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New milestone in father's rights:

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  • 27-06-2012 9:31am
    #1
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭


    The department of Justice and Law reform has eventually drafted legislation to include fathers' names on the children's birth certificates when born outside wedlock.


«1

Comments

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    #2
    Woodward
    Registered Users Posts: 219 ✭✭Woodward


    This is a great start to the day!


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    #3
    Sauve
    Registered Users Posts: 22,646 ✭✭✭✭Sauve


    It's fantastic news alright, but I wonder how they would handle a case where the father is genuinely unknown?
    Maybe it's accounted for, I haven't read any of it yet.


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    #4
    Sonics2k
    Registered Users Posts: 8,237 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    Fathers names can already go on a childs birthcert if the child is born out of wedlock.


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    #5
    Sauve
    Registered Users Posts: 22,646 ✭✭✭✭Sauve


    Sonics2k wrote: »
    Fathers names can already go on a childs birthcert if the child is born out of wedlock.

    True but the new legislation makes it mandatory.


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    #6
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    Sonics2k wrote: »
    Fathers names can already go on a childs birthcert if the child is born out of wedlock.

    Yes, but the hussy woman could refuse up until this landmark ruling, now, if the father wants it, he can have in on the bc.


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  • Options
    #7
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    And what'll happen if the woman refuses?


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    #8
    A2LUE42
    Registered Users Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭A2LUE42


    Be interesting to see how this actually happens in practice.


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    #9
    Maguined
    Registered Users Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭Maguined


    Impossible to enforce if a woman really doesn't want the fathers name on the birth cert she can just say it was some nameless guy from Coppers.

    You simply cannot force this issue, its too impractical.


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    #10
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    Deleted User wrote: »
    And what'll happen if the woman refuses?

    If I had my choice she would be boiled to death in tallow (or failing that, any other long chain hydrocarbon), but I don't think the EU or UN or Amnesty Intl. or any other of those showers of clowns would be too happy about that :P


  • Options
    #11
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    Maguined wrote: »
    Impossible to enforce if a woman really doesn't want the fathers name on the birth cert she can just say it was some nameless guy from Coppers.

    You simply cannot force this issue, its too impractical.

    What if he demands a DNA test ??

    If a woman is able to demand maintenance through the courts, does this mean the father can demand guardianship?? Or can the woman only demand maintenance after guardianship has been established ? Is there a lawyer in the house?


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  • Options
    #12
    Sauve
    Registered Users Posts: 22,646 ✭✭✭✭Sauve


    There's also the issue of rape victims, sperm donations (where the mother has the child as a single parent), and many more...
    Let's just hope there are clearcut guidelines on all of this too.


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    #13
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,651 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Maguined wrote: »
    Impossible to enforce if a woman really doesn't want the fathers name on the birth cert she can just say it was some nameless guy from Coppers.

    You simply cannot force this issue, its too impractical.

    You have to force the issue, why should a mother have the right to refuse for a father to be on the birth cert of a child that is biologically his?


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    #14
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/new-law-will-force-single-mothers-to-name-father-on-birth-cert-3109989.html


  • Options
    #15
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    one4on wrote: »
    SINGLE mothers will be forced to name the fathers of their children on birth certificates under planned new legislation.

    Around 4,000 children do not have their father named on their birth cert every year. And it has been estimated that overall, one in five of all children born to unmarried parents do not have the name of their father registered on their birth certificates.

    The Law Reform Commission has found that the high numbers of unidentified fathers is because many single mothers wrongly believe that naming the father will affect their social welfare benefits.

    Others believe that it will give the father automatic legal access rights to the child -- which is also incorrect.

    Social Protection Minister Joan Burton plans to introduce legislation to make it compulsory for both parents to be named on a child's birth certificate.

    The change has been recommended in a report by the Law Reform Commission, which said the legislation would reinforce the right of a child to know their parents.

    Risk

    It warned that without this information, there was a risk of children who were related unknowingly striking up relationships with each other.

    The commission found that,"In most cases the mother of the child is aware of who the father of the child is."

    Ms Burton will have to decide on exemptions in her legislation for mothers who do not know the identity of the father or who fears for her safety if the father of the child had to be contacted.

    Under current legislation, unmarried mothers must get the written permission of the father of the child to put their name on the birth cert.

    Children who are born to married couples automatically have both parents' names put on their birth certs.

    According to the Central Statistics Office (CSO), the 4,166 children born in 2007 without their father's name on the birth certificate accounted for around 6pc of the 70,620 children born that year.

    In 2008 4,102 children did not have their father's name on their birth cert -- although 495 of these children had their father's name added later in the year.

    In Britain, legislation was introduced in 2009 which required mothers to name the father and threatened them with a £200 (€250) fine and seven days in prison for perjury if they gave a false answer. But so far, the law has not been enforced.

    - Michael Brennan Deputy Political Editor


    Not enough, perjury should be life imprisonment without parole


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    #16
    Hyperbullet
    Registered Users Posts: 2,084 ✭✭✭Hyperbullet


    one4on wrote: »
    Not enough, perjury should be life imprisonment without parole

    That's a bit harsh tbh.

    While I'm in favour of the fathers name being on the birth cert I can see this being a lot harder to enforce than people might think.


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    #17
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Also would love to see someone trying to get their name off a birth cert.

    The same arseholes who something like this is aimed at are the ones who will ignore it anyway.


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    #18
    A2LUE42
    Registered Users Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭A2LUE42


    one4on wrote: »
    Not enough, perjury should be life imprisonment without parole

    Are you not aware that mothers are immune to perjury prosecution in the Irish Family Law courts...or it seems that way anyway.


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    #19
    LostPassword
    Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭LostPassword


    one4on wrote: »
    Not enough, perjury should be life imprisonment without parole
    Do you realise that you do your cause a huge disservice when you make such rabid statements? Every time I read such crap it reinforces the impression that the father's rights movement is a front for embittered neanderthals.


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    #20
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    LostPassword wrote: »
    Do you realise that you do your cause a huge disservice when you make such rabid statements? Every time I read such crap it reinforces the impression that the father's rights movement is a front for embittered neanderthals.

    Are you a braindead woman?


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    #21
    one4on
    Site Banned Posts: 46 ✭one4on


    A2LUE42 wrote: »
    Are you not aware that mothers are immune to perjury prosecution in the Irish Family Law courts...or it seems that way anyway.

    is that actually true?


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    #22
    Piliger
    Registered Users Posts: 6,741 ✭✭✭Piliger


    one4on wrote: »
    Are you a braindead woman?

    I think you will find that brain dead people tend not to be found typing on their computer.

    But feel free to correct me, oh oracle'd one.


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    #23
    A2LUE42
    Registered Users Posts: 2,532 ✭✭✭A2LUE42


    one4on wrote: »
    is that actually true?

    Of course it is not true. But in reality, it may as well be.


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    #24
    Stark
    Registered Users Posts: 20,891 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    Perhaps they've finally invented the technology that reads the brainwaves of comatose patients and allows them to communicate exclusively through boards.ie.

    If that's the case, better make sure you have a DNR code.


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    #25
    LostPassword
    Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭LostPassword


    one4on wrote: »
    Are you a braindead woman?
    Not quite, as a woman my evil lobes are immortal, dontcha know.


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    #26
    LostPassword
    Registered Users Posts: 366 ✭✭LostPassword


    A2LUE42 wrote: »
    Of course it is not true. But in reality, it may as well be.
    It's true for everyone. Perjury is totally routine in all courts and is virtually never prosecuted.


  • Options
    #27
    Maguined
    Registered Users Posts: 8,247 ✭✭✭Maguined


    one4on wrote: »
    What if he demands a DNA test ??

    If a woman is able to demand maintenance through the courts, does this mean the father can demand guardianship?? Or can the woman only demand maintenance after guardianship has been established ? Is there a lawyer in the house?

    DNA test can only be performed with the consent of the mother.

    Or through a court order so the potential father would have to spend a sum of money to drag it through the courts and get a court order if the mother continued to deny the father, if the DNA test went his way then all he gets is his name on the birth cert which confers practically no rights at all as they changed the law recently so the mother as primary care giver still has total control even if the father is named a guardian.


  • Options
    #28
    VinLieger
    Registered Users Posts: 17,651 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Maguined wrote: »
    if the DNA test went his way then all he gets is his name on the birth cert which confers practically no rights at all as they changed the law recently so the mother as primary care giver still has total control even if the father is named a guardian.

    This needs to be changed, for some reason the irish courts seem to think an un married father has no rights to see his child. Why is it mothers always get the benefit of the doubt in these situations?


  • Options
    #29
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    one4on wrote: »
    Yes, but the hussy woman could refuse up until this landmark ruling, now, if the father wants it, he can have in on the bc.
    one4on wrote: »
    If I had my choice she would be boiled to death in tallow (or failing that, any other long chain hydrocarbon), but I don't think the EU or UN or Amnesty Intl. or any other of those showers of clowns would be too happy about that :P
    one4on wrote: »
    Are you a braindead woman?


    banned for blatant flaming and trolling. when your ban is up, don't return to this forum unless you are prepared to engage in a civil and constructive manner


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    #30
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    A2LUE42 wrote: »
    Are you not aware that mothers are immune to perjury prosecution in the Irish Family Law courts...or it seems that way anyway.

    please try and engage in a less histrionic and more constructive fashion. no further warnings.


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    #31
    py2006
    Registered Users Posts: 9,847 ✭✭✭py2006


    LostPassword wrote: »
    Every time I read such crap it reinforces the impression that the father's rights movement is a front for embittered neanderthals.

    Wow.

    As men we have to hear and listen to a lot of 'crap' from so called feminists. Thankfully they don't represent the through meaning of the movement. Some fathers have been treated extremely unfairly by our legal system and for that reason the fathers right movement is a necessity.


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