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Lamb Pieces used in Indian Restaurants

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  • 27-12-2013 11:41am
    #1
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭


    Hi folks,

    I have been to Indian restaurants all over the country and the lamb served in them all is of an almost identical consistency and shape across the board.
    I would love to know if anyone knew where to buy it for making stuff at home. There may be a wholesaler, I am thinking...

    Thanks
    irish


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    #2
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,418 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    I usually buy a whole shoulder, or if I can't get that a leg or leg fillet, and bone it and dice it myself. Any decent butcher will do that for you if you ask.


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    #3
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    And would that give the fatless pieces similar to the restaurants?
    I got in two legs for Christmas dinner and had them boned but found there was a lot of fat on them.


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    #4
    Dermighty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,748 ✭✭✭Dermighty


    The amount of fat is directly related to the quality of the animal being used. Some butchers get good meat, some do not. Some weeks the lamb may be fantastic and other weeks it may be poor.

    My advice is to shop around and see what's on offer. Lamb should be around €15/kg. If it's less find out why it's less than the general price. If it's more find out why it's more than the general price. Maybe they pride themselves on having excellentlamb, or pride themselves on having the cheapest lamb :P

    The leg is a completely different kind of meat to the shoulder.

    As suggested you could buy a shoulder and cut it yourself or you could buy the pieces. If you find that a particular butchers does a great quality should of lamb then get them to cut it into pieces for you. You can always trim it the way you want it whether you buy a shoulder or the pieces. For curries like Rogan Josh etc I'd say that the fat is what gives it much of the richness (that and reducing it for a long time) so don't be too keen to get rid of all the fat :)

    Also I'd save yourself a lot of hassle and make sure your knife is really sharp. It can be tough work cutting through fat/sinew with a knife that's only as sharp as a spoon :P


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    #5
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,418 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    Yes, a bit of fat isn't a bad thing at all, and what's even better for flavour (IMO) is if you leave some bits of bone in as well.

    However, if you're after as lean as possible, you can't beat boning and dicing a shoulder or leg yourself. I usually buy what is called a leg fillet, i.e. the top part of the leg when you remove the shank. It takes some practice to do it well, but if you have a nice sharp knife and take your time you can get nice big chunks of relatively fat free pieces of meat.


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    #6
    TBoneMan
    Registered Users Posts: 118 ✭✭TBoneMan


    Shoulder is the best for flavour, I often get lamb neck on the bone diced. Superb if simmered for about 3 hours...however most indian restaurant s will be using new zealand frozen lamb unless irish is specifically stated. Cheaper and bought in boned.


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    #7
    Johnny_Fontane
    Registered Users Posts: 3,093 ✭✭✭Johnny_Fontane


    irishproduce wrote: »
    Hi folks,

    I have been to Indian restaurants all over the country and the lamb served in them all is of an almost identical consistency and shape across the board.
    I would love to know if anyone knew where to buy it for making stuff at home. There may be a wholesaler, I am thinking...

    Thanks
    irish

    getting back to original question, I'd also like to know! It seems to be a fairly universal large square of meat. Quite dense, but tasty.


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    #8
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    Johnny, I think that TBoneMan is onto something.
    I suspect because of the uni formality of the pieces, that they must be bought frozen.

    I am going to buy a shoulder this week on the advice of the posters above but at the same time, is there anywhere that normally sells frozen cubes (NZ or otherwise)?


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    #9
    huskerdu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,931 ✭✭✭huskerdu


    irishproduce wrote: »
    Johnny, I think that TBoneMan is onto something.
    I suspect because of the uni formality of the pieces, that they must be bought frozen.

    I am going to buy a shoulder this week on the advice of the posters above but at the same time, is there anywhere that normally sells frozen cubes (NZ or otherwise)?

    Lidl sell frozen NZ leg of lamb, but I never tried it.

    I suspect that the texture and taste of the lamb in Indian restaurants is mostly due to the cooking methods.

    Have you tried the recipes for Indian takeaway dishes in the Cooking club threads. They are very good


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    #10
    Curry Addict
    Registered Users Posts: 1,273 ✭✭✭Curry Addict


    Indian restaurants etc mostly use mutton not lamb. Mainly because its cheaper, yields more meat, its leaner and has a stronger flavor.

    here is how they cook it http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056521427


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    #11
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    Thanks curry addict.
    That cooking club link is fantastic.
    I am actually going to have a go off it this weekend. I appreciate your help.
    Just to be sure, I should ask the butcher for diced mutton to make these recipes from your link?
    I can see from looking around google that in fact, indians generally user mutton and not lamb, as you pointed out, so I just need to be sure which part I am asking for so it isn't laden with hard fat pieces and no meat if you get me.


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    #12
    huskerdu
    Registered Users Posts: 1,931 ✭✭✭huskerdu


    irishproduce wrote: »
    Thanks curry addict.
    That cooking club link is fantastic.
    I am actually going to have a go off it this weekend. I appreciate your help.
    Just to be sure, I should ask the butcher for diced mutton to make these recipes from your link?
    I can see from looking around google that in fact, indians generally user mutton and not lamb, as you pointed out, so I just need to be sure which part I am asking for so it isn't laden with hard fat pieces and no meat if you get me.

    Very few butchers in Ireland sell mutton. Also, mutton is a generic name ( like lamb) for lots of different cuts. The only difference between mutton and lamb is that the animal is older when killed, so the meat is darker, and will generally need to be cooked for longer to tenderize it.

    Leg of lamb or mutton has a lot less fat through the meat than other cuts.

    The best advice I can give you is to go to a reputable butcher shop and ask for advice. They will show you the different cuts of lamb, and you can decide which to buy.

    At this time of year, the lamb for sale is all hogget anyway. (teenage lambs).


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    #13
    pwurple
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,449 ✭✭✭✭pwurple


    Hogget is my favourite age, and best to use in a curry as well IMHO. It's lamb that has seen one christmas... So yes, all lamb now will be hogget.


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    #14
    Swiper the fox
    Registered Users Posts: 6,745 ✭✭✭Swiper the fox


    I made a curry last week and as my butcher was still closed for Christmas I picked up three packs of diced lamb from Tesco, it was the leaner one and had very little fat or anything else attached, the three packs made up about a kilo and cost 15E, it was very similar to what you'd get from an indian takeaway as regards size and consistency. In the past I've also bought the lamb neck chunks from Tesco and they've been decent enough also, Tesco meat in general bears no comparison to my local butcher but for chunks to use in a curry it doesn't make much difference and those ones I mentioned were lovely and lean, a stew benefits from a bit of fat content but a curry less so IMO.


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    #15
    Melendez
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Melendez


    This post has been deleted.


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    #16
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    I discovered upon cooking some lamb last week that it wasn't actually the lamb that I was trying to find, it was the way that it is cooked that made it like the restaurant curry lamb.
    It was simmered for about 2.5 hours and was perfectly soft and falling apart in the curry :-)


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    #17
    C.K Dexter Haven
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,711 ✭✭✭C.K Dexter Haven


    Hate lamb fat unless it's Crispy and fully cooked through- less is more when cooking Lamb with fat for me- pork fat is great, beef is OK too but I prefer a cooking with less fat on lamb-for stews or curries, I'd be looking for very lean lamb.


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    #18
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    C.K Dexter Haven wrote: »
    Hate lamb fat unless it's Crispy and fully cooked through- less is more when cooking Lamb with fat for me- pork fat is great, beef is OK too but I prefer a cooking with less fat on lamb-for stews or curries, I'd be looking for very lean lamb.

    Same as myself to be honest


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    #19
    Melendez
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Melendez


    This post has been deleted.


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    #20
    Gloomtastic!
    Registered Users Posts: 8,315 ✭✭✭Gloomtastic!


    Was in a quality Indian restaurant over the weekend and ordered the lamb jalfrezi. When I tasted the meat it had the consistency ie stringy, of stewed beef and it did not taste of lamb whatsoever.

    I did query it with the waitress, who checked with the chef but they were adamant that it was lamb.

    Was I going mad or can you get stringy lamb?


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    #21
    irishproduce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,804 ✭✭✭irishproduce


    Mine is stringy when I cook it for 2.5 - 3 hours, if I drag the fork over it, it will start to peel like cheese strings.
    To be honest, you should have known by the taste alone whether or not it was lamb...


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    #22
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Getting hungry just reading this thread!

    Anyone know a good butcher in Cork for shoulder of mutton (or lamb, at a push) or similar cuts for slow cooking? Cheaper the better, naturally!


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    #23
    The Hill Billy
    Registered Users Posts: 22,746 ✭✭✭✭The Hill Billy


    You would be better off asking in the Cork city or county forums.

    tHB


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    #24
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Valid point. Will post there before I get any hungrier. :)


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    #25
    Dermighty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,748 ✭✭✭Dermighty


    alaimacerc wrote: »
    Getting hungry just reading this thread!

    Anyone know a good butcher in Cork for shoulder of mutton (or lamb, at a push) or similar cuts for slow cooking? Cheaper the better, naturally!

    The English Market has a lot of butchers. They are not all equal.

    I would say that for value and quality the best would be The Meat Centre. They'll cut whatever you want, if you don't like what's in the counter they'll cut more from the fridge (if they have it).


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    #26
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Dermighty wrote: »
    The English Market has a lot of butchers. They are not all equal.
    Hence my wondering. I'm not a regular butchers-goer, and amn't super-up on different cuts of meat, so I can readily imagine myself wandering from counter to counter, getting more and more bamboozled.
    I would say that for value and quality the best would be The Meat Centre. They'll cut whatever you want, if you don't like what's in the counter they'll cut more from the fridge (if they have it).
    I think I'll give them a go, then, so. Thanks for the input.


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    #27
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    May not be lamb.........

    Which? recently published a report and found that of 60 lamb takeaways sampled (30 curries and 30 minced lamb kebabs) 24 were adulterated with beef and chicken.

    Is there any reason to think takeaways here would be any better (or worse)?


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    #28
    rubadub
    Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    Jawgap wrote: »
    Is there any reason to think takeaways here would be any better (or worse)?
    Might depend on the takeaway, some do not have any beef on the menu at all, I would have presumed this is a religious thing and so more likely to be lamb. If the place did lamb or beef curry then I expect it is more likely to be possibly using beef instead of lamb.


    I presume this is the survey thing you saw
    http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/apr/17/fsa-tests-takeaways-lamb-meals-meat
    The Which? survey tested 60 takeaway lamb curries and minced lamb kebabs and found that 24 of them contained other meats such as beef and chicken.
    I would not be surprised at kebabs, you often hear it called "mystery meat", so not sure how many were kebabs in that survey but I would guess it was a higher % that failed than the curries.


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    #29
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,297 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    Yup - the Guardian is reporting on the same survey.

    Here's Which?'s article....

    http://www.which.co.uk/documents/pdf/16-19_foodfraud-362908.pdf


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    #30
    alaimacerc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,224 ✭✭✭alaimacerc


    Jawgap wrote: »
    May not be lamb.........

    Which? recently published a report and found that of 60 lamb takeaways sampled (30 curries and 30 minced lamb kebabs) 24 were adulterated with beef and chicken.

    Is there any reason to think takeaways here would be any better (or worse)?

    I'm guessing that such substitutions are more likely in takeaways than at butchers, though. Not that I'd trust either, particularly, but the more "processed" the product, the more scope there is to get away with it. Not that I'd be particularly willing to back myself looking even at uncooked cuts, much less mince, but you'd think they'd have concerned about some people being able to do so.


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    #31
    rubadub
    Registered Users Posts: 32,373 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    alaimacerc wrote: »
    I'm guessing that such substitutions are more likely in takeaways than at butchers, though.
    I am wondering what the kebabs were called.
    . In Warwickshire, all of the 20 minced lamb kebabs tested by
    EOs contained other meats

    In most takeaways they are not called minced lamb kebabs. I was amazed at a friend of mine who was insisting all doner kebabs in chippers are 100% lamb.

    I wonder if the which? survey did this too. I am always interested in how they do the actual surveys, ones I have seen trying to compare supermarket prices were laughable.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doner_kebab
    Doner kebab (/ˈdɒnər kəˈbæb/, /ˈdoʊnər/; Turkish: döner or döner kebap, [døˈneɾ̝̊ ceˈbap]) is a Turkish dish made of meat cooked on a vertical rotisserie, normally lamb but also a mixture of veal or beef with these, or sometimes chicken.

    I looked up chipper suppliers before and the doner meats were not 100% lamb, it was no secret at all.


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