    Buy two boats?:confused:


  • #51
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    enda1 wrote: »
    That's why I said in the future.

    Hydrogen vehicles are not such a distant eventuality. The interesting mid-term solution will be the possibility to use your car as a storage solution. When electric cars become more popular they will act as a very useful sink of energy and source when the wind aint a blowin'.

    Hydrogen cars havn't been distant since the 70's.

    Like more efficient solar panel.


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  • #52
    enda1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭enda1


    Daegerty wrote: »
    Hydrogen cars havn't been distant since the 70's.

    Like more efficient solar panel.

    I work for an automotive company. Trust me (or not, its up to you) but commercial mass produced hydrogen vehicles will be seen in this decade.


  • #53
    InTheTrees
    Registered Users Posts: 9,900 ✭✭✭InTheTrees


    Confab wrote: »
    He doesn't bother making his own soap then.

    The DMT dulls the stinkiness.


  • #54
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    enda1 wrote: »
    I work for an automotive company. Trust me (or not, its up to you) but commercial mass produced hydrogen vehicles will be seen in this decade.

    I hope so. always thought you were a politician myself


  • #55
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    I started watching loads of documentaries since reading this thread. It really is an interesting concept. Downloaded Off the Grid: LifeOn the Mesa. It was pretty decent, but everyone there seemed to be escaping from something.

    Another documentary shows a Canadian guy and his family building a house off the grid, definitely worth the watch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoVjXV2cfus (All the other parts are on youtube). Seems like an incredible amount of work, but they seemed happy in the end. They used solar power, and a wind turbine.

    Watched some other videos of a guy who lives in a kitted-out van, and makes enough money for food and petrol with a metal detector on the beach. Says he clears up to $100 a day with coins, or more if he finds a watch.

    I really do like the green movement, I just wish technology was a little more advanced so that it would be realised on a more larger scale.


  • #56
    Daegerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,864 ✭✭✭Daegerty


    dlofnep wrote: »

    I really do like the green movement, I just wish technology was a little more advanced so that it would be realised on a more larger scale.

    Its getting better all the time, you can easily buy 17% efficient solar panels and a few years ago you couldn't get a decent LED bulb that wasn't blue. Unfortunately the sedentry xbox & facebook based lifestyle has people more dependent on electricity than ever


  • #57
    Herb Powell
    Registered Users Posts: 3,097 ✭✭✭Herb Powell


    KungPao wrote: »
    I'd love to do it.

    I'd like to live like that old dude in Red Dead Redemption, who you collect the flowers for.

    Just me and the missus in a hut, in the middle of nowhere.
    Shaggin away at the aul corpse


  • #58
    kumate_champ07
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,150 ✭✭✭kumate_champ07


    Pace2008 wrote: »
    A friend of mine knows a hippy lad who lives alone completely self-sufficiently. Tends and eats his own crops, has a little well dug (bit dubious about that part as crusties are pretty averse to water), grows weed like it's nobody's business and even makes his own DMT!

    Happy as a pig in ****e by all accounts.
    does he sell the weed? because that would negate the rest of it


  • #59
    Fukuyama
    Registered Users Posts: 3,023 ✭✭✭Fukuyama


    Guys. For anyone who is serious about dropping off the grid COMPLETELY :

    http://liveitreal.webs.com


  • #60
    niallers1
    Registered Users Posts: 799 ✭✭✭niallers1


    enda1 wrote: »
    I work for an automotive company. Trust me (or not, its up to you) but commercial mass produced hydrogen vehicles will be seen in this decade.

    Youve about 18 months left:D:D:D:D


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  • #61
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    enda1 wrote: »
    I work for an automotive company. Trust me (or not, its up to you) but commercial mass produced hydrogen vehicles will be seen in this decade.

    Only 18 months for them to take off so!


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