Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread

danthefan wrote: »

That's not really the point. The point is our coach would rather pick a hobbled 36 year old in rubbish form than a massively talented youngster playing 10 in one of the form teams in Europe.

And how much gametime to do think this massively talented youngster would get against South Africa?

It would be interesting to see him playing against a team with Pienaar in it.

The Saffer numbers are falling like flies due to injury, they'll be far from full strength.

shuffol wrote: »

I wonder if Denis Buckley played for Munster and Kilcoyne for Connacht would Buckley be in the squad. Think the ignorance of Connacht youngsters sends out the wrong message.

I actually think you're dead right here, so many times we hear people talk about "Munster bias" when talking about DK, but I don't even think this is it. If Kilcoyne was playing for Connacht he almost certainly wouldn't be in the squad, and there probably wouldn't be many calls for his inclusion based on just 2 H Cup games. Yet there are few people questioning the inclusion of Kilcoyne in this squad (and I'm not saying I'm one of them, I think it's no harm to have him in the squad).

It's a bit like the problem they have in England with players for the England football squad only being selected from the big clubs.

Hagz wrote: »

Probably, but I think that would be down to Munster bias more than Connacht ignorance. I think Kilcoyne deserves it more than Buckley tbh, but only by a whisker.

tbf i did read somewhere that Buckley is only 100kg, which is probably a bit light for an international loosehead. Correct me if im wrong on this by the way.

cuttothechase wrote: »

I think this is hilarious, for the last couple of years we are crying about the lack of prop forwards in this country and how we are not blooding new guys in.

Kilcoyne makes his HC début this year, puts in two hard shifts against two front rows studded with internationals, up against Ducalcon against Racing and Scottish international Geoff Cross last weekend. Comes out the other side with more propping experience on his CV couple with an excellent loose game and people are complaining.

Anybody who knows anything about propping knows you only become good by propping at the highest level on a regular basis. Cian Healy got turned inside out once or twice down the south of France in his early days with Leinster and it made him a better prop, probably was the foundation for turning him into one of the best loose heads in the NH. Give young Kilcoyne his chance, that's what I say, the more young props brought onto the international system the better, regardless of what Provence they represent!

I'm not complaining about Kilcoyne being selected, but there's another young player playing at H Cup level and impressing but he's been ignored.

I don't think this is Munster bias at play as the decision was 50/50, but if Kilcoyne had been playing for Connacht and Buckley for Munster, who do you think would have been selected?

The "big" provinces are also generally watched by more people, and performances from players who play for the big 3 provinces tend to be more high profile than performances from Connacht players, even if they are both playing at the same level (H Cup). You mention who Kilcoyne was up against, but last week Buckley's opposite number was England international Joe Marler. Even though Kilcoyne is playing in a better team, Buckley is still up against a high level of opposition.

Again, I think Kilcoyne being selected was a fair decision, but there is a problem with Connacht players not necessarily being on a level playing field. 50/50 decisions tend to go against Connacht players more often than not.

tolosenc wrote: »

Really? Kilcoyne got annihilated by Ross a few weeks ago, and there are far more destructive scrummagers than Rossy in world rugby. Buckley's scrummaging is better, but then, are we willing to sacrifice scrummaging for open field work?

And that's assuming that Kilcoyne offers more in the loose than Buckley. I don't think he does.

The difference between the two is ultimately probably the extra time Kilcoyne has clocked in the Munster setup.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

That is actually an interesting point.

For example, Penney came to Munster with no prior relationship with ROG. He is without him for the start of the season and so plays Keatley who plays pretty well. ROG comes back and plays pretty poorly, and yet Penney still went with him for the H Cup game.

So it's not just Kidney who is persisting with him when fans are calling for him to be jettisoned.

Although I am not in favour of O'Garas inclusion, this is an excellent, well made point.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

And that's assuming that Kilcoyne offers more in the loose than Buckley. I don't think he does.

The difference between the two is ultimately probably the extra time Kilcoyne has clocked in the Munster setup.

Do Connacht have 2 other fit looseheads like Munster do so that they can train every day? This is Connacht's chance to win a few games while other teams are depleted.

ed7890 wrote: »

I wouldn't say he was annihilated by Ross. I remember he gave away 2 kickable penalties in the first half, but then sorted himself out in the second half. Or at least, got more solid in the second half.

Kilcoyne started off well against Ducalcon and then got anhilated later: He was also mullered by Ross so it is a weak point. I would happily take a stronger scrummaging over "good in the loose" props. They are just a liability and can be just targeted like England did to us last paddys day.

Deano7788 wrote: »

What has that got to do with why one should be picked over the other?

If Connacht don't have two other looseheads, how can they train? They also need two looseheads (1 to start and 1 to bench in their Rabo games during the AIs).

Contact have Brett Wilkinson and guys like Bealham, Reilly etc. Can Ah You play loosehead?

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

Kilcoyne deserves to be in the squad. Take off the tinfoil hats.

Do you think the Connacht players are on a level playing field when it comes to Ireland selection? Not so much on this selection which Kilcoyne probably edges it, but in general?