A Knowledge Economy

[Deleted User] · 26-09-2008 10:58am #1

What is a knowledge economy?
Where can I see working examples of this?

What are the mechanics of putting this into place, at what cost and at what benefit. What kind of things will we be producing to generate income?

Is it possible to create a knowledge economy as the base of an economy?
Are there any strategies for this online that I can read up on?

experiMental · 28-09-2008 2:44pm

my reply from a similar thread -

I see very few incentives that encourage people to produce something for knowledge economy, especially for graduates.

There's too much pressure to pay the bills to survive, and most of the creative jobs that contribute to knowledge capital are not paying enough for one person to survive in main cities like Dublin and Cork.

You'll need a large team of people to create a project, and stay in contact with them almost 24/7. The only places where you get a large multidisciplinary team together are in these main cities.

If the team is scattered around the country in very inaccessible places without proper broadband access, you're going to get into major communications barriers.

Some investors are expecting entrepeneurs to be able to run their business and come up with innovative ideas at the same time, which is unreasonable.

So if everybody will start thinking more realistically and rents and property prices will go down significantly, and incomes will go up, there would be a chance of knowledge economy taking off.

leninbenjamin · 28-09-2008 3:15pm

simply put; it's a load of guff.

According to this knowledge economy 'plan' we supposedly want to develop our graduates and research facilities in our universities yet Irish universities have been instructed to cut their salary bills by 3%. And this is at a time when they are already struggling to keep a hold of our own talent, let alone attract the highly skilled foreigners we need to develop this sector.

anyway our problems with developing a real knowledge economy originate at second level. the Leaving Cert system needs to be completely overhauled, especially in relation to maths and the sciences. I really believe we need to be looking at the standard of our maths teachers, far too many teaching maths who only took it as a supplementary subject in Uni and stuggled to pass themselves. the entire secondary system needs to be really looked at.

damnyanks · 28-09-2008 5:38pm

The problem is politicians are not economists and economists are not politicians.

Saying your plan involves building a knowledge economy probably helps you get elected. When it comes to cost cutting the universities probably hold a very small sway hence they get bitch slapped.

Hanley · 28-09-2008 9:22pm

How can we be a knowledge economy when a large proportion of our citizens still struggle to read and write??

How can we be a knowledge economy when the uptake of PhD's and the likes are amongst the lowest in Europe??

How can we be a knowledge economy when the government plans to reintroduce college fees without giving us any explanation as to how students will be able to pay them, or what agreements will be put in place with the banks to facilitate it???

Simply put, we're not. It's an economic buzz word that means sweet FA.

damnyanks · 28-09-2008 9:50pm

well while I'd agree with you on the above (but have no idea about the stats) we do have a lot of pharma and tech r&d centers here.

We did invent viagra here. in 20 years I will be proud to be Irish

SoCal90046 · 28-09-2008 11:33pm

damnyanks wrote: »

well while I'd agree with you on the above (but have no idea about the stats) we do have a lot of pharma and tech r&d centers here.

We did invent viagra here. in 20 years I will be proud to be Irish

The active ingredient in the drug sold as Viagra in many markets was actually discovered by scientists working at Pfizer UK in Sandwich.

PeakOutput · 28-09-2008 11:35pm

we have HAD a knowledge economy up until a few years ago

it means to me basically that after the tax cuts companies were coming here for cheap well educated labour and thats what they were getting

now that we have had the celtic tiger those same employees arent so cheap anymore as they expect more for their 'abilities' so companies move to other emerging companies like india / china or anywhere that people are getting well enough edcuated but still have relatively low salary expectations

and if those countries have learned from our tax benefits for industry(which they have mccain even mentioned ireland when he was talking about tax in the debate the other night) all the better for them and worse for us

edit; we still do have alot of knowledge based industry from what i can tell though(im no expert) googles european head office is in dublin and im sure there are more i cant think of right now, they wouldnt be here if it wasnt for our graduates

Hanley · 29-09-2008 12:03am

Yeah but how many of the kids who start off in primary school finish out with a college degree? Unless it's a significantly large proportion, I don't think we should kid ourselves into thinking we have a knowledge economy.

We had a discussion about this in college last semseter and out lecturer threw out some interesting stats about adult literacy and graduate levels in Ireland, and it made for pretty grim reading from what I remember.

We can talk all we want about a knowledge economy, but just because we have R&D labs and lots of FDI cherry picking our best and brightest, it doesn't mean much at the end of the day.

Our comparative advantages were the fact we speak english, our corp. tax rate was incredibly low and we had a relatively well educated and not too expensive workforce. All of those are being seriously erroded now.

Btw, anyone see the US Presidential Debate?? McCain referenced us and said how out low corp tax rate was a great asset. Our 11% (sic) corporation tax rate. I lol'd.

Mikel · 29-09-2008 7:06pm

blindjustice wrote: »

What is a knowledge economy?

An empty meaningless phrase that a politician can spout to sound intelligent, but with no substance.
See also the 1990s for use of the phrase 'high value added industry' in connection with Intel, Dell and co.
Like others have said, if it was what you really wanted you'd stop educating children in antiquated prefabs for a start.

Burial · 30-09-2008 11:33am

If people don't think we have a knowledge economy, then what do we have so? I know we don't have one, but I'm wondering where we are? I personally believe education fees is economic suicide in the long-run. I believe the Governement should start encouraging student to focus on their studies and reward them judged by grades. Like the government pays €20 grand to the college for the students rent and your fees paid for. And the governement will subsidise based on the amount of classes you goto. And at the end of the semester the exams would determine how much of the inital cost you would have to pay back to the government. Like a 4.0 = 0% pay-back. (Maybe even weighting on engineering degrees and on other courses that would eventually benefit the economy)

Anyway it's of my understanding that the government wants students to take out an interest free loan for a few years thats based on their future incomes after their degree.

It's true the government needs to improve the educational system but why start at primary schools? Students would only be as good as the teachers who teach them, but I agree. They squandered the money they got from the boom, and refused to invest it wisely in the educational sector. Prefabs or school rooms doesn't matter. They provide the same job. It's the fact they have to buy their own books and equipment. Schools should have these books and equipment on hand.

*EDIT*

Yes, the Leaving Cert needs to be changed to suit peoples interests. They should be developing what they want to do in life at this stage. Like in todays culture most people decide on deadline day. Others take a few years out. (Which is grand, but people who want to be a carpenter shouldn't have to do English. And those unsure would take a year out anyway. It is 4th year....) Also, the college system needs to be looked at. I think they should lectures on all the time. Like anyone can sign upto any class. (Like 1st year mech student doing 2nd year Mech maths if they wish to get that exam out of the way asap.) Thats just my thoughts...

leninbenjamin · 30-09-2008 1:31pm

Burial wrote: »

If people don't think we have a knowledge economy, then what do we have so? I know we don't have one, but I'm wondering where we are? I personally believe education fees is economic suicide in the long-run. I believe the Governement should start encouraging student to focus on their studies and reward them judged by grades. Like the government pays €20 grand to the college for the students rent and your fees paid for. And the governement will subsidise based on the amount of classes you goto. And at the end of the semester the exams would determine how much of the inital cost you would have to pay back to the government. Like a 4.0 = 0% pay-back. (Maybe even weighting on engineering degrees and on other courses that would eventually benefit the economy)

that's a ridiculous idea really. there's no way that could be forced equitably, universities would simply lower standards once again to get as much money out of the govt. as possible.

and as for the free fees, they were introduced to do one thing; increase participation rates. Any study I've seen on them suggests they did little to do so. From what i've read the bulk of the participation increases can be attributed to the increased incomes across the board.

Burial wrote: »

Anyway it's of my understanding that the government wants students to take out an interest free loan for a few years that's based on their future incomes after their degree.

I think this is somewhat on the right track, along with a complete reform of the grants system to make them more inclusive. Universities need the fees back because the FF these days are a bunch of cheapskates when it comes to education. If we are to encourage a 'knowledge economy' (i.e. high levels of R&D, research and an entrepreneurial base to capitalize on them) then we seriously need more investment in the Universities. we can't rely on the government any more to give us the quality of the education we need. and if the students can provide the extra revenue the Uni's need, then at least it will free up govt. resources to invest in the lower levels of our education (which some argue is more important than investment in the Uni's, and I'm inclined to agree).

Hanley · 30-09-2008 4:19pm

Here's a few things to think about...

Presumably, if fees are reintroduced it's to improve the education service, so there damn well better be value for money. But how do we measure it?? How does one quantify the quality of education one recieves in college?? And can you actually attribute a value to the soft skills that one may pick up too as well as the purely technical??

Presumably the fee structure will be based on parental income?? What if the student doesn't live with, or is on bad terms with their 'rents?? Do you reckon people would be willing to "orphan" themselves and become legally seperate from their parents if they were in a position to save what could be anything from 20-50k over the course of their college lives??

noodler · 30-09-2008 4:32pm

Theres been an improvement-just maybe not value for money.

damnyanks · 01-10-2008 10:16pm

What is the biggest industry in Ireland ? My view is really skewed towards finance and technology sectors. Construction is an obvious one.

Are we just a hub for the back office functions or large organisations who hire our graduates. The service industry required for these companies (Consultants , lawyers) then set up?

damnyanks · 01-10-2008 10:17pm

What is the biggest industry in Ireland ? My view is really skewed towards finance and technology sectors. Construction is an obvious one.

Are we just a hub for the back office functions or large organisations who hire our graduates. The service industry required for these companies (Consultants , lawyers) then set up?

A Knowledge Economy

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