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Best results in subject

  • 07-07-2014 4:34pm
    #1
    neutralvu
    Registered Users Posts: 85 ✭✭


    .


Comments

  • #2
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    You mean who got top in each individual subject? I don't think there is a formal way of getting that information, it would probably come under data protection as they are personal details relating to individuals.

    On the other hand, some subject associations award prizes for the top mark in their subject, so maybe they use the SEC as a go between to notify top scoring students.


  • #3
    bb1234567
    Registered Users Posts: 5,491 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    But how can somebody do the best ? Like in a subject like maths or biology where theres only one right answer Im sure atleast a little handful of students all got 100%


  • #4
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,102 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    But how can somebody do the best ? Like in a subject like maths or biology where theres only one right answer Im sure atleast a little handful of students all got 100%

    Very few get 100% at LC, though some subjects lend themselves more to the possibility. Those marking are asked by their Advising Examiners to identify such scripts.

    I corrected JC (and before that Inter. and Group) History and not once did I have a 100% script.


  • #5
    bb1234567
    Registered Users Posts: 5,491 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    spurious wrote: »
    Very few get 100% at LC, though some subjects lend themselves more to the possibility. Those marking are asked by their Advising Examiners to identify such scripts.

    I corrected JC (and before that Inter. and Group) History and not once did I have a 100% script.

    Ah I know its very uncommon like but I mean Im sure atleast 5 or 6 students somewhere in the country will get 100% in biology or maths or whatever!


  • #6
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,102 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    bb1234567 wrote: »
    Ah I know its very uncommon like but I mean Im sure atleast 5 or 6 students somewhere in the country will get 100% in biology or maths or whatever!

    Maths more likely than Biology.


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  • #7
    xLisaBx
    Registered Users Posts: 901 ✭✭✭xLisaBx


    I could see people getting 100 in biology. I did in practise pre's and I'm no genius


  • #8
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,102 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    xLisaBx wrote: »
    I could see people getting 100 in biology. I did in practise pre's and I'm no genius

    It's one of those subjects that marking schemes can be looking for particular words, so it's unpredictable, but formula based subjects there is less chance of different interpretations.


  • #9
    xLisaBx
    Registered Users Posts: 901 ✭✭✭xLisaBx


    spurious wrote: »
    It's one of those subjects that marking schemes can be looking for particular words, so it's unpredictable, but formula based subjects there is less chance of different interpretations.

    True. I think there's less trouble with misinterpreting the wording of questions in maths too


  • #10
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    xLisaBx wrote: »
    I could see people getting 100 in biology. I did in practise pre's and I'm no genius

    Possibly, but in nearly every exam there's a curve ball question that catches out almost everyone.

    Far more likely in Applied Maths, where there is a definite answer to the questions asked and the A rate in 2013 was 26.5%. Of that 13.5% were A1 grades.


  • #11
    robman60
    Registered Users Posts: 2,222 ✭✭✭robman60


    I'd imagine a good few people in Accounting get 100%. As the above poster said, Applied Maths is another possibility. I really don't think anything less than perfection would do it though. My brother got 296/300 in Applied Maths a few years ago, having made one very minor mistake and he was never contacted by the SEC. That suggests there were some students who achieved full marks.


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  • #12
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    If they gave percentile scores like in the hpat you'd know how you did compared to other canidates . I think percentile scored would be good .


  • #13
    robman60
    Registered Users Posts: 2,222 ✭✭✭robman60


    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    If they gave percentile scores like in the hpat you'd know how you did compared to other canidates . I think percentile scored would be good .
    Percentiles are good in many ways, but fail to account for the difference in calibre of students sitting different subjects.

    To generalise completely, Chemistry seems to attract brighter students than Biology. Similarly, Accounting seems to attract better students than business. Percentiles would only be effective if all students sat the same subjects imo.


  • #14
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    robman60 wrote: »
    Percentiles are good in many ways, but fail to account for the difference in calibre of students sitting different subjects.

    To generalise completely, Chemistry seems to attract brighter students than Biology. Similarly, Accounting seems to attract better students than business. Percentiles would only be effective if all students sat the same subjects imo.

    That's like saying an A1 in chemistry is more difficult to achieve than an A1 in biology . It's true , yet you still get 100 points for each . Not a very valid argument in my opinion.

    Anyway, I was only suggesting it might be good . What I meant was you still get your A ,B , C etc .. But you also get a percentile a score to let you know how you performed compared to others . It wouldn't have to affect your cao application or anything .


  • #15
    robman60
    Registered Users Posts: 2,222 ✭✭✭robman60


    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    That's like saying an A1 in chemistry is more difficult to achieve than an A1 in biology . It's true , yet you still get 100 points for each . Not a very valid argument in my opinion.
    No it's not. It's saying it's harder to achieve a top 10% score in Chemistry than in Biology, as the candidates to whom you are compared are more talented academically.
    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    Anyway, I was only suggesting it might be good . What I meant was you still get your A ,B , C etc .. But you also get a percentile a score to let you know how you performed compared to others . It wouldn't have to affect your cao application or anything .
    I agree it would be very interesting and satisfying from a student's viewpoint. It's more difficult in most subjects to get an A1 than to be in the top 10% of candidates.


  • #16
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    The stats on the SEC website show the breakdown by subject of what percentage of students got each grade anyway, so you have an idea where you rank


  • #17
    flump_master
    Closed Accounts Posts: 89 ✭✭flump_master


    Surely introducing percentiles would lead to a more extreme point race? Even if they initially weren't divulged to the CAO I don't imagine that would last. Eventually colleges would begin giving weight to percentiles and you'd have a situation whereby it isn't even enough to get an A1, you would have to be in the 95th percentile or above for courses like medicine. The positive of not knowing your percentile score is that all grades are equal, my B1 in Spanish is equal to anyone else's B1 in Spanish. We're looking to move away from the 14 band grading system, percentiles won't aid that


  • #18
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    rainbowtrout wrote: »
    The stats on the SEC website show the breakdown by subject of what percentage of students got each grade anyway, so you have an idea where you rank

    They tell you how many people got each grade . However an a1 ranges between. 90 to 100 percent . Percentile would tell you how you compared with other people who got a1s. Pretty pointless really but it would be interesting to see how you fared against everyone else.


  • #19
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    They tell you how many people got each grade . However an a1 ranges between. 90 to 100 percent . Percentile would tell you how you compared with other people who got a1s. Pretty pointless really but it would be interesting to see how you fared against everyone else.


    They give percentages if you have a look at their spreadsheets.

    I agree with the other post, if percentiles were released it would put pressure on the points system to change. It would also mean the whole country would be appealing to get one or two extra marks.

    Sample stat: 13.5% of people sitting HL Applied Maths got an A1 last year.
    1% of people sitting HL Art got an A1.

    Is that not enough to know?

    You can view your script anyway to see your exact mark.


  • #20
    First_October
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭First_October


    Maybe I can shed some light on students getting top marks. I got the gold medal for coming first in economics, and got a gold medal for second place in physics.

    Medals for first place are awarded in almost every Leaving Cert. subject, either by subject associations (BSTAI, IOP, etc.) or by the Department itself. Only a few subjects award more than one: TG and woodwork for first, second, third; applied maths awards three, but the students will generally share first place with the same mark. Only TG and woodwork award them for ordinary level exams as well. Also, with some medals, such as applied maths, you get money!

    Medals are only awarded for a few Junior Cert. subjects, including TG, woodwork, business, and latin.

    Physics doesn't officially award a second place medal, but I got one for some reason. My mark was 99% so the person who came first obviously got 100% (or maybe I tied, see next paragraph).

    If there are scripts tied for first place, and only one medal is to be awarded, the chief examiner will decide which is the `best' by looking at difficulty of questions answered, comparing quality of answers, etc. Thus, a fair bit of luck is often involved on top of having a brilliant exam.

    For Leaving Cert. students it probably isn't the best to focus on trying to get first-place awards, as this usually leads to disappointment. (Although I'm probably being a hypocrite here!) There are, after all, more important things in life than exams and their results.


  • #21
    richardh330
    Registered Users Posts: 60 ✭✭richardh330


    I know in the front hall of the Institute of Education in Dublin there are pictures of students receiving medals for Applied Maths and Physics, I think they were all the subjects but I'm not entirely sure.


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  • #22
    Badwulf
    Registered Users Posts: 411 ✭✭Badwulf


    To the guy who said there is only one right answer for Biology, that wasn't the case this year, this year was basically "Project Biology", read the paragraph and answer the questions on it :pac:


  • #23
    LC12395
    Registered Users Posts: 20 ✭LC12395


    First_October wrote: »
    Maybe I can shed some light on students getting top marks. I got the gold medal for coming first in economics, and got a gold medal for second place in physics.

    Medals for first place are awarded in almost every Leaving Cert. subject, either by subject associations (BSTAI, IOP, etc.) or by the Department itself. Only a few subjects award more than one: TG and woodwork for first, second, third; applied maths awards three, but the students will generally share first place with the same mark. Only TG and woodwork award them for ordinary level exams as well. Also, with some medals, such as applied maths, you get money!

    Medals are only awarded for a few Junior Cert. subjects, including TG, woodwork, business, and latin.

    Physics doesn't officially award a second place medal, but I got one for some reason. My mark was 99% so the person who came first obviously got 100% (or maybe I tied, see next paragraph).

    If there are scripts tied for first place, and only one medal is to be awarded, the chief examiner will decide which is the `best' by looking at difficulty of questions answered, comparing quality of answers, etc. Thus, a fair bit of luck is often involved on top of having a brilliant exam.

    For Leaving Cert. students it probably isn't the best to focus on trying to get first-place awards, as this usually leads to disappointment. (Although I'm probably being a hypocrite here!) There are, after all, more important things in life than exams and their results.

    When did you find out that you got the highest marks? Was it as soon as you got your leaving cert results or later?


  • #24
    First_October
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭First_October


    LC12395 wrote: »
    When did you find out that you got the highest marks? Was it as soon as you got your leaving cert results or later?
    `

    Depends on the subject. Generally after results come out.


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