Where to start?

af_thefragile · 13-11-2008 2:00pm #1

Seeing the current traffic congestion in the city, i've really been craving the freedom you'ld get from riding a bike into college everyday. I know a guy who rides his to college everyday (and you don't even need to pay for parking! there's loads of room in front of my college to park a bike). So the whole thing of getting one is getting more and more tempting lately and I always wanted to have a nice sporty bike.

But Here's my story.
I've never rode a bike. I'm a 21 yr old bloke. I'm quite short at 5'5'' so i'ld like to start off with a low bike but i don't quite like cruisers.
I'll go and get my provisional license next month.

And so i wanted to know where do i go after getting my license. I've never really rode a bike (road a friend's small crappy moped once a few years ago), so i don't know how confident i'ld be with one. I don't wanna get a bike only to get on it, ride a few meters and fall off. Well, i wouldn't mind, but it'ld be quite embarrassing right... and maybe even wreck the new bike.

So what do you guys say i should do? Should i go straight with my provisional license to some learning school and get my first steps on a bike there and get a little confident with the whole thing before i go off to get my own bike.
And if so do you guys know any good schools or instructors who cater for absolute beginners?
Or should i save myself the money of the school and just go ahead and get the bike and learn it the hard way...?

Oh and i'ld need to be able to find riding gear that could fit me too which could be a challenge as i usually find most jackets n trousers a little too big for me...

And could you guys recommend me a good bike to start off on.
I was looking at the Honda 250 Hornet and bikes as such, but i don't know much about the whole thing...

So any help appreciated!!

jim o doom · 13-11-2008 2:15pm

Hey man, Good to hear of someone else wanting to take the easy traffic route - I couldn't sit in a car myself for hours (used to live in lusk and work in the city.. a 2 hour drive is OUT of the question

I understand that you don't like cruisers (my first bike was a marauder 125) - they arn't the best balanced bikes, the smaller models are always overweight (tiny engine with a large tank and unnecessary parts to make it look bigger).. and if it has Drum rear brakes.. they are useless IMO.
That being said, I don't think the hornet 250 would be a great starter bike.. they are great machines, can't go wrong with honda, but all the Hornets, from the 250 up are fast and light machines.. I would imagine your insurance on a hornet 250 as a first bike would be ENORMOUS & that is no lie.. my insurance on the weak engined marauder was massive the first few years.
If money is a major issue, you could try the honda superfly, or the suzuki gs125, or many of the ones that are like the gs125, by yamaha, honda or any of the big manufacturers. These bikes are uprights, have the same engines (generally) as the cruisers (the gs125 & marauder have exactly the same engine) but are lighter & faster. Because you are upright, your balance is considerably better as well.. these bikes are generally couried a lot, so if buying second hand, be very careful & get it checked out.
If you can afford the insurance & feel happy getting on a hornet 250, go for it, but I think it would be overpowered for a beginner (seriously quick little bike).
Personally when I started off, I bought my 125, and just drove around the local area, ranging wider & further until I felt confident enough to drive... I think your best bet is to buy one, insure it, drive in local area & organise lessons to teach you the right way to drive safely.. I only ever got lessons when I was doing my test to eliminate bad habits.. I would have been smarter at the start but I had no money after the bike purchase and insurance!

With regards to gear, all I can say is shop around; there's a shop up on Wexford street in town with lots of gear, there's one up on the long mile road which is MASSIVE and has lots of gear, both cheap and expensive. A good way to do it is go into a shop, try on gear, find the size and then go online and get it for half the price.
I hope there isn't too much info over all in this post, and I hope to see you on the road some day

Also if you have any further questions, feel free to post em here, or PM me if I am being unresponsive. Regards C

Eoin · 13-11-2008 2:27pm

I'm in a similar situation - just did the theory test on Tuesday so getting my provisional.

When I get that, I am going to get some lessons where the gear and bike is provided. That way I can see if I like it, without having to commit to anything but the cost of lessons. If it turns out I do like it, then I will start looking into a purchase.

You might get to have a go on different bikes in the school, which will help get you started and I'm sure the instructor will be able to offer some advice for you as well.

There do seem to be some common bikes that people recommend - Honda Bros, Suzuki Bandit etc, but I'm sure it's horses for courses like most things in life. For instance, I'm 30 and a pretty big bloke, so my insurance will be cheaper and I will need a bigger bike to haul my arse around, so what's good for you as a beginner may not suit me as a beginner.

Another option is a decent scooter - I've not ruled that out yet myself. You don't have to worry about the gears, and you probably get more storage.

Anyway, if you haven't done your theory test, then you have to start there. Definitely get the CD and do the test over and over again until you constantly get close to 40 out of 40. I got the book as well, but rarely looked at it.

af_thefragile · 13-11-2008 2:32pm

I did read it though it was better to get a 250cc bike as you can then go ahead and apply for the full A license with which you can ride bigger bikes in the future and not the A1 license or something like that...

Though i'm really more concerned about how hard it is to learn to ride bikes. I'm a fast learner but as i've never rode one before i'm not very confident about getting on one and riding away without making a fool of myself.
So i was wondering what i should do first. Get a bike or go to a bike school...?

Eoin · 13-11-2008 2:36pm

Personally, I think you would be mad to buy a bike that you have not only never driven, but don't know how to drive or be able to compare it with any other bike.

As I said, you can get lessons where the bike and gear is provided so you don't have to buy anything upfront. I can dig out some links if you are interested.

I'm sure it is possible to do your test on another bike and start off on a 125 - which is exactly what a colleague of mine is doing. It's the guts of a 2 year wait for the test, so you would have plenty of time to upgrade in the meantime if you find yourself outgrowing the bike.

jim o doom · 13-11-2008 2:40pm

Hmm not soo sure about the a1 licence busienss to be honest, it has been several years since I passed my test.. you are probably right though. First thing to do would be pass the provisional test & get your provisional, no point buying a bike or going to a bike school without either as they cannot put you on the bike without it. If you go with a school you could purchase a 125 for insurance purposes & use one of the schools 250s to pass your test. best of both worlds

If you really are a bit scared of heading out (I know I was, I had my bike 3/4 months before I finally drove it to college!), then perhaps a school would be your best option. With regards to liking it, I can't imagine NOT liking it! but like the other poster said, it's down to the person. Your insurance would probably be cheaper than when I started because I was insuring mine as an 18 year old (risk central haha).

jim o doom · 13-11-2008 2:42pm

2 year wait? holy god! I applied online for mine about 4/5 years ago and it was less than six months!

Eoin · 13-11-2008 3:09pm

jim o doom wrote: »

2 year wait? holy god! I applied online for mine about 4/5 years ago and it was less than six months!

Yep, that's what I've been reading on biker.ie

af_thefragile · 13-11-2008 3:11pm

eoin_s wrote: »

Personally, I think you would be mad to buy a bike that you have not only never driven, but don't know how to drive or be able to compare it with any other bike.

As I said, you can get lessons where the bike and gear is provided so you don't have to buy anything upfront. I can dig out some links if you are interested.

I'm sure it is possible to do your test on another bike and start off on a 125 - which is exactly what a colleague of mine is doing. It's the guts of a 2 year wait for the test, so you would have plenty of time to upgrade in the meantime if you find yourself outgrowing the bike.

I think this would be my best bet. I really wouldn't be too confident buying a bike i've never driven and well, buying one when i've never driven one at all! I'ld like to get some taste of the experience of riding a bike before buying one...

What do you think of those Honda CBR125 bikes as a good starter bikes?
They're not very expensive used and look fine-ish...

And do you know a good place to get lessons where they'ld provide the bike and gear?

Thanks all for the replies!

Eoin · 13-11-2008 3:22pm

af_thefragile wrote: »

What do you think of those Honda CBR125 bikes as a good starter bikes?
They're not very expensive used and look fine-ish...

Haven't a clue - I'm only one step ahead of you, so haven't got that far.

af_thefragile wrote: »

And do you know a good place to get lessons where they'ld provide the bike and gear?

This guy comes very highly recommended - see clownbag's thread on this forum:
http://www.motorbiketraining.net

Others include:
http://www.msa-ireland.com (they even have a simulator)
http://www.aaronridertraining.com/basic-motorcycle-courses.htm

As I said, I can't recommend any of these personally as I've still to get my provisional.

Some of these look pricey, but I am determined not to skimp on this or my protective gear, even if it means not actually getting a bike for a bit longer.

jim o doom · 13-11-2008 3:39pm

Re; Honda CBR125 - any race type bike (even a small engined one like that) will push up your insurance considerably.. Just ring around the insurance companies with what you are looking at & they will tell you firstly if they will even insure you on said bike & how much the damage is going to be. I realise a lot of those smaller race type bikes are replica types, but a friend of mine had a 50cc aprilia race type bike and it was able to hit 75 mph.. compared to my 125 marauder which could barely hit 60mpy. This means these bikes are lighter, faster & in the insurance companies eyes more dangerous.. they see race bikes as items for going fast (which is what they are I have a zx10r myself) and hence the insurances is pricey.

With regards to gear, any of the decent textile jackets & pants, as long as they have hardened plastic armour (instead of padding) should be both waterproof and protective. With regards to helmets, try shoei or Arai - arai can be VERY expensive (my lid was 700.. OUCH) BUT they have much cheaper ones, which have the visor fog preventing pinlock system, good safety standards & good comfort.. A website I tried before was (this could eb wrong because I haven't been on in a while) thevisorshop.co.uk it might be the visorstore.co.uk either.. they are in the north, free delivery to Ireland for orders over 50 quid & no VAT on the helmets because in the UK helmets are safety items and have no VAT.. this can make your gear a lot cheaper!

af_thefragile · 13-11-2008 6:03pm

What do you guys think of the Yamaha XT125 for a first bike? It looks quite good and comfortable to ride... Though it looks a wee bit high...

But it looks pretty good apart from the fact the driving lessons are fairly expensive and the insurance companies are out there to rip into first time bikers...

Eoin · 13-11-2008 6:13pm

I'd really just get a few lessons first, and go from there.

Dirk Gently · 13-11-2008 6:49pm

af_thefragile wrote: »

I've never rode a bike. I'm a 21 yr old bloke. I'm quite short at 5'5'' so i'ld like to start off with a low bike but i don't quite like cruisers.

I'd be inclined to recommend a Honda rebel. It is a cruiser style bike though. Advantages of the rebel are first of all it's a Honda and it has a bit of reputation of being bullet proof. People report not having any problems with it and if necessary the parts are cheap if you need to get anything done. A lot of people start out on them. They come in 125cc / 250cc and upwards. Supposedly light enough and easy to use. It has a low seat level, closer to the ground (same height as the yamaha virago I think) but the foot rests are a few inches closer than the virago which makes it ideal for shorter people. Easy to reach the ground and comfortable to ride. I was thinking about getting one as my first bike but I'm just under 6ft and the only reason I didn't go for it was because it's more suited for smaller riders and I thought I might be a bit cramped on it. Another advantage of the cruisers as well as seating position is they are cheaper to insure compared to the racer bikes as they are regarded as safer and wont reach the same speeds as a similar cc sports bike.

The Honda CB might be another option for you. nothing spectacular but it's not a cruiser and again it's a honda so very reliable. It looks like I'm going to go for a dragster myself, hopefully going to pick it up tomorrow if all goes well. Again similar style to the rebel, just a yamaha and I can stretch my legs a bit further on it.

I was at your stage about a month ago so have spent that time researching all the options. What I done after I got the provisional was arrange some lessons. Never drove a geared bike before so was a complete beginner. Ended up doing a 6 hour lesson with Dave Lyons on a yamaha 125. Nice light small bike and after the 6 hours I was fairly confident and am glad I done it now. cost me 350 for the 6 hours and he supplied the bike and gear. I gave the lesson a bit of a review on another thread on this forum here.

Next step was choosing a bike. I lurked on biker.ie for a week or so before joining up. It's a great site if you spend a bit of time going through all the threads. Learned a bit about what bikes were good for starting off and what shops were good / bad and so on. I initially set out to get a virago but couldn't source one at the right price in the right condition so eventually got word about the dragstar and let the shop know I was interested.

Most shops will throw some gear (helmet / jacket / boots / gloves) in with the bike or give you a good discount on it. The shops tend to be a bit dearer than buying privately but I don't know a whole lot about bikes yet so am happy enough to pay a little extra for peace of mind. The discounted gear and warranty more than evens up the price though.

That's just my experience of it so far but I recommend www.biker.ie for any research or questions you might have. The lads over there have a buy and sell section too so you could even pick up something cheap there. Don't be afraid of the lessons though. There's a bit to take in at the start but after you've done the manoeuvres a few times it becomes natural and you don't think about too much. It's not difficult, just takes a bit of practice.

When your checking out prices donedeal.ie will give you a good idea what price private sellers are looking for your model and year. A lot of them can be bargained down too as it's a good time to buy at the moment but I'm playing safe and going with the shop and see what extras I can get thrown in with it. I could buy cheaper privately but then I'd have to pay full price for my gear and I'd have no warranty. Maybe next time when I'm a bit more clued in.

Eoin · 13-11-2008 6:52pm

There is also www.irishbikerforum.com

It doesn't seem to be as big as biker.ie, but not as many in-jokes and seriously NSFW threads.

thehomeofDob · 13-11-2008 9:29pm

I was in the same situation as yourself a few weeks ago - tho commuting to work instead of college. As far as a bike purchase is concerned I can't help, I settled on a 250 Marauder which doesn't seem to be your cup of tea.

What I can give advice on is the riding part - I had never ridden anything two wheeled apart from a push bike. Basically I spent two weeks glued to the internet reading everything I could about riding, watched countless youtube videos and read loads of articles. The mechanics of a bike are pretty much universal in terms of button/switch positioning and gearing.
Once I got my permit, bike, and insurance I just started putting around the estate for a day or so, then out around the area during quiet times with little traffic. When I was somewhat comfortable on the bike I called up David Lyons @ http://www.motorbiketraining.net and booked a 6Hr begginers lesson. Having had a few hours on the bike I felt a bit more comfortable and he didn't have to spend any time telling me where the controls were or about getting the bike started and whatnot. He is an excellent teacher and at the end he offers an assesment ride where if you pass you can get a fairly big discount off your insurance. I got €200 and something squid off of mine - handy! I would recommend as much as possible to get some sort of training, it'll save your life.
I would most likely be dead now had I not gotten training - proper downshifting while breaking got me out of a sticky situation, and counter steering has helped me avoid sudden objects on the road. Looking ahead in traffic and not the vehicle in front to be aware of problems, lights etc. All things you'll be taught.

Short and Sweet - read, watch, learn everything you can online. Get permit. Pick and buy a bike/gear. Insure it. Drive around the local area while it's quiet. Get training. Sorted!

Dirk Gently · 15-11-2008 7:09pm

My journey is complete. From noob to biker. Picked up a 250 dragstar today. Practised getting use to the weight and the turning circle in a lane way for about 30 mins. Then decided to bite the bullet and take it out into traffic and drive her home.

As soon as I got out into traffic I was grand though. I suppose concentration took over and I felt surprisingly confident driving around the city on it. Drove it home ( about 7km trip) in heavy enough traffic, only managed to get into 3rd gear because of the traffic but was happy just to be on the road at all. Delighted I got that first trip out of the way, I wasn't looking forward to it at all.

af_thefragile · 16-11-2008 4:24am

^cool bike Clown Bag.
Although i'm not a big fan of cruiser bikes as i mentioned, but it should still be pretty fun!

Now i'm looking to save up about €4k so it should cover all the costs from getting the bike to insurance to lessons... And soon i'll be a biker too!!

thehomeofDob · 16-11-2008 2:49pm

Did you pick that up in JP Motorcycles? I was looking at that when I went for mine, but I didn't have the cash. Nice bike!

Dirk Gently · 16-11-2008 5:29pm

thehomeofDob wrote: »

Did you pick that up in JP Motorcycles? I was looking at that when I went for mine, but I didn't have the cash. Nice bike!

That's right. It arrived in JP's on Friday. Had it ordered from the week before. Nice lads in that shop, helpful and they gave me a good bit of gear with the bike too. Will have to get a narrower set of bars on it though to fit it into my shed comfortably. He has a smaller set in there and is letting me have them. Just takes a bit too much effort to get in and out of the door at the moment. I know one morning I'll be in a hurry and clip the mirrors or indicators trying to manoeuvre the wider bars out.

Was up driving around industrial estates today getting use to it. I'm still a bit over cautious and driving a bit on the slow side but it's becoming more natural each time I take it out. Only cut out once today :P

thehomeofDob · 16-11-2008 10:36pm

Friday? Did ya pick it up then? I must have seen you outside the front by the door checking it out. Think he had the thing runnin for you, can't remember. I was just collecting my bike after getting the speedo cable replaced. Small world.

Would still 100% recommed you take some lessons - well well well worth the cost involved.

Dirk Gently · 16-11-2008 10:55pm

Yeah that would have been me just outside the door. Had it running for a few minutes just checking it out. I went back in on Saturday and picked it up off him. I noticed a chap at the counter all right, must have been you but I was outside mostly and then went in to have a look at his jackets and boots and stuff. Think you were gone by that stage.

Got some lessons (6 hours ) a few weeks ago from dave lyons. Done the lessons on a small light 125. It was just a matter of getting use to the heavier cruiser. I'm fairly ok on the dragstar, just have to get use to being out in traffic on it. I'll be going back down to Dave in the new year for more advanced lessons but for the moment it's just about getting a bit of experience on it. Only real difficulty is doing U turns on the dragstar compared to the 125. Bigger turning circle on it.

thehomeofDob · 17-11-2008 8:58am

Yeah I was just leaving when you were out looking at the bike. Ah coola, hope all goes well for you. Bikes are brilliant!

Lilliput69 · 17-11-2008 6:57pm

At 5'5" u'll have no problem getting bike gear, i am 5' exactly and have gear that fits me, my other half is 5'4" and has gear to fit him.

As for a bike, i would say a Honda Bros 400, CBR 250, Hornet 250, these were all slightly high for me so you should be perfect on them.

Defo get lessons first, it will give u the basics and confidence u need to ride ur own bike.

As for gear, buy the best u can afford, good helmet, bike jacket with built in armour, bike trousers with built in armour, decent waterproof gloves, neck tube, good bike boots. Go into some bike shops , try on the gear, find ur sizes, u might get some bargains on Ebay, i got a couple of bike jackets on line. Don't forget to get decent waterproofs too.

Keep ur eyes open for when Aldi and Lydl are doign bike gear, the thermals and socks are excellent, waterproofs aren't bad either, their gloves aren't bad as summer gloves

Good luck and keep us updated

Chatterbeast · 17-11-2008 11:35pm

Lilliput69 wrote: »

At 5'5" u'll have no problem getting bike gear, i am 5' exactly and have gear that fits me, my other half is 5'4" and has gear to fit him.

As for a bike, i would say a Honda Bros 400, CBR 250, Hornet 250, these were all slightly high for me so you should be perfect on them.

Defo get lessons first, it will give u the basics and confidence u need to ride ur own bike.

As for gear, buy the best u can afford, good helmet, bike jacket with built in armour, bike trousers with built in armour, decent waterproof gloves, neck tube, good bike boots. Go into some bike shops , try on the gear, find ur sizes, u might get some bargains on Ebay, i got a couple of bike jackets on line. Don't forget to get decent waterproofs too.

Keep ur eyes open for when Aldi and Lydl are doign bike gear, the thermals and socks are excellent, waterproofs aren't bad either, their gloves aren't bad as summer gloves

Good luck and keep us updated

I agree 100% with everything said here. Personally, a Bros400 or Hornet250 would be the way to go. Bros' are small enough. Might be ideal for you, you'll get them anywhere. As for gear....it's expensive but don't skimp. What's your head or spine worth? Whatever about a good waterproof jacket and bottoms, pay properly for a good lid and back protector.

Best of luck.

Where to start?

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