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mira shower. new butnot working

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  • 19-10-2013 1:59pm
    #1
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭


    Bought new mira escape thermostatic 9.0-9.8 kw shower and not working properly.

    Turned the water off for it at the tank at the attic. turned the inlet connector so it fitted the 1/2 inch copper pipe and connected it. Wired it up properly, turned it on but its not working right. Theres water coming out of the shower hose but its not powering up. The light of the shower is on so its getting power. Anyone know why this isnt working.


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    #2
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    Im wondering wold it have anything to do with the inlet connector. Its saying in the diagram "bottom entry" for the cold water pipe but ive swiveled the inlet connector so it would fit the cold water supply coming in from behind it. Im thinking this would be ok, 1 for it being able to swivel in that direction and 2, the other shower was connected this way .


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    #3
    LIFFY FISHING
    Registered Users Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭LIFFY FISHING


    It is supposed to be connected to your mains water supply!


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    #4
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    LIFFY FISHING wrote: »
    It is supposed to be connected to your mains water supply!



    No chance! why you say thay. Sure the last one came of the tank


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    #5
    anthonyos
    Registered Users Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭anthonyos


    your new shower is mains fed not tank fed like your old one


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    #6
    LIFFY FISHING
    Registered Users Posts: 1,791 ✭✭✭LIFFY FISHING


    yoloc wrote: »
    No chance! why you say thay. Sure the last one came of the tank

    If you read the installation manual you can confirm I am right, there are 2 different types of instant showers, one tank fed, like ur old one, & you bought a mains fed one.


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  • Options
    #7
    spireland32
    Closed Accounts Posts: 342 ✭✭spireland32


    Sorry but its a mains shower.... should have got someone who knew what they were doing. People trying to be smart... Doing something they know nothing about. But sure how hard can it be its only a pipe and cable. Couple of screws.

    Plumber wants €90-€120 to fit a shower difference is (most) know what they're doing. Your paying for the knowledge, experience and expertise on top of all the other costs associated with a business.

    I love when people make a bags of it and ring me back to repair their handy work.


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    #8
    Billy Bunting
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    I'd also want danger money after a diy fix, God only knows what your walking into.. :D


  • Options
    #9
    Mr.Fred
    Registered Users Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭Mr.Fred


    LIFFY FISHING wrote: »
    It is supposed to be connected to your mains water supply!

    It wouldn't be a particularly difficult fix op to connect to the mains so don't panic.


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    #10
    Outkast_IRE
    Registered Users Posts: 7,515 ✭✭✭Outkast_IRE


    Mr.Fred wrote: »
    It wouldn't be a particularly difficult fix op to connect to the mains so don't panic.

    Depends on mains pressure in the area.


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    #11
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Mr.Fred wrote: »
    It wouldn't be a particularly difficult fix op to connect to the mains so don't panic.

    Its not always possible to use a Mains Fed shower in every house.
    Pipe-work aside, you need to do a running mains water pressure test first. What this means is that you fit a pressure gauge to a point on the mains (I usually disconnect the feed to the attic tank and fit it there) and open the cold kitchen tap.
    While the tap is running, as this has the strongest draw, the pressure gauge must maintain a set pressure. If my memory is correct Mira specify 0.85 bar but I prefer a Minimum of 1.00 bar with the kitchen tap fully open.
    If the system does not pass this simple test I refuse to fit them.


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    #12
    Billy Bunting
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    Mr.Fred wrote: »
    It wouldn't be a particularly difficult fix op to connect to the mains so don't panic.

    I would also be concerned that if he has made such a basic mistake as not reading the instructions just what is the electrical side like, DIY is a great think but Electricity can kill.

    I would suggest the safest option is to get in a person who knows what they are doing.


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    #13
    Mr.Fred
    Registered Users Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭Mr.Fred


    Billy Bunting wrote: »
    I would also be concerned that if he has made such a basic mistake as not reading the instructions just what is the electrical side like, DIY is a great think but Electricity can kill.

    I would suggest the safest option is to get in a person who knows what they are doing.

    In fairness I doubt he's the first to make that mistake it's easy done if you're not paying attention.

    Fair enough the mains pressure may not be sufficient to run the shower.

    I think there's been enough bashing of the errors made perhaps some folks could be a bit more helpful. The plumbing forum seems to be full of folks just waiting to pounce on an innocent question.

    OP if you're unsure of electrical connections PM me I'll talk you through it. I could guide you regarding connecting to mains supply also but as previous posters have pointed out pressure may be an issue.

    Would it be possible for you to repackage the shower and return it. Presumably not as you've connected the supply fittings.


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    #14
    anthonyos
    Registered Users Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭anthonyos


    there was a fella on a job a few weeks ago that was telling me his friend fitted his own shower he was a taxi man and it killed his young son which as a plumber worries me but diyers doing it electrics god knows how dangerous it could be


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    #15
    Mr.Fred
    Registered Users Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭Mr.Fred


    anthonyos wrote: »
    there was a fella on a job a few weeks ago that was telling me his friend fitted his own shower he was a taxi man and it killed his young son which as a plumber worries me but diyers doing it electrics god knows how dangerous it could be

    Any links to an article on this?

    All of the above is possible but more than likely Chinese whispers.

    It's safe to say though any electrical works should be carried out by a fully qualified and insured electrical contractor.

    The times that are in it though I understand folks wanting to carry out works in their own homes themselves.


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    #16
    Billy Bunting
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    Mr.Fred wrote: »
    I think there's been enough bashing of the errors made perhaps some folks could be a bit more helpful. The plumbing forum seems to be full of folks just waiting to pounce on an innocent question.


    When professional make a suggestion it's generally done so to be helpful, they also wouldn't be too keen on giving advice to a DIYer that could potentially kill them. Does anyone know what size cable this shower is being supplied with ? length of run ? Does the OP know ??
    No one is waiting to “pounce” as you put it, but if someone asks for advice then they clearly need to be competent to carry out the advice given, that may entail being asked a few questions, some may take offence to that because they feel they know what they are doing, but quite often they clearly do not.

    We are here to help and do. :mad:


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    #17
    anthonyos
    Registered Users Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭anthonyos


    no links but I don't think he made it up when looking for a link I found a story about a gaa player killed in a shower


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    #18
    Billy Bunting
    Registered Users Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Billy Bunting


    Mr.Fred wrote: »

    It's safe to say though any electrical works should be carried out by a fully qualified and insured electrical contractor.

    .

    But yet you would advise the OP by PM.

    Sorry to pounce like that. ;)


  • Options
    #19
    Mr.Fred
    Registered Users Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭Mr.Fred


    Billy Bunting wrote: »
    When professional make a suggestion it's generally done so to be helpful, they also wouldn't be too keen on giving advice to a DIYer that could potentially kill them. Does anyone know what size cable this shower is being supplied with ? length of run ? Does the OP know ??
    No one is waiting to “pounce” as you put it, but if someone asks for advice then they clearly need to be competent to carry out the advice given, that may entail being asked a few questions, some may take offence to that because they feel they know what they are doing, but quite often they clearly do not.

    We are here to help and do. :mad:

    ah bless a black font and an angry face.. must be serious.

    So in the same vein as your arguement who's to say you the professional aren't just somebody with a good internet connection and fond of browsing plumbing for dummies on youtube???

    Anyway I'm not interested in going down the usual route of professionals getting all uppity. I am also a professional as you put it. :eek:

    OP if you need a hand pm me and I'll talk you through.


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    #20
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    Just to give yous some info i left out of the OP. Right, i bought this shower of a friend who bought it 2 weeks ago in argos. He couldnt brinf it back because his kids destroied the box/instructions for fitting it so i assumed it was a tank fed one. The eletrics was done by an eletrician thou im well capable of wiring this myself. I work in construction and have done last 20 years and i know quite alot about plumbing, well apart from this shower lol.

    What ill do id just take a T of the mains just before it goes into the tank and connect this to the 1/2 inch pipe going into the shower. One thing ive never done thou is check the pressure. One thing i do know is that in the house, my toilets take longer than others to fill up even after i replaced the bottle in the cistern. Im guessing this has jack **** to do with the mains pressure because its coming from tge tank but thought id put it out there.


    How much is a pressure tester and how will i check. Is is it, turn the mains off and right under the sink in the kitchen cut the pipe and attach an isolating valve for attaching the pipe again but before this, stick the pressure tester on an turn the mains on to check pressure.


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    #21
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    Its not always possible to use a Mains Fed shower in every house.
    Pipe-work aside, you need to do a running mains water pressure test first. What this means is that you fit a pressure gauge to a point on the mains (I usually disconnect the feed to the attic tank and fit it there) and open the cold kitchen tap.
    While the tap is running, as this has the strongest draw, the pressure gauge must maintain a set pressure. If my memory is correct Mira specify 0.85 bar but I prefer a Minimum of 1.00 bar with the kitchen tap fully open.
    If the system does not pass this simple test I refuse to fit them.



    Sorry, didnt see this post. So your saying i connected the pressure tester to the main feed going into the tank in the attic then turn the water on and open the kitchen tap fully open then back into the attic to see how many bar i ts reading.


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    #22
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    yoloc wrote: »
    Sorry, didnt see this post. So your saying i connected the pressure tester to the main feed going into the tank in the attic then turn the water on and open the kitchen tap fully open then back into the attic to see how many bar i ts reading.

    Yes, you need a Pressure Gauge with adaptors to go onto the pipe that is connected to the ball cock in the attic tank.
    You then check the pressure reading with the kitchen tap opened fully.
    The installation instructions should say what pressure is required, as far as I can remember most of the Mira units are .85 - .90 of a bar. I prefer to be over the 1.00 bar or 20% above manufacturers requirements if requirement is above 1.00 bar to allow for mains pressure fluctuations.


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    #23
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    Yes, you need a Pressure Gauge with adaptors to go onto the pipe that is connected to the ball cock in the attic tank.
    You then check the pressure reading with the kitchen tap opened fully.
    The installation instructions should

    say what pressure is required, as far as I can remember most of the Mira units are .85 - .90 of a bar. I prefer to be over the 1.00 bar or 20% above manufacturers requirements if requirement is above 1.00 bar to allow for mains pressure fluctuations.

    how much are they to buy.

    Right, so i buy this, disconnect the ball cock pipe, attach it to this pressure gague when the waters turned off, open the kitch mains fed tap then turn the water on and go read the gague and it it reads anything over 1 bar then im good to go about connecting it to the maina fed pipe with a T compresion fitting then reduce it down so it fits the 1/2 inch pipe and itll work properly.


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    #24
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    Why the need to open the kitchen tap thou. Would that not read less pressure because its opened.


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    #25
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    A good pressure gauge and adaptors, depending on which size pipe you need to go onto, no more than 30 euro.

    What does it say in the installation instructions regarding pressure requirements?


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    #26
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    A good pressure gauge and adaptors, depending on which size pipe you need to go onto, no more than 30 euro.

    What does it say in the installation instructions regarding pressure requirements?



    Only have a few ripped pages of the instructions but can see it saying minimum dynamic pressure 70kpa(0.7 bar) max dy pressure 5 bar, max static pressure 10 bar min st pr 0.2 bar.

    I can also see it saying- this shower is not designed to be plumbed from the rear. For rear entry supply, add an elbow to the supply pipe and connect as a rising or falling supply. Doesnt this mean i have to put a 90 degree 1/2 Inch compression fitting and connect to shower instead of bringing the copper pipe in from behind. Evwn writing this i would say this is what ive to do but im wondering why did they make this inlet connection swivel back so as to take a pipe from the rear like it was in the last shower.


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    #27
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    yoloc wrote: »
    Why the need to open the kitchen tap thou. Would that not read less pressure because its opened.

    This is to ensure that there is sufficient pressure available for the unit to operate within its design parameters even if someone turns on a tap, a washing machine / dishwasher or flushes a toilet.
    The more pressure the better.


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    #28
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    Tapped into the 3/4 mains pipe with a 3/4 tee which has a 1/2 branching of it. Attached it to the pressure gauge with the kitchen water tap fully opened. Got someone to turn the mains back on so i could read the gauge. It was reading 0.8 bar but thats with a small leak in the pressure gague because i didnt tighten it enough. So going by the 0.8 reading with a small leak i think theres plenty pressure. Got her to turn the kitchen tap off and the gague shot upto 2.5 bar.

    Joined the main pipe into the shower pipe, disconnected the shower and let the water run through the pipe to clear any ****e that was in the pipe from me cutting into them. Connected it back up with a 1/2 elbow. Got the shower working but when on full heat and max setting, the pressure wasnt great TBH. Its sound when on low settings but not on fully. Suppose ill just have to do with it now unless theres anything i can do to get more pressure.


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    #29
    jimf
    Registered Users Posts: 3,949 ✭✭✭jimf


    surely you wont be using it at max heat / max setting I have a triton and its the same if set to max but jaysus I wouldn't be standing under it but yes there is a noticeable pressure diff when set to max


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    #30
    yoloc
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭yoloc


    jimf wrote: »
    surely you wont be using it at max heat / max setting I have a triton and its the same if set to max but jaysus I wouldn't be standing under it but yes there is a noticeable pressure diff when set to max


    Yes but my last shower had more pressure when at max. This one isnt that powerful even when set at medium. I would have thought that seeing as it was more expwnsive than the last one, and also coming from the mains, it would have more pressure.


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