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Leinster's worst SH import

24

Comments

  • #32
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Ed O'Donoghue is on the list because he was awful for Leinster and disappeared after a promising spell at Ulster had us believing he was going to have a good future with us.

    Steven Keogh was a great signing for Leinster on the other hand, held our back row together in the ML after SOB broke his leg. Hogan not so much as he had to retire through injury.

    Is he a SH import though?
    I was correctly pulled up on this so it's only fair to question if a lad who arrived from Ulster and who had already played for Ireland should be classed the same as a Vermaas.


  • #33
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    gaius c wrote: »
    Is he a SH import though?
    I was correctly pulled up on this so it's only fair to question if a lad who arrived from Ulster and who had already played for Ireland should be classed the same as a Vermaas.

    Well he's from the SH, whether he's a SH import is a good question because he didn't come directly from a SH team. But I suppose this counts for anyone from the SH, not just people who came directly from a SH team.


  • #34
    BBDBB
    Registered Users Posts: 26,899 ✭✭✭✭BBDBB


    based on his first season with Leinster Id have said Isa Nacewa
    he was appalling, I know he got shifted about from 10 to 15 and amongst the backs but his handling and kicking was error strewn, I wondered what the heck Leinster had ever seen in him


    His last couple of seasons with them he was a safe pair of hands, committed in the tackle and his positional kicking was excellent, wonderful to watch. cap doffed to him


  • #35
    Swan Curry
    Registered Users Posts: 1,805 ✭✭✭Swan Curry


    BBDBB wrote: »
    based on his first season with Leinster Id have said Isa Nacewa
    he was appalling, I know he got shifted about from 10 to 15 and amongst the backs but his handling and kicking was error strewn, I wondered what the heck Leinster had ever seen in him


    His last couple of seasons with them he was a safe pair of hands, committed in the tackle and his positional kicking was excellent, wonderful to watch. cap doffed to him

    I see where you're coming from,but still,

    NO.


  • #36
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    BBDBB wrote: »
    based on his first season with Leinster Id have said Isa Nacewa
    he was appalling, I know he got shifted about from 10 to 15 and amongst the backs but his handling and kicking was error strewn, I wondered what the heck Leinster had ever seen in him


    His last couple of seasons with them he was a safe pair of hands, committed in the tackle and his positional kicking was excellent, wonderful to watch. cap doffed to him

    In in that first season at 10, he was electric with the ball in hand, just rubbish at kicking and game-management, a definite step up from the likes of Eddie & Christian Warner.


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  • #37
    BBDBB
    Registered Users Posts: 26,899 ✭✭✭✭BBDBB


    electric as in he looked shocked every time a pass managed to find the man and he didn't knock on ;).


  • #38
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    This thread has gone down a horrible path.

    It went from players who were genuine flops to ridiculous criticism of anyone who didn't turn out to be an absolute legend. Trevor Hogan and Stephen Keogh were excellent players.

    Now we're talking about Isa Nacewa.

    For fnck's sake.


  • #39
    BBDBB
    Registered Users Posts: 26,899 ✭✭✭✭BBDBB


    Perhaps the distinction wasn't clear, but I did specify the difference between Nacewas first season where I thought he was a liability when he took the field and where he ended up in his final few seasons where he was excellent and frequently amongst the very best


  • #40
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    BBDBB wrote: »
    electric as in he looked shocked every time a pass managed to find the man and he didn't knock on ;).

    I appreciate that you're trying to back up your point as made but the end effect is that you're backing up an alley and a blind one at that.


  • #41
    BBDBB
    Registered Users Posts: 26,899 ✭✭✭✭BBDBB


    gaius c wrote: »
    I appreciate that you're trying to back up your point as made but the end effect is that you're backing up an alley and a blind one at that.

    I don't believe so, but you are entitled to your opinion :)


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  • #42
    Dietsquirt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 676 ✭✭✭Dietsquirt


    Barzipan wrote: »
    Is it unfair to add Lote Tuqiri to the following list?

    Owen Finnegan
    Eddie Hekenui
    CJ van der Linde
    Harry Vermaas


    I have to be honest, i have no idea who they are/were :o


  • #43
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Vermas and Hekenui were both crappy imports, prop and an out-half. Along with Newland, can't be too harsh on them, I mean, what did we expect? They were punts rather than big name signings. Even Galarza, he was an Argentinian international, but still I don't remember being super excited about him signing rather than hopeful he would be good.

    Finnegan on the other hand was a world cup winning lock, who also scored a try for Australia in the world cup final in 1999, who then signed for Leinster and was absolute gash.

    Given the hype of the signing, by far the biggest let down. CJ Van Der Linde, another world cup winner, was a massive let down too, but I don't think he was terrible when he played, he was just always injured.

    Tiquri would be harsh. A let down perhaps, but I don't think anyone was expecting him to be a superstar either. Definitely hoped for better, but oh well.


  • #44
    Fireball07
    Registered Users Posts: 13,264 ✭✭✭✭Fireball07


    Owen Finnegan is a big big name in rugby really, he won a WC, there was a lot of hype when he came to Ireland. Huge disappointment.


    I remember a few of my Leinster-based cousins telling me how good Hekenui was going to be... he did play in the HC a couple of times iirc. I don't think he was thaaat bad compared to some of the others.


    The likes of Galarza and Sykes, I expected to be better.


  • #45
    hahashake
    Registered Users Posts: 827 ✭✭✭hahashake


    Michael Bent.


  • #46
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,136 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    To be honest I remember Eddie Hekinui but I was of the age that I couldn't figure out if he was a good or bad player. I do remember the stick he used to get though, Franno wasn't a fan anyway.

    Finnegan would be the worst import for me as, as mentioned above, he came with a good reputation and we expected results.

    Clint Newland in all fairness was never brought into be a major addition to he squad. HE came in and did his job and then left so for me he was a good pro.

    I have to say in all fairness that we have had some poor SH imports but we've had more good ones too.

    Also did Ed O'Donoghue play for UL Bohs at one stage?


  • #47
    WeeBushy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,572 ✭✭✭WeeBushy


    hahashake wrote: »
    Michael Bent.

    No way. He came to us after playing a level below the Rabo, had no preseason and was parachuted straight into the Irish team, where he showed up pretty well. This created an unfair amount of expectation on a player who wasn't up to speed. He's a solid squad player, which is what he was signed for in the first place. I'm perfectly content with Bent so far.

    And whoever mentioned Keogh is so far off the mark. He was a magnificent squad player to have. He fulfilled the roll that Auva'a played last year, filled in when internationals were away, and covered injuries, and was a steady pair of hands. I was sad to see him go as I thought he was an important squad player at the time.

    We need those kind of guys. If they aren't from Ireland and aren't shining week in week out people see them as flops, when in fact they are doing exactly what they were brought in to do.


  • #48
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,136 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    I think with Keogh when he joined us he was expected to be more than just a squad player and to actually push on for Leinster first team and further honours.


  • #49
    Swiwi.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,415 ✭✭✭Swiwi.


    hahashake wrote: »
    Michael Bent.

    Ah come on. The guy was a bit-part SXV player, and played ITM for Taranaki. He was promoted (not his fault) to Ireland way too prematurely, but is slowly beginning to find his feet again. He'll be a solid squad option for Leinster, which is exactly what you could expect given the level he had achieved in NZ.


  • #50
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    CatFromHue wrote: »
    I think with Keogh when he joined us he was expected to be more than just a squad player and to actually push on for Leinster first team and further honours.

    Regardless, he was neither an SH import nor was he a bad signing so he has no business being discussed in this thread.

    Just looking at Keogh's record, he was actually almost ever-present in his first season (06-07), starting all our HC games that season as well as 16 league matches, slightly fewer the next season and then it all fell apart when Elsom and O'Brien arrived on the scene...


  • #51
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,175 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    BBDBB wrote: »
    Perhaps the distinction wasn't clear, but I did specify the difference between Nacewas first season where I thought he was a liability when he took the field and where he ended up in his final few seasons where he was excellent and frequently amongst the very best

    Nacewa was excellent after he came back from his broken arm in his first season. He was an ever present in the back three in the last few months and deservedly so. His performance in the HEC semi was excellent.


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  • #52
    emmet02
    Registered Users Posts: 24,816 ✭✭✭✭emmet02


    Stephen Keogh??? What?

    The guy was an absolute rock for us!


  • #53
    .ak
    Registered Users Posts: 30,308 Mod ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Buer wrote: »
    Nacewa was excellent after he came back from his broken arm in his first season. He was an ever present in the back three in the last few months and deservedly so. His performance in the HEC semi was excellent.

    Was 2009 his first season?

    If so I can't see how anyone could say he was a poor singing in the first year. He was a revelation towards the end of the season, and the only times he looked bad was when he had broken his arm and when he was put into 10 or 12.


  • #54
    molloyjh
    Registered Users Posts: 24,745 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    emmet02 wrote: »
    Stephen Keogh??? What?

    The guy was an absolute rock for us!

    This. Always had loads of time for him. He was the epitome of the squad player. Not terribly spectacular like Rocky or SOB but a very fine, solid player who you could always rely on. Every squad needs players like him. I'd class Dundon as being quite similar tbh.


  • #55
    BBDBB
    Registered Users Posts: 26,899 ✭✭✭✭BBDBB


    Buer wrote: »
    Nacewa was excellent after he came back from his broken arm in his first season. He was an ever present in the back three in the last few months and deservedly so. His performance in the HEC semi was excellent.



    what did you think of his performance at 10 in his first season?

    considering he was bought from the Crusaders as a 10, a position he'd played in 2006 and 2007 keeping the initially injured Luke McAllister on the sidelines


  • #56
    DeDoc
    Registered Users Posts: 414 ✭✭DeDoc


    Tony Goldfinch must be high up there - although to be fair, he may have been signed as much by a club (Blackrock?) as the province...


  • #57
    former legend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭former legend


    BBDBB wrote: »
    what did you think of his performance at 10 in his first season?

    considering he was bought from the Crusaders as a 10, a position he'd played in 2006 and 2007 keeping the initially injured Luke McAllister on the sidelines

    He was signed as a utility-back and Cheika never intended him to be a full-time 10.

    The difference between the role of a 10 in Super Rugby and that of a 10 in the Celtic League of 2008 was enormous. Nacewa did just fine as out-half for Leinster until it came to kicking for field position, something he probably wasn't used to with the Blues. His general play was excellent.

    Would we have won the HC that season without him? Probably not. I'm embarrassed that he has even been mentioned on this thread.


  • #58
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    BBDBB wrote: »
    what did you think of his performance at 10 in his first season?

    considering he was bought from the Crusaders as a 10, a position he'd played in 2006 and 2007 keeping the initially injured Luke McAllister on the sidelines

    He never played for Crusaders, and never played with Luke McAllister. And also he wasn't signed as a 10, he had played there and Leinster were short at 10 when he arrived, but Cheika didn't bring him in to specifically play 10.

    Edit: sorry I'm wrong, McAllister was still playing for the Blues in Nacewa's last season, he went to England after that


  • #59
    nc6000
    Registered Users Posts: 3,220 ✭✭✭nc6000


    emmet02 wrote: »
    poor Berquist was another failure, though injury inflicted failure as opposed to poor rugby.

    Galarza, Sykes definitely abject failures too in recent times.

    Berquist didn't get to play much, look what happened to his knee......

    q3jph.jpg


  • #60
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,175 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    BBDBB wrote: »
    what did you think of his performance at 10 in his first season?

    considering he was bought from the Crusaders as a 10, a position he'd played in 2006 and 2007 keeping the initially injured Luke McAllister on the sidelines

    I thought he was decent in a couple of games and poor to mediocre in a couple. I recall he played with a broken arm for a few minutes against the Ospreys after slotting a couple of drops to win us the game.

    He only played a handful of games there. His contributions later in the season vastly outweigh any shortcomings at outhalf (which are not as significant as you seem to be indicating, I think we won all but the Wasps game with him there).

    His being mentioned in this regard, even in respect of his opening season, is absurd.


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  • #61
    Buer
    Registered Users Posts: 24,175 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    emmet02 wrote: »
    Stephen Keogh??? What?

    The guy was an absolute rock for us!

    He was very unlucky not to be capped on the tour to Argentina in 2007. A really intelligent player who was fantastic around the squad and took on a leadership role for the younger lads as captain of the A side.

    His first couple of seasons were great. He kept Gleeson out of the side at times. Unfortunately, he didn't kick on and guys like Elsom, McLaughlin and SOB all emerged.


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