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Main criteria when buying a car - will No1 ever be MPG for you?

  • 12-03-2012 9:38am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 32,802 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    I was recently thinking of changing my car, and was enjoying having a good old look around at the various websites.

    In the past it would have been looks, features, reliability etc that would have been my main boxes that needed ticked.

    Then it turned into road tax considerations/insurance group.

    Now with unleaded at 164.9 in my local petrol station, I am more and more looking at MPG of cars.

    I honestly think that in 5 or 10yrs we will be looking at MPG 1st before anything else, and we will be happy to drive 'uglier' cars than we would have in the past, as long as they have big mpg figures.

    If I could get a car now that looked like dung but gave me 150mpg, I'd buy it tomorrow.


«1

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,029 ✭✭✭shedweller


    It depends on where a person is at in their lives.
    Single, no kids? Drive whatever you want!
    Married, with kids? Well then, you better make sure you can afford to run whatever you buy.
    I drive a crappy little d4d yaris and get 1200-1300km per tank.
    Because i have to. Anything less efficient and i have to make sacrifices elsewhere.


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,802 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Yeah admittedly your circumstances might still make certain cars unsuitable for you eg a little Yaris would be no good if you have 5 kids, but I think that if you had such a family then you might look at cars suitable for you, and have MPG near the top of the list on that shortlist of cars? In the future of course.

    When I was single and carefree, I drove a 2 seat sports car. Couldn't have give a toss about mpg, luggage space, lack of seats for passengers. But it suited me then. Now I married with 2 little 'uns its different of course, but there are still many cars available to me, and MPG is going to be a main buying point from here on in.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    NIMAN wrote: »
    Yeah admittedly your circumstances might still make certain cars unsuitable for you eg a little Yaris would be no good if you have 5 kids, but I think that if you had such a family then you might look at cars suitable for you, and have MPG near the top of the list on that shortlist of cars? In the future of course.

    Depends how much time you spend in the car,

    If I didn't commute to work and just wanted a runaround for the weekends I'd buy a banger and have it sitting outside for runs to wherever. Then on long trips i'd rent a car.

    With commuting however MPG would be a factor but not the only one, generally the low MPG cars are not really suitable racking up 40-50k / year.

    With high mileage Motor tax would be the least of my worries.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,818 ✭✭✭✭Anan1


    Fuel costs are still a very small proportion of my overall cost of car ownership, so MPG doesn't matter much to me. That said, looks matter even less - I can't see my car when i'm in it, and i'm not overly worried for the aesthetic gratification of passing pedestrians. I value ability, the car needs to be able to do everything that I want it to do.


  • Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Anan1 wrote: »
    Fuel costs are still a very small proportion of my overall cost of car ownership, so MPG doesn't matter much to me.

    Hmm.. Opposite for me.
    Over 4 years ownership of my Fiat Bravo, I spend more on petrol for it, than on sum of anything else (including cost of purchase, maintenance, tax, insurance, parking, motorway tolls, etc).


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,106 ✭✭✭✭TestTransmission


    MPG isn't a big concern for me at the moment with the mileage I do, god knows what petrol prices will be like in a few years so I might as well enjoy it while I can.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    MPG and Co2 levels are top priority for a lot of people these days. But after the next budget that will probably change back to engine size when they change the motor tax system.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Im still at a stage in my life where I can afford to blow a high percentage of my wages on running a high expense car, so for the moment MPG isnt really an issue for me. If I decide to change car I cant see it being a high priority; certainly not at the expense of things like performance or comfort.

    That said, I have no idea what the future holds, and spending €60+ a week on petrol might not always be an option.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    djimi wrote: »
    That said, I have no idea what the future holds, and spending €60+ a week on petrol might not always be an option.

    It's killing my bank account currently spending €100 a week on petrol. :mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭pcardin


    djimi wrote: »
    Im still at a stage in my life where I can afford to blow a high percentage of my wages on running a high expense car, so for the moment MPG isnt really an issue for me. If I decide to change car I cant see it being a high priority; certainly not at the expense of things like performance or comfort.

    That said, I have no idea what the future holds, and spending €60+ a week on petrol might not always be an option.

    What car is it or how many miles you do per week?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,088 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    djimi wrote: »
    That said, I have no idea what the future holds, and spending €60+ a week on petrol might not always be an option.

    In a country where you get €188 per week on the dole, where minimum wage is nearly €350 per week, and generally on average people get over €500 a week, I think €60 spending on fuel a week is negligible cost.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    CiniO wrote: »
    In a country where you get €188 per week on the dole, where minimum wage is nearly €350 per week, and generally on average people get over €500 a week, I think €60 spending on fuel a week is negligible cost.


    In a country where a €1,500 a month (just shy of €400 pw)mortgate in pretty common; where full time childcare costs are approx €800 per month perchild (€200 pw) and the cost of living other than that (e.g. groceries) is sky high, I can assure you that €60 a week on fuel on top of everything else is not a negligible cost. Maybe OK for someone living at home or is lucky not to have high mortgage/childcare costs .. I wouldn't know


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    creedp wrote: »
    In a country where a €1,500 a month (just shy of €400 pw)mortgate in pretty common; where full time childcare costs are approx €800 per month perchild (€200 pw) and the cost of living other than that (e.g. groceries) is sky high, I can assure you that €60 a week on fuel on top of everything else is not a negligible cost. Maybe OK for someone living at home or is lucky not to have high mortgage/childcare costs .. I wouldn't know

    So really the Mortgage is the problem then, not the Fuel costs.

    800 a month for Childcare ... thats pretty cheap, runs at about 1100 / month / child here.

    Groceries are sky high compared to what ? Their pretty much on par with here and Germany imo.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    So really the Mortgage is the problem then, not the Fuel costs.

    800 a month for Childcare ... thats pretty cheap, runs at about 1100 / month / child here.

    Groceries are sky high compared to what ? Their pretty much on par with here and Germany imo.


    Yes mortgages are a big problem but because they consume so much of people's disposable incomes they don't have a whole lot left for other items of expenditure including fuel. So my point being that €60 a week is therefore significant. Maybe if we started off and said fuel is paid for 1st and then we'll see what's left for mortgate then you comment might be appropriate.

    I'm glad you think that €800 a month is cheap .. tell that to someone with 3 kids. Any tax relief for childcare costs in your neck of the woods as a matter of interest?

    I sure you aware of the phenomenon of the cross border trade with NI. I don't think people were heading across for the fun of it! It may be less lucrative now give currency movements. Also the differential is less if you buy foregin products ... the buy Irish campaign is fine but unfortunately its costs ... the problem I sometimes have difficulty rationalising is that its very often cheaper to buy Irish product abroad than at home.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,593 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    MPG is only a factor in overall ownership and running costs. People are really hung up on it though, much like road tax.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    creedp wrote: »
    Yes mortgages are a big problem but because they consume so much of people's disposable incomes they don't have a whole lot left for other items of expenditure including fuel. So my point being that €60 a week is therefore significant. Maybe if we started off and said fuel is paid for 1st and then we'll see what's left for mortgate then you comment might be appropriate.

    Not really, if you bought a house you cannot afford then you cannot afford it, thats a problem created by the person that bought the house. Cheap fuel isn't going to fix that.
    I'm glad you think that €800 a month is cheap .. tell that to someone with 3 kids. Any tax relief for childcare costs in your neck of the woods as a matter of interest?


    Here when you do your yearly return its tax free (same as Ireland):
    http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it1.html#section5

    I sure you aware of the phenomenon of the cross border trade with NI. I don't think people were heading across for the fun of it! It may be less lucrative now give currency movements. Also the differential is less if you buy foregin products ... the buy Irish campaign is fine but unfortunately its costs ... the problem I sometimes have difficulty rationalising is that its very often cheaper to buy Irish product abroad than at home.

    Its the very same here, Coffee is cheaper in NL than in Germany, Beer is cheaper in Germany than in NL.

    Only time i've seen an Irish product cheaper abroad is due to VAT/Duty. (Whisky for example)


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    pcardin wrote: »
    What car is it or how many miles you do per week?

    Integra Type R. I only have a 20ish mile round trip to work every day and whatever other mileage I might do in the week; probably no more than 200 miles in a normal week.

    I usually get about 40 miles for €10 petrol in my car (whatever that equates to in MPG) which to me makes it a high expense car!


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    CiniO wrote: »
    In a country where you get €188 per week on the dole, where minimum wage is nearly €350 per week, and generally on average people get over €500 a week, I think €60 spending on fuel a week is negligible cost.

    I dont do a lot of driving in the week, so its not negligible when you take that into account. If I was doing 50+ mile round trip to work every day Id be paying well over €100 a week on petrol.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    djimi wrote: »
    I dont do a lot of driving in the week, so its not negligible when you take that into account. If I was doing 50+ mile round trip to work every day Id be paying well over €100 a week on petrol.

    I think he's hinting that where he's from where the average income is much lower, the cost of fuel is pretty much the same and people manage it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    Not really, if you bought a house you cannot afford then you cannot afford it, thats a problem created by the person that bought the house. Cheap fuel isn't going to fix that.

    The point being made that €60 a week on fuel is not negligible when you have other cals on your limited dispsable income. I wasn't pleading for lower fuel costs I was sipmply making a statement of fact. Others may disagree and thats their perogative.


    Here when you do your yearly return its tax free (same as Ireland):
    http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it1.html#section5


    Its the very same here, Coffee is cheaper in NL than in Germany, Beer is cheaper in Germany than in NL.

    Only time i've seen an Irish product cheaper abroad is due to VAT/Duty. (Whisky for example)

    Handy for the stay at home mon/dad to supplement their income in the same way as the rent a room scheme .. so good for the service provider but doesn't change the fact that the service user still has to pay for the service. Not getting any further into this topic as I have been pulled back for derailing threads in the past


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    creedp wrote: »
    The point being made that €60 a week on fuel is not negligible when you have other cals on your limited dispsable income. I wasn't pleading for lower fuel costs I was sipmply making a statement of fact. Others may disagree and thats their perogative.

    Ah ok, just in your earlier post you seemed to be making a statement for everyone and not just yourself.
    Yes mortgages are a big problem but because they consume so much of people's disposable incomes they don't have a whole lot left for other items of expenditure including fuel. So my point being that €60 a week is therefore significant.

    Do you mean yourself or 'everyone' ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    Here when you do your yearly return its tax free (same as Ireland):
    http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it1.html#section5

    You know that article is to do with people who earn income from childcare, it's not about a tax relief for paying childcare.

    "When the gross annual income from the provision of childcare services does not exceed €15,000 in 2010 or 2011 the income is exempt from tax. The childcare service must be provided in the carer's home, not the children's home and no more than 3 children may be cared for at any time."

    Anyway, this is a motoring forum.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    MPG is only a factor in overall ownership and running costs. People are really hung up on it though, much like road tax.

    +1 on this. It's amazing how many people traded in their pre-08 cars to save money on tax when the additional depreciation on the newer model will ecllipse the saving from the lower motor tax. A friend of mine traded an 07 Sante Fe with €800 pa tax for a new ix35 with €300 odd tax (sorry to lazy to look up exact rate) ..so €500 a year saving even though he far preferred the Sante Fe but wanted to save on tax. He freely admitted however, that he got a poor trade in on the perfect Sante Fe with only 70k km on it because of the Motor Tax. I wonder how long will it be before the tax savings on ix35 compensate for this lower trade in?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    MPG is only a factor in overall ownership and running costs. People are really hung up on it though, much like road tax.
    That's because it's cost is a variable which changes on a daily basis.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    creedp wrote: »
    The point being made that €60 a week on fuel is not negligible when you have other cals on your limited dispsable income. I wasn't pleading for lower fuel costs I was sipmply making a statement of fact. Others may disagree and thats their perogative.

    Ah ok, just in your earlier post you seemed to be making a statement for everyone and not just yourself.



    Do you mean yourself or 'everyone' ?


    I was making a general statement ... the degree of impact fuel costs will have on a person's disposable income wil depend on their level of outgoings. The higher the overall outgoings the more of an impact fuel costs will have. This comment came as a response to a view that €60 per week is negligible in a country where nearly everyone earns €500pw but the point is if a person' regular outgoings are €450 pw then an additional €60 is not negligible .. the comment is no more philosophical than that ..


  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    djimi wrote: »
    Integra Type R. ............

    I usually get about 40 miles for €10 petrol in my car (whatever that equates to in MPG) which to me makes it a high expense car!

    Nearly 30mpg, tax will be reasonable on it too as the engine is small enough capacity wise, servicing etc aren't bad at all. Not really a high expense car.

    A 1.4 Corolla wouldn't be much cheaper to run really.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,171 ✭✭✭af_thefragile


    For me its fun.

    I don't mind saving up a few extra quid every month so that I can have a more exciting/stimulating driving experience and its not that difficult to save up the money.

    But I also appreciate cars that are fun to drive and at the same time are economical.

    Something like the Lotus Elise is the best example of this. One of the most enjoyable and memorable cars to drive while its 1.8l engine can easily do over 30mpg. The new ones are even better at 149g/km of co2 they're super cheap to tax and the new 1.6l engine will do upto 40mpg if you're careful! Too bad you can't buy one in Ireland!!

    And then if you move up the ladder, its one reason I love the Porsche 911 too. Amazing thing to drive. You can squeeze 4 people in it (though 2 of them would need to be rather small people), its not big and scary and it'll do 30mpg if you're careful!


    Car manufacturers seem to be improving on efficiency of the internal combustion engine with every new development of their models. If you compare modern twin turbo v8s which can do 30mpg and more to v8s from 10-20yrs ago which would have struggled to achieve even 20mpg and produced less power than the modern variants, you can see how far we've come. If they keep up with this then in the next 10 years we should see petrol cars with more than 200bph capable of achieving over 40 and maybe even 50mpg.


    It'll be a sad day to see the internal combustion engine replaced in favour of electrical motors. We really have come a long way towards perfecting the internal combustion engine and making the most reliable and practical source of energy to power vehicles. I would love to see a future where the internal combustion engine still lives on alternate green/renewable fuels and not become a fragment of nostalgic history like the steam engine.


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    RoverJames wrote: »
    Nearly 30mpg, tax will be reasonable on it too as the engine is small enough capacity wise, servicing etc aren't bad at all. Not really a high expense car.

    A 1.4 Corolla wouldn't be much cheaper to run really.

    Its a high expense car to run compared to a lot of cars on the road to be fair. Im nearly 30 with 10 years full license and 4 years NCB and my insurance is nearly a grand. €170 for 3 months tax. Compared to what my father pays on his 1.4 diesel Corolla for example my thing is a gas guzzler! It mightnt be the worst car on the road to run, but compared to most it is high expense.


  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    RoverJames wrote: »
    .................

    A 1.4 Corolla wouldn't be much cheaper to run really.
    djimi wrote: »
    Its a high expense car to run compared to a lot of cars on the road to be fair. Im nearly 30 with 10 years full license and 4 years NCB and my insurance is nearly a grand. €170 for 3 months tax. Compared to what my father pays on his 1.4 diesel Corolla for example my thing is a gas guzzler! It mightnt be the worst car on the road to run, but compared to most it is high expense.


    I meant a 1.4 petrol Corolla :)
    A 320i would have similar running costs to your car with a few hundred less in insurance.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I meant a 1.4 petrol Corolla :)
    A 320i would have similar running costs to your car with a few hundred less in insurance.

    Unless a 1.4 Corolla has ridiculously high running costs I doubt it compares to a Type R Integra somehow! My 98 1.4 Civic felt like a Honda 50 to run in comparison to the Integra; I was probably getting twice the fuel mileage I am currently getting.


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