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Replacment combi boiler

  • 03-02-2012 8:33pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 20


    My combi boiler - heating and water - needs to be replaced, I would like to install the most efficient system - any views and is there a grant available?


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭JohnnieK


    You would be eligible for a grant. An A-rated combi with good hot water performance a programmable room stat with a weather compensator. Is it possible to separate up stairs and down stairs? Is it an apartment?


  • Registered Users Posts: 20 mayd


    Its a dormer house with 3 power showers, floor area 270sq mtrs - it is zoned living area, bedrooms and hot water. How do I apply for grant and which boiler would you recommend. I have Geminox megalithe boiler but it seems to be very sensitive to lime even though there is a treatment system for the water pump. I am in Co Waterford.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭JohnnieK


    Is it oil or gas? Geminox are not that common in this country. There is another unit called a DELTA Pro made by ACV that would suit your set up and it's condensing A-Rated too.www.acv-uk.com/deltaperformance.htm The Irish agents are C&F Quadrant.

    What kind of controls do you have? This is important regarding eligibility for the grant.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20 mayd


    Its oil fired - what do you mean by controls


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭JohnnieK


    Controls for your heating system. If you have 7 day programmers and room stats for your heating system then it would be hard to swing the grant. Unfortunately there is no grant available for a new boiler only.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 20 mayd


    Thank you JohnnieK yes the stats are fitted so it a boiler only replacement I will look up your recommendation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭JohnnieK


    mayd wrote: »
    Thank you JohnnieK yes the stats are fitted so it a boiler only replacement I will look up your recommendation.

    Whats controlling them? Is it just a single mechanical programmer on each zone?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    The OP is looking for an oil fired combi boiler.

    Does something like that exist?

    Thanks.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    heinbloed wrote: »
    The OP is looking for an oil fired combi boiler.

    Does something like that exist?

    Thanks.

    That is an oil fired combi boiler ( no need underline the text , i can read perfectly ) .
    And yes it does exist , i was on the training course for them .


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    Thanks, sullz.
    Would you please give us a link to such a device, I was never factory trained.

    The one you have linked in this thread ( http://www.saturnheating.net/content/nhc30b-condensing-oil-boiler ) is certainly not a combi boiler.

    Thanks.


  • Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭gdavis


    heinbloed,that is a combi boiler,hence the hot water out connection on it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    heinbloed wrote: »
    Thanks, sullz.
    Would you please give us a link to such a device, I was never factory trained.

    The one you have linked in this thread ( http://www.saturnheating.net/content/nhc30b-condensing-oil-boiler ) is certainly not a combi boiler.

    Thanks.

    Heinbloed , as i already stated i dont need you to underline texts , i know what a combi boiler is , these boilers are not available in non combi models , so i suppose this CERTAINLY is a combi boiler


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    Here we go again, Heinbloeds has a definition of a Combi and so it can’t be a Combi unless he agrees with it. :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    Thanks for trying, gdavis.
    I've checked the instruction manual as well as the brochure and see only 1 inlet and 1 outlet.

    See page 24 and page 25 here:

    http://www.saturnheating.net/sites/www.saturnheating.net/files/Oil-Boiler-Instruction-Manual.pdf

    It would be against all EU rules and the WHO guidelines as well to use the same circuit for DHW and space heating circuit.

    As far as I can see this saturn machine is a plain oil fired CH boiler. Where one can switch between two pre-programmed outlet temperatures. It has only 1 inlet and 1 outlet. Therefore it is not a combi-boiler.
    Nowhere the manufacturer/seller claims that this boiler is a combi boiler. As far as I can see....

    The technical specification on page 33 tells the same story:
    " heat efficiency of 95% normal" and "hot water efficienzy of 95%"

    With a combi-boiler feeding fresh cold water condensation would be achieved since the cold heat exchanger would cause it. The efficiency of the DHW would be higher than the efficiecy of the space heating circuit, plain logic.
    B.t.w.: I have never heard of any boiler operating in a non-condensing modus delivering a 95% fuel efficiency.

    To what standards have these efficiency tests been done ?

    From the brochure:

    http://www.saturnheating.net/content/nhc30b-condensing-oil-boiler

    Key features
    Condensing efficiency of 101%.
    A straight forward lie that is, no boiler can condense more vapour than there is (100%).

    Usually the manufacturer would tell this (EN or BS or similar), it's a legal issue. Not with this one, as far as I can see.....

    Would you mind to clarify, gdavis? Maybe a link to a more detailed explosion drawing, pictures showing the exact build-up? Thanks


    @ the OP: there is nothing like an oil fired combi boiler in domestic sizes available. Contact a professional heating engineer.


    And @ those who have seen this thing operating: what efficiency is meassured in-situ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    I've found this warning in the saturn brochure:
    The domestic hot water supply is not
    recommended for potable use.

    Quote from page6, http://www.saturnheating.net/sites/www.saturnheating.net/files/Oil-Boiler-Instruction-Manual.pdf


    @ sullz:

    Your recommendation:
    Excellent boiler
    - how do we take this? Excellent for hospital admissions ? Excellent for dialysis apperatur manufacturers?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    What is potable domestic hot water ?

    In legal terms?
    Legally binding for Irish builders, plumbers, heating engineers?

    Thanks ....


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    Heinbloed , i dont think that i could possibly try to explain the workings of that boiler to you as from your posts i have seen from you in the past , you are not able to take any correction of your opinions , i think the best thing you could do is contact pulsar direct and ask for ken , he will be able to answer any questions you have about it because im not going to spend my saturday evening entertaining your idiotic points , you dont have a clue about this boilers operation .


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    The saturn home page

    claims to have an oil fired condensing boiler available with an efficiency of 101% and shows a Sedbuk label "A".

    There is no oil boiler listed in the Sedbuk (manufacturer-) list with such an efficiency rate, see:

    http://www.sedbuk.com/cgi-local/result1.cgi

    The highest efficy rate is 93.3 %. Not more. Technically impossible. A 101% efficiency rate according to Sedbuk is HUMBUG.

    And in the search facility of Sedbuk

    http://www.sedbuk.com/cgi-local/searchpg.cgi

    the manufacturer "saturn" can't be found, it is non-existent there.
    The Sedbuk page was recently updated, 31/1/2012. Four days ago.


    @Sullz, you wrote:
    ....not able to take any correction of your opinions , i think the best thing you could do is contact pulsar direct and ask for ken , he will be able to answer any questions you have....

    Have you been fooled by a telephone sales con-man, Sullz?
    Contact the consumer organisation, there is help.


    PS

    The Sedbuk brand list (not the manufacturer list !) has a "Saturn" boiler listed, an oil fueled combi boiler ( I'm wondering and learning). See

    http://www.sedbuk.com/cgi-local/detail.cgi?fone=000268&ftwo=NHC&fthr=25B&ffou=016720&in_blank=123

    But listed there with an efficiency rate of

    SAP 2009 annual efficiency:
    89.4%

    So this can't be the same, can it? Not efficient enough to satisfy the legally minimum standard in Ireland ( <90% , " Band A " ). But recommended - why?


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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    heinbloed wrote: »
    What is potable domestic hot water ?

    In legal terms?
    Legally binding for Irish builders, plumbers, heating engineers?

    Thanks ....

    I think your on to something here, potable water is water you can use for cooking pots, so if you can't use it for the kitchen then what good is it:confused:


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    Sullz wrote:
    Heinbloed , i dont think that i could possibly try to explain the workings of that boiler ......contact pulsar direct and ask for ken....

    Well, since there is no contact detail mentioned we have to rely on what we have available, the www....

    We look for the term "Pulsar" in google and find

    http://www.wanderport-ir.com/index.php?pg=products

    A microwave heater. Sure they state 99% + efficiency. But no Ken would claim 101% efficiency with direct electric usage.

    Is there a mix-up with brand names, company names and manufacturer names? And the types of products ? Maybe on purpose?

    This brochure

    http://www.pulsardirect.com/sites/www.pulsardirect.com/files/Oct11IE.pdf


    talks about
    UBELIEVEABLE FEATURES

    Now, if this isn't a statement....

    So we check the www further, try to refine the search to an Irish company. And we get to

    http://www.pulsar.ie/heating/boilers.html

    Firebird, Wolf and Vaillant. No "saturn"....

    Could it be that someone is trying to sell surplus stuff which doesn't European min. requirements for efficiency (building regulations)? Trash?

    I haven't seen neutralization units installed with new boilers for a decade, at least. With that saturn thing we get one with it, free of charge. This boiler must have been designed decades ago, in my opinion. Hence the warning on the hot water quality, not for potable use ...


    We have seen previously boilers recommended in this forum which do not meet minimum efficiency and hygene standards.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    Heinbloed you are as mad as a brush, what do you think potable water is , ive fitted these with great results , im not going to entertain you much further , there are contact numbers in the brochure and on the website if it is really bothering you that much . im really beginning to think that you are not experienced in the trade and havent got a clue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    heinbloed wrote: »
    Sullz wrote:







    Well, since there is no contact detail mentioned we have to rely on what we have available, the www....



    We look for the term "Pulsar" in google and find



    http://www.wanderport-ir.com/index.php?pg=products



    A microwave heater. Sure they state 99% + efficiency. But no Ken would claim 101% efficiency with direct electric usage.



    Is there a mix-up with brand names, company names and manufacturer names? And the types of products ? Maybe on purpose?



    This brochure



    http://www.pulsardirect.com/sites/www.pulsardirect.com/files/Oct11IE.pdf





    talks about







    Now, if this isn't a statement....



    So we check the www further, try to refine the search to an Irish company. And we get to



    http://www.pulsar.ie/heating/boilers.html



    Firebird, Wolf and Vaillant. No "saturn"....



    Could it be that someone is trying to sell surplus stuff which doesn't European min. requirements for efficiency (building regulations)? Trash?



    I haven't seen neutralization units installed with new boilers for a decade, at least. With that saturn thing we get one with it, free of charge. This boiler must have been designed decades ago, in my opinion. Hence the warning on the hot water quality, not for potable use ...





    We have seen previously boilers recommended in this forum which do not meet minimum efficiency and hygene standards.




    Yeh Yeh!! but you except its a Combi right. :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 771 ✭✭✭gdavis


    heinbloed,potable water is water which is fit for human consumption,now i dont know bout u but i dont shove my head under the hot water tap for a drinkor make a cuppa with it!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    gdavis wrote: »
    heinbloed,potable water is water which is fit for human consumption,now i dont know bout u but i dont shove my head under the hot water tap for a drinkor make a cuppa with it!

    Mabey thats whats wrong with him , knockin back pints of water from the hot tap


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,409 ✭✭✭sullzz


    Yeh Yeh!! but you except its a Combi right. :D

    I dont think he does , i think heinbloed is under the impression that the hot water you draw off is the same water as in the heating system at a lower temperature.
    As i said " mad as a brush"


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Ignorance is a beautiful thing and Heinbload is getting prettier by the post:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    gary71 wrote: »
    Ignorance is a beautiful thing and Heinbload is getting prettier by the post:D

    And he'll likely play ignorance to these replies, Heinbloed likes to sit back and read his email notification of replies then plot his response or play dead. :rolleyes:

    I a long time ago made my mind up that he is only here to provoke and cause upset by complecating simple issues that the rest of us attempt to help with, i believe the internet term is a Troll.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 20 mayd


    Having read through the superflous posts can we return to the issue...any other recommendations for a replacement combi boiler


This discussion has been closed.
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