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Can FF acutally manage to recover and become a major force in Irish Politics?

13

Comments

  • #62
    Voodoo_rasher
    Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭Voodoo_rasher


    It would take a tsunami to wipe out FF (Soldiers of Infamy) and their numbskull plague of followers


    They've (FF) not gone away you know!

    http://www.herald.ie/news/how-down-in-dumps-ff-still-raised-550k-2985203.html


  • #63
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    That was raised just mainly from members alone too I do believe :)


  • #64
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    I would hate to see FF back in government. I do hope that most folk won't forget that the VAT increase, household charge etc etc combined are less than the universal social charge and than the current government have made efforts to reduce folks' on very low pay exposure to that income tax or charge.

    Also our problems started with the giveaway budgets from 2002 ish.


  • #65
    Sierra Oscar
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,458 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    Voodoo_rasher wrote: »
    It would take a tsunami to wipe out FF (Soldiers of Infamy) and their numbskull plague of followers


    They've (FF) not gone away you know!

    http://www.herald.ie/news/how-down-in-dumps-ff-still-raised-550k-2985203.html

    I do believe that the current plan is to reduce the parties debt year on year and eradicate it entirely in the run up to the 2014 local elections, with a large election fund expected to be built for the local elections themselves.

    All such fund-raising will be raised directly through individual members or the community - corporate donations are banned within the party.


  • #66
    Bishop_Donal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 615 ✭✭✭Bishop_Donal


    I think there is a genuine chance that FF will be the largest party in the next Dáil. It really only requires about 1 to 2% of a switch after each budget from FG to FF. That seems very likely to me bearing in mind the backlash we have seen after the recent very soft budget.

    It seems that the aggregate vote for those parties really doesn't want to travel too far across the political spectrum.


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  • #67
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,429 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Bishop_Donal wrote: »
    I think there is a genuine chance that FF will be the largest party in the next Dáil. It really only requires about 1 to 2% of a switch after each budget from FG to FF. That seems very likely to me bearing in mind the backlash we have seen after the recent very soft budget.

    It seems that the aggregate vote for those parties really doesn't want to travel too far across the political spectrum.

    There is absolutely no chance. The budgets will remind us of the trouble they caused. Politics is changing. I can see a big shift towards the left though as F.G. are just F.F. Mk.2 as they are taking on their policies. The voters are no fools, just look at the recent referenda.


  • #68
    Bishop_Donal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 615 ✭✭✭Bishop_Donal


    tayto lover wrote: »
    There is absolutely no chance. The budgets will remind us of the trouble they caused. Politics is changing. I can see a big shift towards the left though as F.G. are just F.F. Mk.2 as they are taking on their policies. The voters are no fools, just look at the recent referenda.

    Well, I don't see it going to Labour. So it will be interesting to see where it winds up then.

    A lot of people just won't vote SF when push comes to shove.


  • #69
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,429 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Bishop_Donal wrote: »
    Well, I don't see it going to Labour. So it will be interesting to see where it winds up then.

    A lot of people just won't SF when push comes to shove.

    I agree but I can see the emergence of a new party which if run properly will sweep the boards. The people are crying out for change.


  • #70
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I agree but I can see the emergence of a new party which if run properly will sweep the boards. The people are crying out for change.

    SOME people are crying out for change.

    Others will wax lyrical about change but - if it affects them - won't accept it and won't vote for it.

    My issue is that any party that approaches that change FAIRLY and RELATIVELY across the board will be given consideration.

    The problem is that everyone has their own definition of those subjective words.


  • #71
    Bishop_Donal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 615 ✭✭✭Bishop_Donal


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I agree but I can see the emergence of a new party which if run properly will sweep the boards. The people are crying out for change.

    That's certainly true & I concur with you, but is has been true for a long time now. The fact that no-one seems to have taken the initiative before now would concern me that no-one is going to.


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  • #72
    john reilly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 409 ✭✭john reilly


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I agree but I can see the emergence of a new party which if run properly will sweep the boards. The people are crying out for change.
    Crying out for change really. why then did they vote for f.g and lab. when there was only one party offering real change. This amazing new party where wil it stand on issues like abortion, northern ireland, public sector pay, social welfare payouts, tax rates, dealing with unions, dealing with e,u and the imf. Just some non contraversial issues like that were it should be easy to get agreement.


  • #73
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    john reilly wrote: »
    Crying out for change really. why then did they vote for f.g and lab. when there was only one party offering real change. This amazing new party where wil it stand on issues like abortion, northern ireland, public sector pay, social welfare payouts, tax rates, dealing with unions, dealing with e,u and the imf. Just some non contraversial issues like that were it should be easy to get agreement.


    What party was this? I certainly don't remember any party offering us real change.


  • #74
    dublinman1990
    Registered Users Posts: 8,299 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    I've seen 2 young FF canvassers who were handing out leaflets for Barry Andrews during the last GE. They were handing out pens in addition to their canvass leaflet. I knew particularly by their age, that was all well and good, However, their class in comparison to mine was definitely striking.

    It was highly likely that those young canvassers were from Blackrock College. I say that because Barry Andrews was a past pupil there. He got those two to work for him because he probably didn't want to seen out in public too much as being part of a government who

    Another Point - That €550k being raised in the super draw displayed in the herald article may have more likely been raised in part probably by the canvassers wealthy parents rather than ordinary working joe soaps.

    From a perspective viewpoint, people have got to look from at the members of any other party, particularly grass root members, to see what they are actually like.

    I haven't met them, but, it would make the public's vote a real difference for future GE IMO.


  • #75
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    john reilly wrote: »
    Crying out for change really. why then did they vote for f.g and lab. when there was only one party offering real change. This amazing new party where wil it stand on issues like abortion, northern ireland, public sector pay, social welfare payouts, tax rates, dealing with unions, dealing with e,u and the imf. Just some non contraversial issues like that were it should be easy to get agreement.


    What party was this? I certainly don't remember any party offering us real change.

    I'd be interested in finding out too, because I was stuck as to who to vote for.


  • #76
    raymon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    "Michael Martin attacked Enda Kenny today in the dail over ........... "

    I am no fan of Enda, but this is the type of whinge politics headlines we expect to see from the FFers daily for the next few years. Just fill in the blank word yourself daily

    That's right the same crowd that bankrupted the country . They caused this mess.

    To answer the op ... I don't think you can whinge your way back to recovery especially when you caused the mess.


  • #77
    fatalll
    Registered Users Posts: 437 ✭✭fatalll


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I would hate to see FF back in government. I do hope that most folk won't forget that the VAT increase, household charge etc etc combined are less than the universal social charge and than the current government have made efforts to reduce folks' on very low pay exposure to that income tax or charge.

    Also our problems started with the giveaway budgets from 2002 ish.
    Can I ask..did you complain at the time?
    I dont think any of us did you see...or very few...
    I think the 100% mortgages were the start of it...Financial Regulator/ Central Bank, Government and TD's to blame

    btw...i vote every different way..
    have voted FF, FG, SF, Labour...


  • #78
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    fatalll wrote: »
    RoverJames wrote: »
    I would hate to see FF back in government. I do hope that most folk won't forget that the VAT increase, household charge etc etc combined are less than the universal social charge and than the current government have made efforts to reduce folks' on very low pay exposure to that income tax or charge.

    Also our problems started with the giveaway budgets from 2002 ish.
    Can I ask..did you complain at the time?
    I dont think any of us did you see...or very few...
    I think the 100% mortgages were the start of it...Financial Regulator/ Central Bank, Government and TD's to blame

    btw...i vote every different way..
    have voted FF, FG, SF, Labour...

    You'd be wrong on the bit in bold.

    I did.
    I walked out of a bank and closed an account when they mentioned "property ladder", telling them I wanted a home
    I stuck to my guns on a loan re a house when they said I could have double (which they knew I couldn't afford, based on figures I gave them)
    I ignored what people said my house would eventually be worth after renovations and did what I needed, not what some TV show or estate agent would have tried to say "the market would love"
    I told people they were crazy putting cars and holidays and credit card bills onto mortgages, since they wouldn't remember the destination or car reg or whatever in 40 years time
    I refused to charge people double just because they had it; my prices have barely changed since the recession (because they weren't bloated) and thankfully I'm busier than ever the past 8 months or so

    And I doubt I was alone considering Ahern told those like me to commit suicide - I'm not THAT high-profile!

    So lose the inverted "we all" please.


  • #79
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,429 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    You'd be wrong on the bit in bold.

    I did.
    I walked out of a bank and closed an account when they mentioned "property ladder", telling them I wanted a home
    I stuck to my guns on a loan re a house when they said I could have double (which they knew I couldn't afford, based on figures I gave them)
    I ignored what people said my house would eventually be worth after renovations and did what I needed, not what some TV show or estate agent would have tried to say "the market would love"
    I told people they were crazy putting cars and holidays and credit card bills onto mortgages, since they wouldn't remember the destination or car reg or whatever in 40 years time
    I refused to charge people double just because they had it; my prices have barely changed since the recession (because they weren't bloated) and thankfully I'm busier than ever the past 8 months or so

    And I doubt I was alone considering Ahern told those like me to commit suicide - I'm not THAT high-profile!

    So lose the inverted "we all" please.

    I wouldn't even take a credit card as I always believed in buying something when I have the money in my hand. Refused a top-up on my mortgage when I nearly had it paid off and drove the car I could afford despite being offered money for a new one by the bank. I never went on a foreign holiday despite being offered the loan for it. Yet people are telling me on here that I have had it good. This "we all" is very annoying.


  • #80
    newman10
    Registered Users Posts: 975 ✭✭✭newman10


    But in light of the arrogance shown by Noonan regarding emigration of young people, FG should be careful that they do not become the new FF


  • #81
    Sierra Oscar
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,458 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    The nominations for the internal party positions to be filled by election at the Ard Fheis have closed and a list of candidates has been published.

    The sheer volume of people seeking election this time around affirms my belief that this Ard Fheis is going to be a big one in terms of moving towards party reform - although the challenge for the party will be to walk the walk after all the discussing and debating at the Ard Fheis itself.


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  • #82
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Sierra Oscar wrote: »
    The nominations for the internal party positions to be filled by election at the Ard Fheis have closed and a list of candidates has been published.

    No-one credible running for party president ?


  • #83
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    Wider Road wrote: »
    Foxhound38 wrote: »

    Look at the tribunal numbers. FG has had few people hauled up in comparison, I don't think Labour has ever

    The Bernard Lynch story needs a Tribunal all to its-self.
    Bernard Lynch, husband of Jnr Minister Kathleen was given a sentence in 1975 along with 4 others for the murder of Larry White. Bernard got released because a warrant was out of date and his brother Ciaran is a Labour TD in Cork. Its widely believed that Bernard pulled the trigger the night Larry White was murdered.
    The current govt employ Bernard Lynch!!!

    Tribunals or not the figures tell their own story. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index


  • #84
    Wider Road
    Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭Wider Road


    And your point is?


  • #85
    Liam Byrne
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    miju wrote: »
    Wider Road wrote: »
    Foxhound38 wrote: »

    Look at the tribunal numbers. FG has had few people hauled up in comparison, I don't think Labour has ever

    The Bernard Lynch story needs a Tribunal all to its-self.
    Bernard Lynch, husband of Jnr Minister Kathleen was given a sentence in 1975 along with 4 others for the murder of Larry White. Bernard got released because a warrant was out of date and his brother Ciaran is a Labour TD in Cork. Its widely believed that Bernard pulled the trigger the night Larry White was murdered.
    The current govt employ Bernard Lynch!!!

    Tribunals or not the figures tell their own story. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

    Nice to see that index mentions nepotism - some that Ahern openly admitted to and yet it wasn't followed up on by the media.


  • #86
    miju
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 8,486 ✭✭✭miju


    very true. but nepotism is also most certainly very rife in the current government also despite FG and LAB cries of FF nepotism when they were in opposition they are just as bad if not worse


  • #87
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,429 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    newman10 wrote: »
    But in light of the arrogance shown by Noonan regarding emigration of young people, FG should be careful that they do not become the new FF

    Too late.


  • #88
    Voodoo_rasher
    Registered Users Posts: 521 ✭✭✭Voodoo_rasher


    you mean the same Soldiers of Infamy who took (and swallowed) flawed

    advice from predatory banks (G o l d m a n 'Sucks, R o t s child s) believed it,

    and sold us down the swanny..please!

    They've (FF) not gone away you know ; )


  • #89
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    They will be the leading party in forming the next Government, because the majority of Irish people are tribal idiots.

    They will always be the biggest political party, and Ireland will always exist in mire.


  • #90
    Freiheit
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,783 ✭✭✭Freiheit


    Theyr'e at 18% in the new poll....where is the alternative???....

    We need new parties,F.G.,Labour,F.F. 3 sides of the one coin,S.F. economic illiterates. There's nobody in my heart who I feel deserves my vote.


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  • #91
    raymon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    To answer the op , FF are definitely stagnating.

    At 18% in the latest poll, their whinge politics has not got them off their low stoop.

    Even independents and SF are on the rise at the expense of FG/lab

    Stuck in the mud


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