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Road deaths - what can be done?
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26-05-2005 10:20pm#1Can anyone tell me where to get historical statistics on road deaths in Republic of Ireland?
I know the figure for 2004 was 380 or so, and this year so far it is more than 1 per day. It's insane for a country with such a small population. Is it this bad in other countries? What are we doing wrong? It's frightening to think there are roughly 200 people in this country alive now who will die on the roads by the end of this year.
Any thoughts/opinions?0
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You can thank Zaph0d for this one (referenced in the Bus Eireann crash thread).
I have to say some of the statistics are quite surprising.
http://europa.eu.int/comm/transport/care/statistics/most_recent/index_en.htm0 -
It has something to do with the road quality here, look at most countries and they have very few minor roads as unsafe as the ones here. Most accidents occur on these and its frightening how unsafe some places are. Then there is the quality of driving, I would seriously say the French and the Italians have nothing on Irish drivers. See many things on this countries roads
-Woman driving round a roundabout the wrong way
-Tailgating for miles behind a motorbike
Its just insane. Personally I think the tests should be harder, more failures means people will try harder. Plus the little detail of passing all those people to relieve the backlog.0 -
Repli wrote:Can anyone tell me where to get historical statistics on road deaths in Republic of Ireland?
This gives a simple breakdown of road deaths and injuries since 1961.
http://garda.ie/angarda/statistics98/rtastats_longterm.html0 -
The National Roads Authority are responsible for collating and publishing accident statistics, the raw data comes from the Gardai.
You can get the reports by downloading the "Road Collision Facts" pdf's from, http://www.nra.ie/PublicationsResources/ListofPublications/RoadSafety/.0 -
In reply to the title of the thread: what can be done? - the next post contains the official government to do list for road safety 2004-2006. You will note that many of the items are either very cheap or do not incur a cost, just the effort to do them. Most of them are unlikely to happen and what you can do is explain to your TD before the next election that this should be a priority.
The aim for this strategy is to reduce road deaths by end 2006 to 301 per year from an average of 402 in 1998-2003. This would bring our rate down towards the UK figure. So far, we're not even getting close.
The list shows the agencies responsible for implementing each measure. One thing missing is a prioritisation of the list by estimated number of lives saved for each measure. How anyone with management experience could miss this, I don't know. First things first and all that.
Another anomaly is the bizarre list of measures concerning driver education. Clearly many Irish car owners don't know how to drive. Hundreds of thousands of them have never passed a test (provisional, pre-test era and amnesty drivers). The only way they're going to learn is by taking some lessons from a qualified teacher and then passing a test. One would imagine that untrained drivers make up a disproportionate number of accidents. Yet the only measures listed under education are TV ads and talking to kids in schools. A more effective approach to education might be:- Spend enough money on driver testing so that there is anough capacity to test everyone. Hire more people, raise the fee, outsource.
- Ban commercial driving lessons by people who aren't members of the DIR.
- Require people sitting tests to prove they have undergone a number of lessons by a qualified driving instructor.
- Make driving on a provisional license without a qualified driver an offense with a year's ban from driving.
- Tests should be resat every 10 years as a guard against senility and forgetfulness.
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Irish road safety strategy 2004-2006
http://www.transport.ie/upload/general/5905-0.pdf
1. Enforcement of road traffic law- Garda speed limit enforcement programme: 11.1m vehicles to be checked per year by end of Strategy. Garda Síochána and DJELR
- Garda drink-driving enforcement programme: 462,500 interventions per year within lifetime of Strategy. Garda Síochána and DJELR
- Expansion of forensic analysis programme for driving under the influence of drugs. MBRS
- Low-cost remedial measures to be carried out at 240 locations on national roads and 400 locations on non-national roads. NRA, DEHLG, local authorities
- A parallel programme of higher cost accident remedial measures will be developed and carried out at 20 locations on the national road network NRA
- Traffic calming measures to be implemented at 60 locations on national roads. NRA
- Road saftey audits of new national road schemes will continue and quality control of road safety audits will be developed. NRA
Primary Legislation- Implement revised speed limit structure resulting from review of speed limits based on a metric value. DoT
- Legislate for random breath testing. DoT
- Consider introducing a procedure for administrative disqualification for cases where the blood alcohol concentration is between 80mg/100ml and 100mg/100ml. DoT
- Comprehensive review of the legislation dealing with intoxicated driving, which will aim to simplify the existing legal code and facilitate effective detections and prosecutions, as well as fully addressing the questions of driving under the influence of drugs. DoT, MBRS
- Amend the existing legislation relating to imposition of charge on persons convicted of drink- driving and increase the amount of the charge. DoT
- Introduce legal provision for outsourcing of collection of fixed charges and other improvements to the penalty points system. DoT
- Provide for and introduce private operation of speed cameras. DJELR, Garda Síochána, DoT
- Provide a legal basis for compulsory initial practical training for motorcyclists. DoT
- Provide a legal basis for control of use of mobile phones by drivers. . DoT
- Establish Driver Testing and Standards Authority. DoT
- Pursue arrangements for mutual recognition of penalty points with Northern Ireland and British authorities. DoT
- Consider introduction of proposals that local authorities develop local road safety plans as part of their road functions. Síochána, NSC, NRA,
CCMA, DEHLG, DoT, Garda
- Roll out penalty points to all applicable offences. . DoT, DJELR, Garda
- All exemptions from the requirement for adults to wear seat-belts where fitted will be DoT
abolished, except for exemptions on medical grounds; exemptions for children to be addressed in the context of EU Directive. - Prepare fixed charge regulations to replace the on-the-spot fine system. DoT
- Support adoption of EU Directive setting type approval standards for “pedestrian friendly” vehicle fronts. DoT
- Prepare licensing regulations to discourage long-term reliance on provisional licences. DoT
- Introduction of requirement for motorcyclists with provisional licences to display L-plates. DoT
- Introduce legal provision for on-the-spot fines for licensing and tachograph offences by heavy DoT
goods vehicles and buses. - Other legal and organisational changes
- Finalise the required standard for recognition as a driving instructor. DoT
- Introduce regulation of driving instruction and commence legislation prohibiting driving DoT
instruction for reward by persons not holding an instruction certificate. - Introduce “credit-card” type plastic driving licence. DoT
- Bring into operation the Garda Fixed Charge Processing System and integrate it with the Courts Service IT system and the National Driver File. Courts Service, DEHLG, DJELR, Garda Síochána
- Review Rules of the Road and issue the new edition. DoT
- Establish drug recognition programmes for Gardai and doctors. MBRS
- Pursue the implementation of the EU Convention on Driving Disqualification, initially on the basis of bilateral arrangements with the United Kingdom. DoT
- Examine options for the role and make-up of the proposed Traffic Corps. DJELR, Garda Síochána DoT
- Continue major public awareness campaigns on specific road safety issues. NSC
- Continue bank holiday promotional campaigns. NSC
- Develop public awareness campaign on the metrication of speed limits. NSC
- Further develop the National Safety Council website and the Council’s penalty points website. NSC
- Development of road safety information and awareness material aimed at motorcyclists. NSC
- National Safety Council to develop and carry out a series of information talks on road safety issues for the elderly. NSC
- New cycle safety leaflet aimed at children to be distributed. NSC
- Promote use of the resources in primary and secondary schools, including involvement of Garda NSC, Garda Síochána
- Community Officers in promoting these.
- Re-assess “Be Safe” and “Staying Alive” to fit them to modern education best practice. NSC
- Develop course material for a junior cycle road safety resource. NSC
- Pursue road safety work focused on third level students. NSC
- Continue the Irish Road Safety Endeavour Awards. NSC
- Review of the role of local authority road safety officers. DoT, DEHLG, NRA, NSC, CCMA
- Explore potential for use of community involvement under the health care primary care strategy and local primary health care teams as forums for road safety promotion. DoHC
- Further develop links between the National Safety Council and Community Alert and Neighbourhood Watch schemes. NSC, Garda Síochána
- Implement pilot local road safety plans in two local authority areas . DoT, DEHLG, NRA, NSC, Garda Síochána, CCMA
- Carry out further research on daytime running lights, paying particular attention to EU-commissioned work in this area. DoT
- Pursue the introduction of a scheme for testing imported vehicles before registration. DoT
- Pursue making light commercial vehicles liable to roadworthiness testing at the same frequency as other classes.DoT
- Examine the potential benefits of introducing a roadworthiness test for motorcycles and decide whether to introduce such a scheme. DoT
- Revise standards for large psvs in line with the “buses” Directive. DoT
- Investigate opportunities to exploit intelligent transport systems and the emergence of electronic “birth certificates” for vehicles for road safety. DoT
- Consider the regulation of the maximum height of vehicles. DoT
- Pursue ratification of the 1958 Geneva Agreement on Vehicle Regulation. DoT
- Review the institutional arrangements for road safety research. HLG
- Pursue the question of how best to collate and use information acquired in road collision investigations. NRA, Garda Síochána, DoT
- Carry out comprehensive national speed survey in 2005. NRA
- Study the collision history at the 109 “High Accident Locations” identified in the NRA High Accident Location report and recommend appropriate treatment for each location where the road has been a factor in the collisions. NRA
- Carry out comprehensive national seat-belt wearing survey in 2005 . NRA
- Review of the 1996-1997 Accident Remedial Measures Programme. NRA
- Evaluation of traffic calming schemes constructed in 1997-1998. NRA
- Evaluation of the safety performance of different road types. NRA
- Use of incident detection camera to investigate conflicts at junctions. NRA
- Participate in EuroRAP - the European comparative Road Safety Performance project . NRA
- Participate in SARTRE survey - the European Driver Attitude Survey. NRA
- “Forgiving Roadsides” - initiate research and develop policy on fixed roadside objects. NRA
- Quality control of road safety audits. NRA
- Produce refined estimate of the safety dividend to be achieved as a direct result of the proposed programme of major road schemes.NRA
- Investigate reporting mechanisms for collisions with the aim of increasing the accuracy of collision data, particularly in relation to injury collisions. IIF, DoHC, NSC, NRA, Garda Síochána
- Research road safety activities in other countries and jurisdictions in order to view and assess best practice ideas, actions and concepts for potential successful application to Ireland. NSC
- Complete cross-departmental review of road safety expenditure and examine any recommendations as to how the efficiency of this expenditure may be increased. DoHC, DEHLG, DoT, NRA, DJELR,
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i'm afriad i am going to be very blunt on this one..
1. teach people to cross the road properly.
2. teach people how to drive properly (no provisional drivers).
3. Fix the roads to meet the standards of other modern countries.0 -
4 - ban lorries/trucks from using the roads between the hours of 8am - midnight.
I'm sick of reading about truck drivers escaping with "shock and minor injuries" :rolleyes:
Road deaths were at a savage level in the 70's0 -
We're perhaps the only country left in Europe to have single lane bodhrines classed as 'National' roads connecting our major cities.
The majority of fatal accidents occur on the N roads as a result of an overtaking maneouver, usually late at night/early morning and usually during the weekend and involving drivers under 30.
It's obvious that penalty points have been a massive failure.
Either we build a proper system of motorways, or we just continue to let natural selection do its thing.0 -
Can you point out a specific location for this?DublinWriter wrote:We're perhaps the only country left in Europe to have single lane bodhrines classed as 'National' roads connecting our major cities.
Most accidents have only one exacerbating cause.The majority of fatal accidents occur on the N roads as a result of an overtaking maneouver, usually late at night/early morning and usually during the weekend and involving drivers under 30.0 -
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What will help:
Reduction in blood/alcohol level
Better driver education
Continued improvement of road design, surfaces and maintenance
Introduction of all penalty points offences
Proactive and fair policing
While motorway networks are great and safer, I don't think they are essential. Australia has good road safety stats yet much of their network is rural and single lane. They do have very proactive and visible policing in regard to speeding and drink driving.0 -
5 more have been killed since I posted thatA 25-year-old man was killed yesterday when the four-wheel drive vehicle he was driving hit a ditch and overturned at Ballygarvey Beg, Rathowen, Co Westmeath, at about 3am.
He was Declan Boyce of Kinard, Legan, Co Longford. He was travelling alone and was pronounced dead at the scene.
On Saturday, Brendan Moloney (21) of Main Street, Broadford, Co Clare, died when the car he was driving hit a stone wall at Kilmore in Broadford shortly before 7pm.
A 46-year-old pedestrian died after he was hit by a car in Co Dublin.
Bernard Smyth was walking at Rathbeale Road in Swords shortly before 8pm on Saturday when the collision occured.
He died later in Beaumont Hospital in Dublin.Two young male motorcyclists have died and a third man is in a serious condition in hospital following separate overnight road accidents in Limerick and Cavan.
A 26-year-old man died after his bike was in collision with a car near Clarina in Co Limerick, while a man in his late teens died when his bike crashed into a ditch near Ballinagh in Co Cavan.
Both accidents happened shortly after 10pm.
The driver of the car involved in the Co Limerick crash was also seriously injured.0 -
I see 4 of those 5 killed this weekend were males under the age of 30, no wonder our insurance is so high.0
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BrianD wrote:What will help:
Reduction in blood/alcohol level
I don't think this is necessary, if they would concentrate on enforcing the current level it would save a lot more lives. Anytime I am driving around the time of pub closing hours I NEVER come accross a Garda checkpoint. I only ever see them at lunchtime in Rathmines checking tax. :rolleyes: And the amount of cars in pub car parks every night, 50% of them have got to be drink driving. If the cops just set up a checkpoint down the road from the pub they would catch a lot of them.0 -
Perhaps we should concentrate on those areas that can be improved. I think its going to be near impossible to stop the guys that get into their cars after the nightclub and tear off down country lanes and crashing. Drink driving check points outside of night clubs might be one solution but not very practical. I guess if you look at any country's road stats you'll probably find these guys in there.0
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HelterSkelter wrote:I don't think this is necessare, they should concentrate on enforcing the current level. Anytime I am driving around the time of pub closing hours I NEVER come accross a Garda checkpoint. I only ever see them at lunchtime in Rathmines checking tax. :rolleyes:
I agree with you on the enforcement but I also think a reduction in the level is necessary. This means that after one drink you are on the threshold but are in a condition where you need to make a decision - do I switch to soft drinks or make alternative arrangements? There will be many who will prefer to go dry rather than even risk being over the limit on one drink and all the better for it.
Again I'll point to Australian road stats - in the state of Victoria where the limit is lower the total road fatalities toll is less than those who die from drink-driving in Ireland.0 -
BrianD wrote:I agree with you on the enforcement but I also think a reduction in the level is necessary. This means that after one drink you are on the threshold but are in a condition where you need to make a decision - do I switch to soft drinks or make alternative arrangements? There will be many who will prefer to go dry rather than even risk being over the limit on one drink and all the better for it.
I thought one drink was more or less the limit already and two would put you over? Is it not the case that the majority of drink related accidents are caused by drivers twice or three times the current limit? Certainly any newspaper reports I read seem to indicate this. I'm not convinced lowering the limit would solve anything.0 -
This is exactly what I'm talking about, what's the point in making the drink driving laws stricter if we can't even work with the ones we have...
http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/0530/drink.html
New figures show that only around one in four motorists arrested for drink driving end up convicted in the Courts.
The National Safety Council has called for legal reforms to make prosecutions easier.
Launching the "Arrive Alive" campaign, chairman Eddie Shaw said that although the numbers of drivers arrested for drinking had increased the numbers convicted in the courts more than halved between 2001 and 2003.
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The Council also published results of a survey showing that almost 40 per cent of motorists admit to driving after drinking alcohol.0 -
Check out the line highlighted in bold from the indo article today...
(http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1405829&issue_id=12545)
Garda amazed at drink-driving rate
A SENIOR garda said yesterday he was astounded at the numbers being arrested for drink driving.
Supt John Kerin of Ennis Garda Station said the numbers arrested on suspicion of drink driving in Clare over the recent May bank-holiday weekend were up two-thirds on the corresponding weekend last year.
"There were 12 people arrested over the May bank holiday weekend," he said.
"Countywide, the figure is up 34 for the year. It is a sad, sad, sad reflection on people's whole attitude to driving and drink driving.
"I can't understand why people aren't getting the message. Our figures last year were up on the previous year and our current figures are way up on 2004.
Supt Kerin said: "We were astounded with the bank-holiday weekend figures. Those that went under the intoxiliser, their readings were mostly two or three times the legal limit."
A spokesman for the National Safety Council said in response to the figures yesterday: "I would hope that the increased number of arrests is connected to increased levels of Garda enforcement of the drink-driving laws.
"It is a welcome development that more drivers are being caught," the spokesman said. "The message must get out to people that persist in drink driving that they are a threat to the community."
Gordon Deegan0 -
My answer to the question would be better enforcement. The Gardai are unable, unwilling or unequipt to properly enforce the rules of the road. As a driver, I've come to learn that the chance of being nabbed for speeding, for example, is tiny. After a while it just becomes normal to always exceed the speed limit if only by 10% or so. I've seen people get away with crazy manouvers and speeds on the roads. Penalty points don't really help if the chances of being nabbed are still miniscule. In any situation where the chance of being caught breaking the law is tiny, justice is trivialised because fate or luck determines whether you are punished. As a result, people have no respect for the rules of the road because justice is not seen to be done. I'd have a lot more respect for the rules if I saw some crazy death-wish driver being arrested after triple overtaking near a bend at 100mph.
I'd take away responsibility for basic enforcement from the guards and let private companies bid for the right to catch speeding offences in each local government area. They would be incentivised by letting them pocket the money collected from fines. I'd probably also do the same for checking NCT/tax/insurance and maybe eventually also for dealing with drink driving. This has worked very well for parking in cities with the clamping operators. The compliance with parking regulations is now very, very high. The same could be achieved for the other rules of the road. This would also free up the guards to work on other crimes and hopefully would be self-financing.0 -
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