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How come Atheists are against anti blasphemy laws but are OK with bashing other .....

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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Sonics2k wrote: »
    :pac:



    images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS4jJWdodLt-qrGYM71Q-HqRUaAvTp3dpwN3tpNVD7P7xGAeu5L_dor-SGT


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,796 ✭✭✭Calibos


    Cocksure...to be sure to be sure


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 31,967 ✭✭✭✭Sarky


    Hmm, I am pretty certain about my own penis...


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    I've still a few questions like why cant fish do mathematics

    90ad9322_wtf-are-you-talking-about.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,092 ✭✭✭CiaranMT


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    Full skellington or something I'm not a archaeologist.

    Clearly.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,334 ✭✭✭RichieC


    Jack_Skellington.jpeg


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    FWIW, when dealing with fossils it's usually palaeontology, not archaeology.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,131 ✭✭✭✭Oranage2


    Galvasean wrote: »
    FWIW, when dealing with fossils it's usually palaeontology, not archaeology.

    Either way they should get a real job.



    Anyway and since I've been goaded into a response.


    Galvasean wrote: »
    We'll make him change! :)

    hammer.gif

    Can I just get some clarity that this cartoon hammer isnt a threat on my well being?

    I get jokes and I take it that Galvasean is using the metaphorical Maslow's 'golden hammer' meaning that he will try a different tactic to change my opinion instead of the one size fits all approach.

    But just to be sure as we know you cant take internet threats too lightly.
    RichieC wrote: »
    [IMG][/IMG]

    I see Mr. Ritchie that you're still not accepting that you were trolling the other thread. Well I will accept an apology if you're not man enough to admit your wrong doing. Or maybe atleast be more tolerant to the people that dont believe in things on anecdotal evidence.




    Alas, the thing about the fish and math, it just seems strange to me that humans being a relativity new species is the smartest but the other species who have billions of years on us are stupid, if we all evolved from the same origin then surely whales should have their under water civilisations or something. It just seems very strange, there's no way that humans have evolved from anything, we're just too smart and complex to have evolved from a plant or what not. And if evolution was true to the extent you believe then why havent some humans developed gills or wings?


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,386 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    it just seems strange to me that humans being a relativity new species is the smartest but the other species who have billions of years on us are stupid, if we all evolved from the same origin then surely whales should have their under water civilisations or something. It just seems very strange, there's no way that humans have evolved from anything, we're just too smart and complex to have evolved from a plant or what not. And if evolution was true to the extent you believe then why havent some humans developed gills or wings?
    If you want to discuss evolution, there are two threads going in A+A:

    This one if you're not interested in learning anything, and this one if you are.


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 25,866 Mod ✭✭✭✭Doctor DooM


    Oranage2 wrote: »

    Alas, the thing about the fish and math, it just seems strange to me that humans being a relativity new species is the smartest but the other species who have billions of years on us are stupid, if we all evolved from the same origin then surely whales should have their under water civilisations or something. It just seems very strange, there's no way that humans have evolved from anything, we're just too smart and complex to have evolved from a plant or what not. And if evolution was true to the extent you believe then why havent some humans developed gills or wings?

    I wish I wasn't an atheist so I could go "Dear God" right now and mean it.


    Just in case this isn't a Godwin: Human foetus' have vestigial gills: wings are pentadactyl limbs, like our hands. So we do actually have them.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Northclare


    You made a good point there Orange about evolution.

    I'm sure fish have their own version of mathematics, ffs a plant has more common sense than some people LOL

    The human feteus goes through every stage of evolution in the womb but it causes heated discussion when peoples say Atheists develop more of a reptilian brain than spiritual people :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    Either way they should get a real job.

    Curious. Would you consider a priest as having a real job?

    Oranage2 wrote: »
    Can I just get some clarity that this cartoon hammer isnt a threat on my well being?

    I get jokes and I take it that Galvasean is using the metaphorical Maslow's 'golden hammer' meaning that he will try a different tactic to change my opinion instead of the one size fits all approach.

    Not quite as intellectual an approach as the 'golden hammer', but rather more along the lines of, "We must continue to hammer the point home!"


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    Either way they should get a real job.

    Actually, I must comment on this statement again.
    Just who are you to make snide comments about archaeologists and palaeontologists no having real jobs when you have demonstrated yourself to not have the slightest clue as to what it is they actually do?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Northclare


    Oh here we go LOL


  • Registered Users Posts: 362 ✭✭SheFiend


    "Or maybe atleast be more tolerant to the people that dont believe in things on anecdotal evidence."

    This has got to be a wind up


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 31,967 ✭✭✭✭Sarky


    When did ignorance become something to be proud of? :(


  • Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    we're just too smart and complex to have evolved from a plant or what not.
    This would be a fairly typical example of where we humans vastly overestimate our position in the universe. It also shows a fundamental classical misunderstanding of what evolution is.

    To be fair, science fiction often enforces this misunderstanding.

    Evolution does not continually improve an organism in a certain way. Unlike technology which we continually make "better", even when it may not be necessary, evolution makes a organism better suited to its environment. There is no pinnacle of evolution. We will not encounter and alien species who look like us but have developed telepathy because they'd had more time to passively evolve. That's not how evolution works.

    We are not the "top" of the evolutionary tree. We are not the "most evolved" species. We have evolved to suit our environment, which is temperate, arable environments above water and roughly at sea level.
    When it comes to living on frozen tundra, we're ****. Penguins are far better evolved than we are.
    Where it comes to living in the sea, we're even worse. We can't even breathe there FFS. Practically every sea creature are millions of years more evolved than us when it comes to living in the sea.
    Very warm environments, low pressure environments, high acidity environments, all inaccessible to us. Let's face it, we're a fairly weak and flimsy bucnh when it comes down to it.

    Sure, our particular evolutionary adaptations have allowed us to create ways to temporarily exist in these environments, but that doesn't make use "more evolved". Pound for pound a whale is far superior in every single way when in the water.

    If "more evolved" is the determination of who is best able to survive and procreate in a large number of environments, then we're high up there, right? Nope. That crown goes to insects. We are way below many insect species on that measure, we can't even compete with their evolutionary position on it.

    What we do have is this large brain which has allowed us to develop complex speech and language. This allows for complex ideas to be communicated and formulated succinctly to other members of our species. Other animals are capable of complex reasoning and logic, but they are largely incapable of communicating these thoughts to other members of their species. So when they get a good idea, that good idea dies with them.
    Unforunately this adaptation also allows us to communicate both good and stupid ideas such as the idea that we are very important, very special, and "top" of any chain.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Can we just change the thread title to 'How come Orange2 has no bloody clue about anything?'


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,386 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    SheFiend wrote: »
    This has got to be a wind up
    Looks like one to me.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 724 ✭✭✭Northclare


    It's only a wind up if your wound up.

    Google "John Moriarty Prometheus and the Dolphin"


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Can we just change the thread title to 'How come Orange2 has no bloody clue about anything?'

    DO NOT even joke about changing thread titles!!!:eek:

    *cue flashbacks of that Spanish bishop thread*


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,131 ✭✭✭✭Oranage2


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Can we just change the thread title to 'How come Orange2 has no bloody clue about anything?'

    A little harsh dont you think, perhaps I was also harsh with the job commenting, nobody should put anybody down for doing a job they love.

    robindch wrote: »
    Looks like one to me.

    I thought I asked reasonable questions and gave reasonable answers - Perhaps I'm not as 'educated' about some matters as much as some of the other members here but doesnt mean i'm on a wind up.
    Sarky wrote: »
    When did ignorance become something to be proud of? :(


    “He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”

    ~Thomas Jefferson


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    A little harsh dont you think, perhaps I was also hash with the job commenting, nobody should put anybody down for doing a job they love.

    Alright cool.Clean slate so?
    Oranage2 wrote: »
    “He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”

    ~Thomas Jefferson

    Did you know Thomas Jefferson was a keen palaeontologist?
    http://www.ansp.org/museum/jefferson/


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Galvasean wrote: »



    Did you know Thomas Jefferson was a keen palaeontologist?
    http://www.ansp.org/museum/jefferson/

    and slave owner who paradoxically also stated that all men were born equal...


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Bannasidhe wrote: »
    and slave owner who paradoxically also stated that all men were born equal...

    That's not a paradox. They were born equal. They were just made unequal when wrapped in chains and forced to work on cotton plantations.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭CerebralCortex


    Oranage2 wrote: »


    “He who knows nothing is closer to the truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”

    ~Thomas Jefferson

    :rolleyes: The religious claim to know the truth!


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    Galvasean wrote: »
    That's not a paradox. They were born equal. They were just made unequal when wrapped in chains and forced to work on cotton plantations.

    It is when the plantation they were born on - into slavery - belonged to Jefferson - not to mention that some of those slaves were also Jefferson's biological children:D.

    Sorry - I have a thing about Jefferson. I see him held up as some enlightened figurehead and advocate of freedom when in reality he lived (very well) because the slaves at Monticello did all the bloody work and he justified this by resorting to race theories about the superiority of whites...:mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    :rolleyes: The religious claim to know the truth!

    To Jefferson's credit he took a very scientific approach to religion. He followed the teachings of Jesus Christ but seemed very much at odds with the idea of organised religion. He also dismissed the idea of God being a non-physical entity, insisting that he must be matter based to exist (he did believe in God, but to him God was a physical being).
    He was also a Young Earth Creationist for most of his life, but through his studies in palaeontology he admitted that extinction does occur and that the world was most likely very old, while at the same time not endorsing evolution.
    Certainly one of the intellectual powerhouses of his time.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    :rolleyes: The religious claim to know the truth!

    They do don't they. What confuses me it how many different 'truths' they know. Dare I say contradictory 'truths'... I dare, I dare.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,594 ✭✭✭oldrnwisr


    Oranage2 wrote: »
    And if evolution was true to the extent you believe then why havent some humans developed gills or wings?

    Why would we wan't to develop gills. I don't even like swimming. Sure wings would be cool but I don't like the idea of having to get every piece of clothing tailor made.

    Anyway, I'm really leaning toward this being a troll at the moment but I'm willing to give you the benefit of the doubt one last time.

    As it turns out, you've got it completely arse backwards. We developed from fish-like creatures. We abandoned gills in favour of lungs. Why would we end up going back there?

    This is an SEM image of a human embryo.

    arches.png

    Those folded structures that you can see are called pharyngeal arches. These structures are found in a wide variety of animals and in fish, these develop into gills. Obviously they don't develop into gills in humans but they develop into our parathyroid and thyroid glands instead. These glands perform the same function in us as the gills do in fish, regulating calcium and they are located in roughly the same place in humans and fish (the neck). Now if you want I can post some of the research which demonstrates this but I'm getting the feeling that such research might be beyond you.


    As for the comment about humans being so much smarter than other species, that demonstrates a much more fundamental lack of understanding of evolution but seamus has already pointed out what's wrong with that comment in great detail so I'll not mince words. What he said.


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