Irish gun dealers selling pistols

Wanderer222 · 12-07-2006 8:51pm

I am obviously wrong here judging from the replies, but I thought people were unable to get any kind of a handheld pistol licence in Ireland? except maybe for sports shooting or the like...

Sparks · 12-07-2006 8:55pm

No, pistols were always licencable in Ireland, but from '72 to '04 there was a policy in the department of justice and in the Gardai to not issue licences for them. That policy has now been rescinded.

Rovi · 12-07-2006 11:59pm

Sparks wrote:

True. I thought they used to make a browning .22 pistol though?

Yes, they still make the Browning Buckmark in .22LR (11 versions of it!), but that's marketed and sold under the 'Browning' banner. As far as I can see, there are no .22LR pistols sold under the 'FN' brand.

Here's the parent company, FN Herstal- http://www.fnherstal.com/html/Index.htm

Sparks · 13-07-2006 12:20am

Rovi wrote:

Yes, they still make the Browning Buckmark in .22LR (11 versions of it!), but that's marketed and sold under the 'Browning' banner. As far as I can see, there are no .22LR pistols sold under the 'FN' brand

Yeah, it was the buckmark I was thinking of. Oh well, there's one company so

Dvs · 13-07-2006 12:22am

whupass wrote:

for hand guns what is the highest cal.? i was looking at a walther p99 which is a 9mm. and you can get it for $571.99 on impactguns.com, they sell a lot of hand guns and rifles.

another question you are aloud extended clips right? the p99 comes with a 10 rd clip and you can get a 15. the ps90 (civilian semi-auto version of the p-90) comes with a 30 round clip and you can get a 50.

I have to ask whupass,
how old are you ?
I have read some of your other posts on the shooting forum,
and you seem to be a young person.
your question regarding reloading was a classic!

Your apparent searching the internet and finding what you consider gems of information and posting them here is not helpful or contributing anything to the forum, perhaps it might be better if you continue to read the forum but not post until you have something to post from your own experience in shooting sports.

Do you have any experience with firearms whatsoever?

If not and you would like to, why not join a club near you,
and gain some, then perhaps after you are a little experienced you might consider becoming involved in shooting handguns.

Your above comments about 30 and 50 round magazines,
might be viewed by somebody reading this forum,
as the comments of an experienced shooter, and frankly is not the image,
that I for one would like to be seen in.

I have tried very hard not to come across as an old git in this post,
but if I have failed it's only because I am one

Dvs.

Sparks · 13-07-2006 12:24am

Oh come on Dvs, we were all juniors once. Besides, some of our older hands aren't anywhere nearer the image we'd like to see either. Better that whupass be here and learn something than not if you ask me.

Dvs · 13-07-2006 12:37am

Sparks wrote:

Oh come on Dvs, we were all juniors once. Besides, some of our older hands aren't anywhere nearer the image we'd like to see either. Better that whupass be here and learn something than not if you ask me.

Sparks,
I have no problems with whupass being here as you put it,
I lurk on a few forums that I like to read and hopefully learn something...

But I don't post just for the sake of it,
and try to come across as knowing something about the subject,
while it is obvious to anyone that does know something about the topic,
that I am spoofing and posting stuff I have Googled for the sake of it.

Dvs.

Sparks · 13-07-2006 12:47am

DvS wrote:

But I don't post just for the sake of it,
and try to come across as knowing something about the subject,
while it is obvious to anyone that does know something about the topic,
that I am spoofing and posting stuff I have Googled for the sake of it.

Indeed. We call that experience (or wisdom or maturity if we're feeling generous). Thing is, most youngsters learn it by doing it and being shown up. Doesn't mean you have to grind them down for it. We've precious enough new people coming into the sport as it is - our average age is in the mid-forties...

jaycee · 13-07-2006 1:14am

Just an interesting point..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rovi
Hmmm...
I wonder where the CZ KADET Adaptor fits into all this?
http://www.czub.cz/index.php?p=32&id...idz=19&lang=en
It's a .22LR adaptor specifically designed for their 75/85 range of pistols.

Not affected Rovi: article(5) says "it is an offence to modify a firearm so as to ... increase its calibre". So if you put in the Kadet adaptor, you decrease the calibre; and if you take it out, you have the firearm you're licenced for in the first place. (Taking out the adapter doesn't mean that the adapter itself increases the calibre, in other words, so you couldn't have a situation where putting it in was legal, but taking it out wasn't).

The Kadet adaptor carries its own serial number and therefore requires a seperate licence . The kit contains a .22 slide (inc sights) barrel and recoil spring and comes with a .22 magazine.
The price of the adaptor kit , along with the licence issue means there is surprisingly little difference between buying the kit , and buying a full .22 Kadet pistol .

Sad ..but true.

whupass · 13-07-2006 1:25am

Thank you Sparks, but I do understand where you are coming from Dvs. You would be right in assuming that I am young (15 and have never said otherwise ask anyone who asked before you) but as I said earlier i will be old enough to buy a gun in 2 months and wholly wish I were able to but live in the city and my parents (well I am 15) are opposed. As I grow older and buy my own home I intend to buy a gun. The reason I ask these questions is so I can gain insight to what gun to buy.

You asked if I had any experience? Well EVERY man in my family has been in the reserves and I intend to follow as soon as I can, you may be saying to yourself "That's not experience" well no that doesn't count BUT two of my uncles own guns of there own. One uncle in particular, Don, has a .22LR magnum and a .223. Every time I meet Don he alows me too shoot one of his guns on his farm or at the range. (You might not count it but I just thought I would throw this in. I can get Time Crisis II finished with one try (shows my age too)) I have a paintball marker and hope to get involved with Airsoft as soon as it takes off in Ireland.

To sum up, yes I am a child and I have little experience.

1 question for you Dvs. When you said
"Your above comments about 30 and 50 round magazines,
might be viewed by somebody reading this forum,
as the comments of an experienced shooter, and frankly is not the image,
that I for one would like to be seen in." did you not notice that my post was CLEARLY a question? ALL my posts are questions.

And lastly I don't Google "stuff" to put on the forum, all my posts are questions so that, given time to gain EXPERIENCE, I will be able to answer the questions of other people who don't happen to know that the word "reload" has two meanings.

Vegeta · 13-07-2006 9:43am

whupass please continue to ask questions. The best thing you can do is ask questoins. I hate when people look down on others for this. How else can you learn. Ask and I will try and answer.

I am only 23 and have been shooting since i was 17 (applied when i was 16 but refused due to being too young!!!!) I have been out with my dad and brother since i was 12 or 13. I have a shotgun, an air rifle and a .223 rifle.

I will just say be careful what websites you use to get your info as it could be an american site who more than likely cannot sell you ammo or guns. The majority of people here will have bought most of their guns in ireland. A few will have purchased them from abroad but there is a lot of paper work involved.

In ireland 9mm ammo is very expensive when compared to .22lr ammo. If the handgun is being used for target shooting only ( I cant really think of another reason you may want one) then a .22lr would be great to learn with. Its cheaper and you'll learn the fundamentals of maksmanship.

Very large magazines are not needed for target shooting, maybe for the practical style competitions. Why pay for a longer extended magazine if you don't need it. You could spend the money on ammo, glasses, ear muffs a safe or an alarm for your house. To be honest at 16 the super at your local garda station will be very hard to convince. I was turned down at 16 for a shotgun so can you imagine what'd they'd say if I wanted a handgun :eek:

There's no doubt age is on your side if you want to start training for serious competition. In which case start investigating clubs which are near your home and will let you join. They will probably run safety course which will help you when you do eventually apply.

Don't be fooled though its an expensive sport.

Sparks · 13-07-2006 11:05am

There's no doubt age is on your side if you want to start training for serious competition.

Believe it or not, he's getting on a bit for serious competition.
No, I'm not joking. Abroad, most of the ISSF juniors are training by the time they're ten or twelve, and have been shooting for a while before that.

Vegeta · 13-07-2006 11:10am

Sparks wrote:

Believe it or not, he's getting on a bit for serious competition.
No, I'm not joking. Abroad, most of the ISSF juniors are training by the time they're ten or twelve, and have been shooting for a while before that.

I meant in terms of the Irish scene though

or maybe not

sidneyreilly · 13-07-2006 11:56am

Hi Whupass. It is very advisable to start with a .22 pistol, in fact some ranges (and quite rightly) do not allow you use a full bore until you have shot some .22 pistol under supervision of the R.O. or an experienced member and achieved reasonable accuracy.
Full bore pistols (particularly semi-autos) can be very jarring to shoot and I've seen a couple of people instantly develop a flinch because they haven’t worked up to it.
A large number of current pistol shooters will have both a full bore and small bore pistol in order to enter both competitions (usually held at the same time).

You would be best advised to try shooting .22, find which type (i.e. semi or revolver) or make/model will suit you best then do the same with a full-bore.

Have you ever shot a pistol?

Sparks · 13-07-2006 12:03pm

It is very advisable to start with a .22 pistol

Heck, it's even more advisable to start with an air pistol. Cheaper, both to buy and run; less needed in terms of a range; a decent one will cost about €250 to €350 depending on where you buy and what deal you get, and will last you for decades and be good enough to get you from neophyte to world cup entrant; and most gardai won't be as freaked out about the idea of giving a 16-year-old a licence for an air pistol. Plus, the basic skills are unaltered from air to .22 to fullbore, assuming you're shooting ISSF-style instead of with a two-handed grip.

sidneyreilly · 13-07-2006 12:16pm

Sparks wrote:

and most gardai won't be as freaked out about the idea of giving a 16-year-old a licence for an air pistol.

This would be universaly true sparks. Altough I was speaking from personal shooting habits, none of our guys shoot air pistols, (also it's the same licence).

Perhaps getting one of the new training certificates would be the best way forward (whenever that comes out)

Sparks · 13-07-2006 12:34pm

Perhaps getting one of the new training certificates would be the best way forward (whenever that comes out)

Indeed, but thats a few weeks or months away. If they're not around by the time he goes looking for a licence, well, best to start with something that doesn't have a lethal range of up to a mile, right?
(And yes, I'm assuming that whupass will be joining his local club. That's rather a given).

13-07-2006 1:17pm

Whupass - I would go with the advice of an Air Pistol

You will learn a lot more form that then any other pistol. I recently started pistol in the US and have trained on .22s and Air pistols and without a doubt the Air Pistol is most educational. Plus they are less hassle to get then a .22 pistol.

Rovi · 13-07-2006 1:31pm

Vegeta wrote:

If the handgun is being used for target shooting only ( I cant really think of another reason you may want one)...

Apart from a (rumoured) very few allegedly licenced for humane dispatch (to vets and huntsmen), target shooting is currently the only reason for which handgun licences are being issued.

The 'humane dispatch' thing may gain some traction in the future for deer hunters, but I think we can expect the issuing of handgun licences to continue in a very conservative manner. Short of licences for destructive devices and full-auto firearms, I would expect them to remain as the most difficult licence to obtain.

sidneyreilly · 13-07-2006 2:32pm

Rovi wrote:

Apart from a (rumoured) very few allegedly licenced for humane dispatch (to vets and huntsmen), target shooting is currently the only reason for which handgun licences are being issued..

Nothing alleged about it Rovi, the odd thing is that you still have to pay a license fee when a humane killer is supposed to be on a free authorization

Rovi wrote:

The 'humane dispatch' thing may gain some traction in the future for deer hunters, but I think we can expect the issuing of handgun licences to continue in a very conservative manner. Short of licences for destructive devices and full-auto firearms, I would expect them to remain as the most difficult licence to obtain.

Agreed, certainly for full bore, although I suspect .22lr (perhaps with a minimum barrel restriction) and air pistols will be left as normal. Full bore users will have to prove themselves highly qualified to get or retain their licences. (so get competing now and get your names on score sheets!):eek:

whupass · 13-07-2006 2:58pm

sidneyreilly wrote:

You would be best advised to try shooting .22, find which type (i.e. semi or revolver) or make/model will suit you best then do the same with a full-bore.

Have you ever shot a pistol?

I know they aren't real guns BUT maybe an airsoft to learn some of the fundamentals THEN move to something that could kill?

I haven't shot a pistol but when Don buys one he's promised me a shot (or 20).

Mostly right now I think the only type of gun I'll be getting is an airsoft gun for a few reasons.
1. I won't have to worry as much about security.
2. My parents aren't mad about a gun in the house at ALL so even an airsoft gun is a stretch.
3. It would be MUCH easier to get than a real gun OR air gun.

Thanks for the advice.

Vegeta · 13-07-2006 3:02pm

Rovi wrote:

Apart from a (rumoured) very few allegedly licenced for humane dispatch (to vets and huntsmen), target shooting is currently the only reason for which handgun licences are being issued.

The 'humane dispatch' thing may gain some traction in the future for deer hunters, but I think we can expect the issuing of handgun licences to continue in a very conservative manner. Short of licences for destructive devices and full-auto firearms, I would expect them to remain as the most difficult licence to obtain.

the guy doesn't have anything to dispatch, surely you shoot a deer or other big animal and use the pistol to dispatch him. If you go for a pistol straight off the bat with no other licensed fire arms then it must be for targets. Am i wrong here, just my opinion and open to correction

Vegeta · 13-07-2006 3:03pm

whupass wrote:

I know they aren't real guns BUT maybe an airsoft to learn some of the fundamentals THEN move to something that could kill?
.

Kill what? A piece of paper with a mans outline

whupass · 13-07-2006 3:09pm

Well... If you drop a real gun it could go off and hurt someone, right? Well it would be better to get comfortable with an Airsoft gun, buy one the right weight shape everything and practice with that and pretend it is real. That way by the time I buy a gun I'm trained in the does and don'ts.

In Ireland are short barrel rifles legal?

Sparks · 13-07-2006 3:11pm

whupass wrote:

I know they aren't real guns BUT maybe an airsoft to learn some of the fundamentals

I don't know about airsoft. Not designed for target shooting really, at least beyond the paintball level. Get a decent air pistol instead.

THEN move to something that could kill?

Er, I wouldn't be thinking in terms of stuff that can kill being better...

Mostly right now I think the only type of gun I'll be getting is an airsoft gun for a few reasons.
1. I won't have to worry as much about security.
2. My parents aren't mad about a gun in the house at ALL so even an airsoft gun is a stretch.
3. It would be MUCH easier to get than a real gun OR air gun.
Thanks for the advice.

Thing is, most airsoft guns are designed to look like "real" guns. Not so much designed for accuracy. If the gun can't outshoot you, you're going to wind up a bit fustrated fairly shortly because you won't know if that last 7 was because you messed up or because those "£!%!"@!! sights aren't worth diddly....

Sparks · 13-07-2006 3:17pm

whupass wrote:

Well... If you drop a real gun it could go off and hurt someone, right?

Er. In theory. Possibly. Definitely wouldn't want to do it.
But, it's not like they're made of nitroglycerin. Frankly, you'd be far more likely to get hurt or hurt someone by an accidental discharge. Hence the need for safety and training.

Well it would be better to get comfortable with an Airsoft gun, buy one the right weight shape everything and practice with that and pretend it is real. That way by the time I buy a gun I'm trained in the does and don'ts.

Yes and no. Yes, in that you could get familiar with the size and shape and pointability. No, in that it's not going to have any real recoil, there won't be any loud report, and so on. Start with a proper air pistol. Move from there to .22 and then fullbore if you want.

In Ireland are short barrel rifles legal?

Yes.

Vegeta · 13-07-2006 3:17pm

whupass wrote:

Well... If you drop a real gun it could go off and hurt someone, right? Well it would be better to get comfortable with an Airsoft gun, buy one the right weight shape everything and practice with that and pretend it is real. That way by the time I buy a gun I'm trained in the does and don'ts.

In Ireland are short barrel rifles legal?

oh now i get ya, yup you have the right attitude just the way you said it freaked me out a bit.

Don't confuse air soft weapons with air rifles and pistols. Air soft generally shoot out round projectiles. Air rifles and pistols fire champagne cork shaped ammo.

Don't know bout short rifle barrel

Rovi · 13-07-2006 3:23pm

Sparks wrote:

Thing is, most airsoft guns are designed to look like "real" guns.

I think that could be a major thing in their favour, from the point of view of the conventional firearms sports.
A 'non-lethal' replica of the real thing would be very useful for getting someone familiar with a particular gun, or even with guns in general.
Stuff like safe handling, range etiquette, familiarisation with controls, experimentation with grip, etc, could all be done without the user being a danger to themselves or others.

13-07-2006 3:42pm

One potential problem:

Person gets used to handling a replica, and then when he/she handles real weapon, they do not treat it with repect as, up until now, they associate that 'gun' with being perfectly harmless no matter what you do with it..

whupass · 13-07-2006 3:59pm

Okok train someone with an airsoft gun so they can get grip soforth right but don't tell them it is fake. Then when they are ready to shoot give them a real one. That way the respect is kept all the way through.

What I meant when I said "something that can kill" I meant something dangerous and didn't mean it in a GOOD way, I meant that as a newby I should start with something safer so I can start to understand the sport in a safe environment.

Shooting Forum - Firearms licencing information

Irish gun dealers selling pistols

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