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Dog Pound Statistics - Greyhounds

  • 26-01-2012 12:42am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 620 ✭✭✭


    http://www.anvilireland.ie/greyhound-pound-statistics.html

    The most recently available dog pound statistics for 2010 show that in many dog pounds throughout Ireland, the pts for greyhounds was 100%. On average, 82% of greyhounds that entered the pound system were put down. This compares to an average pts rate for other dogs at 34%

    Such figures are unacceptably high and I am wondering what readers in this forum think could and should be done to change this.


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Comments

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,338 Mod ✭✭✭✭convert


    Remember, civil posts only please, folks.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    The obvious question is why are Greyhounds being surrendered to Pounds ? Clarification is being sought but at the moment it seems that these were tattooed dogs.

    The following is a list of the main areas together with the number of Greyhounds killed:

    Clare 202
    Kerry 114
    Westmeath 45
    Offaly 30
    Limerick 58
    Cork 45
    Donegal 45

    In total 672 Greyhounds were killed in Irish Pounds during 2010. But this is the first year that Greyhound figures have been given so thousands of Greyhounds could of died, in Pounds, over the years.

    One possible explanation is that some Greyhound owners would rather hand their unwanted dogs into the Pound rather than pay a Vet to euthanise them.

    It certainly makes a mockery of the Greyhound Welfare Bill & self regulation. It also calls into question the IGB's commitment to welfare.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,318 ✭✭✭Vel


    I saw a discussion of Facebook about the greyhound issue and a well known Clare rescue said those figures can't be accurate in relation to Clare as they have taken a number of greyhounds for the Clare Warden as have other rescues.

    It was also stated that once the dog is surrendered in the owner can declare if they want the dog to have a chance of being rehomed or not, and if they choose not to then the Warden has no choice but to put to sleep. I wonder if this is the case or whther it could be argued that once the dog is signed over to the pound, then why should the owner dictate what happens to it. I wonder where the law stands on this issue.

    Who complied those greyhound figures? Were they all tattooed or could some lurchers have been included as greyhounds?


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    This is absolutely shameful. :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,650 ✭✭✭sensibleken


    I think from experience of dealing with rescues that the number pts in pounds is sadly only a fraction of greyhounds killed annually.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    A farmer in England was convicted for killing up to 10,000 Greyhounds. Many of these were Irish Dogs.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-396015/The-killing-fieldsof-10-000-greyhounds-old-race.html

    If you take the numbers of puppies registered & the number of dogs rehomed there is a huge shortfall. The number killed every year has been estimated between 6000 & 10,000.

    You can tell how little the Pound figures matter to the industry in that there is no mention of them on Greyhound Data.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 5,316 Mod ✭✭✭✭Nowso


    Lots of greyhounds are rehomed through various rehoming agencies including the igb itself. many are rehomed in italy and germany also aswell as ireland.

    Convert i think this board could be Renamed the Anti greyhound board of late open discussion is good but these anti greyhound groups have been described as domestic terrorists in the usa due to there actions

    http://www.timesleaderonline.com/page/content.detail/id/533691.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 620 ✭✭✭mosi


    Nowso wrote: »
    Lots of greyhounds are rehomed through various rehoming agencies including the igb itself. many are rehomed in italy and germany also aswell as ireland.

    In a Seanad discussion on the Welfare of Greyhounds Bill, Senator Trevor O Clochartaigh, who is in favour of greyhound racing, provides some figures

    At the peak of the industry, approximately 25,000 greyhounds were born in Ireland every year, which is a huge number compared with other countries. Typically, only 80 greyhounds were adopted into Irish homes per year, while between 430 and 450 were adopted into European homes at the end of their racing lives. Some 40,000 greyhounds are unaccounted for annually, which is still a serious cause for concern.

    It is also mentioned here that 75% of dogs racing in the UK are Irish bred.

    http://debates.oireachtas.ie/seanad/2011/11/09/00008.asp

    The destruction and/or disappearance of thousands of greyhounds each year is a disgrace. If the industry is unwilling to ensure that these dogs are well cared for after their careers have finished then it is little wonder that so many people are unhappy with it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Nowso wrote: »
    Convert i think this board could be Renamed the Anti greyhound board of late open discussion is good but these anti greyhound groups have been described as domestic terrorists in the usa due to there actions

    http://www.timesleaderonline.com/page/content.detail/id/533691.html


    Let me assure you that neither I or any of the posters to date are terrorists. I think that everyone genuinely wants to hear from both sides especially regarding how & why 672 Greyhound ended up in Irish Pounds.
    mosi wrote: »
    In a Seanad discussion on the Welfare of Greyhounds Bill, Senator Trevor O Clochartaigh, who is in favour of greyhound racing, provides some figures

    I will be writing to the Senator to ask where he obtained these figures. In reality I suspect that the numbers are nothing like that now. But the Pound figures seriously question the decision to allow the industry to continue being self regulated. Even if the number being killed has dropped it is still unacceptable.


  • Registered Users Posts: 606 ✭✭✭time lord


    Our local pound charges 30 euro to "put down" surrendered dogs. The vet starts at 70 euro. This would go along way way to explaining pound figures imo.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 670 ✭✭✭serenacat


    My God this thread is shocking!!


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,338 Mod ✭✭✭✭convert


    If people don't have anything constructive to contribute, can you please refrain from posting in the thread. Thanks.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,650 ✭✭✭sensibleken


    Define constructive?

    Would suggesting an independant inspection system of racing dog owners with strict licencing, penalties etc in order to stamp out this disgraceful behaviour count as constructive?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,338 Mod ✭✭✭✭convert


    As per the forum charter, if you've any questions re my post, PM me rather than posting on thread.

    However, for what's it worth, stating that 'this thread is shocking' is not considered constructive.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    The numbers are shocking. It would be interesting to hear from some of the people involved in racing. The silence is deafening...


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    planetX wrote: »
    The numbers are shocking. It would be interesting to hear from some of the people involved in racing. The silence is deafening...

    You can't expect people to come here & defend the indefensible. The IGB make no attempt to enforce rehoming & an owner is "free" to dispose of his dog in any way that he sees fit.

    The IGB also get out of explaining the number of dogs being killed by not keeping records. If you had nothing to hide you would keep records & publish them.

    A sure sign that the industry has not given the Pound figures a second thought is that no one has mentioned them on Greyhound-data.

    Also bear in mind that the IGB only consider tattooed dogs as Greyhounds. They ignore the thousands of dogs that are dumped without being tattooed.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    I was hoping there might be one person who would post and say that they care what happens to their greyhounds and explain what steps they take in this regard.
    If the sport is purely about betting and not interest in the dogs why not just bet on something non-living. There is obviously no real interest in resolving the problems that exist, and are becoming more and more publicised.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Well to show that I am being objective it is true that some Greyhound owners do care about their dogs & either keep them after racing or rehome them. But the reality is that the a huge number of owners do not care & the industry has no interest in making them care.

    But it isn't just the fault of the industry. If the majority in Ireland cared then we would have legislation. Instead thousands are happy to attend racing & support the industry.

    One of the key reasons for the decline & I believe eventually end, of racing in the UK is that the population have become aware of the real cost. The use of peaceful protest & awareness campaigns has changed a lot of minds.

    The difference here is that the industry is totally linked to the Government - the IGB is a state board.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,143 ✭✭✭Benny Cake


    You would be amazed the number of dog owners who retire a dog after a career ending injury rather than take the easy option of putting it to sleep. Of course it is more sensationalist to make out all dog owners are barbaric creatures with no emotional attachment to their animals, but the opposite is true.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Benny Cake wrote: »
    You would be amazed the number of dog owners who retire a dog after a career ending injury rather than take the easy option of putting it to sleep. Of course it is more sensationalist to make out all dog owners are barbaric creatures with no emotional attachment to their animals, but the opposite is true.

    I wouldn't be amazed because the figures simply don't back this up. Even on industry sites like greyhound-data the numbers being rehomed are tiny. If there are compassionate owners then it it up to them to force change to ensure that all owners comply.

    But it raises the question of why any compassionate owner would want to take part in a "sport" that kills so many dogs. By taking part as an owner, trainer, employee or spectator you are supporting & providing the revenue to allow the killing to go on.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,143 ✭✭✭Benny Cake


    Discodog wrote: »
    I wouldn't be amazed because the figures simply don't back this up. Even on industry sites like greyhound-data the numbers being rehomed are tiny. If there are compassionate owners then it it up to them to force change to ensure that all owners comply.

    But it raises the question of why any compassionate owner would want to take part in a "sport" that kills so many dogs. By taking part as an owner, trainer, employee or spectator you are supporting & providing the revenue to allow the killing to go on.

    And what percentage of greyhound owners use "industry sites", 5% maybe? Truth is, you have no idea what the sport is about, or how owners/trainers/spectators feel about greyhounds. I'd wager you've never even been to a track or coursing meeting, let alone spent any time in a trainers yard to witness who dogs are treated first hand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    Benny Cake wrote: »
    And what percentage of greyhound owners use "industry sites", 5% maybe? Truth is, you have no idea what the sport is about, or how owners/trainers/spectators feel about greyhounds. I'd wager you've never even been to a track or coursing meeting, let alone spent any time in a trainers yard to witness who dogs are treated first hand.

    I have been to races & I have attended coursing. Neither was as a spectator. I provided information & took part in the discussions that led to a ban on Hare coursing in the UK.

    It's not about how the dogs are treated whilst racing. It's about the principle, as accepted by the IGB, that an owner can dispose of an unwanted dog in any way that he pleases.

    If the majority of dogs were being rehomed/retired then the IGB would be shouting the numbers from the rooftops. The thousands of dead Greyhounds found on that farm were real.

    If you take the number of pups produced each year there are a huge number of dogs that are unaccounted for. If all of these dogs were rehomed then one in three pet dogs in Ireland would be a Greyhound !
    Go to any area that is popular with dog walkers & count the Greyhounds.

    But even the meagre statistics hide a secret in that thousands of Greyhounds are never tattooed - mine isn't. These dogs are consider not to be Greyhounds by the industry & suffer dreadfully as a result.

    If you are a compassionate owner you should speak out instead of fuelling the propaganda.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,441 ✭✭✭planetX


    Benny Cake wrote: »
    And what percentage of greyhound owners use "industry sites", 5% maybe? Truth is, you have no idea what the sport is about, or how owners/trainers/spectators feel about greyhounds. I'd wager you've never even been to a track or coursing meeting, let alone spent any time in a trainers yard to witness who dogs are treated first hand.

    where are these retired greyhounds? You don't see as many as you'd expect from the statistics. There must be some small scale breeders who keep a few old dogs maybe, but the numbers are so huge it doesn't add up overall.

    How owners feel about greyhounds - that's exactly what this thread was about, so come on tell. How do owners feel when they see these pound statistics, and the massive numbers of destroyed dogs? Is there no-one within the industry that wants to change it?


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 9,338 Mod ✭✭✭✭convert


    A reminder to all posters in this forum: please do not post anything which may be interpreted as being libellous or which could have negative implications for boards.ie. Any such posts will be deleted and the user infracted or banned.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 144 ✭✭fredweena


    When I was working in a rescue a large number of Irish dogs were rehomed in the uk. Every few weeks we would send some over. Some trainers would tell us when they were retiring a dog and then we'd look after it. Most don't want to see the dog put down but they need to make sure it'll be looked after if they give it to someone.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    fredweena wrote: »
    When I was working in a rescue a large number of Irish dogs were rehomed in the uk. Every few weeks we would send some over. Some trainers would tell us when they were retiring a dog and then we'd look after it. Most don't want to see the dog put down but they need to make sure it'll be looked after if they give it to someone.

    Why should they pass on their unwanted dog problem to rescues who are already hard pressed & desperate for money ? A dog is for life & not something to be disposed of because it no longer performs. If they don't want to see it put down then they should care for it just as every other dog owner.

    A Greyhound owner is hardly being compassionate by dumping a dog with a rescue rather than living up to his obligations to care for it during it's natural life.


  • Registered Users Posts: 550 ✭✭✭DePurpereWolf


    I have a simple question. The IGB is put in place in 1958 to regulate and promote greyhound racing. They've set up a good system to keep track of dogs. If you have the name of the dog you can look up it's sires and dames all the way back. You can see what races it won.
    What would the excuse be of not keeping track of what happens to a dog?
    If anyone is suppose to know what happens with greyhounds after their racing carreer, it's the IGB, that's want they're ment to do.
    I'm not against greyhound racing, I own two retired greyhounds myself. I've volunteered for a greyhound rescue agency and I just want to know the figures.

    If we have the figures it might help with rehoming them. Most greyhounds aren't rehomed because people aren't aware their is this fairly large number of unwanted greyhounds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    What would the excuse be of not keeping track of what happens to a dog?

    The IGB claim that they do not keep data regarding the number of rehomed dogs or the number killed. They also say that, whilst rehoming is preferable, they have no objection to unwanted dogs being killed.

    If thousands were being rehomed it would be a "good news" story. It would demonstrate the effectiveness of the "welfare scheme". You only hide bad news not good.


  • Registered Users Posts: 550 ✭✭✭DePurpereWolf


    That brings me to the next question. Given that the IGB is state run, wouldn't we (politicians) be able to force the IGB to keep these records? Than the quesion arises, why hasn't that been done?

    Is it political suicide to ask the IGB to keep these records as a politician, because you will be depicted as being anti-greyhound racing which would be seen as an attack on the traditional Irish way in general?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,795 ✭✭✭✭Discodog


    That brings me to the next question. Given that the IGB is state run, wouldn't we (politicians) be able to force the IGB to keep these records? Than the quesion arises, why hasn't that been done?

    Is it political suicide to ask the IGB to keep these records as a politician, because you will be depicted as being anti-greyhound racing which would be seen as an attack on the traditional Irish way in general?

    The first question is are the records kept ? Just because they are not collated doesn't mean that the raw data might not be there.

    Try seeking an FOI & you will hit a brick wall. To my knowledge the only politician who ever spoke out & only in a minor way, was Gormley & we know what happened to him.


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