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Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

Amstel Gold 2015

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    #32
    pelevin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Raam wrote: »
    You already provided the reason why it was not ridiculous: Gilbert, the protected rider for BMC was back in the main bunch. The reason GVA wouldn't work is the same as why Martin wouldn't work.

    But the situation with Fuglsang & Van A was very different surely. It was the very tail-end of the race, Van A would presumably be considered at least as strong as Fuglsang - & probably a fair bit stronger - if other teams chased them down hard on the climb, Gilbert could use that harder pace anyway to launch himself the same as if it was a BMC rider initially going for it. Van A up the road I'd have thought would be expanding their chances.

    On the broader issue, much more interesting for a race to happen in the moment than someone in a car telling everyone to stick to a rigid pre-ordained plan, & so Van A not allowed ride cos that's not in the script.


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    #33
    Raam
    Registered Users Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    pelevin wrote: »
    But the situation with Fuglsang & Van A was very different surely. It was the very tail-end of the race, Van A would presumably be considered at least as strong as Fuglsang - & probably a fair bit stronger - if other teams chased them down hard on the climb, Gilbert could use that harder pace anyway to launch himself the same as if it was a BMC rider initially going for it. Van A up the road I'd have thought would be expanding their chances.

    On the broader issue, much more interesting for a race to happen in the moment than someone in a car telling everyone to stick to a rigid pre-ordained plan, & so Van A not allowed ride cos that's not in the script.

    BMC play it both ways. We won't work in the break, Fuglsang can if he wants and we won't chase in the peloton, other teams can do that if they want. Win-win. Or lose as the case turned out to be. They played it almost perfect, just Gilbert didn't have it in the end.


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    #34
    pelevin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Raam wrote: »
    BMC play it both ways. We won't work in the break, Fuglsang can if he wants and we won't chase in the peloton, other teams can do that if they want. Win-win. Or lose as the case turned out to be. They played it almost perfect, just Gilbert didn't have it in the end.

    I'd see it more as not a Win-win as Van A not working with Fuglsang meant that nothing was going to happen there whereas if he had worked with him something might have happened. It was simply a negating tactic rather than a positive one & all hopes were put on the Gilbert move.


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    #35
    Raam
    Registered Users Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    If GVA did what you suggested and BMC didn't win then they would look like complete fools and rightly so given that their best chance of winning was sitting just behind. Is Fuglsang a better climber than GVA? Mmm, maybe on the real long stuff. I think Fuglsang would have beaten him up the Cauberg anyway but that's just my guess.


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    #36
    pelevin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Well GVA finished 5th suggesting he'd not too much to be worried from the thought of Fuglsang distancing him.


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    #37
    Raam
    Registered Users Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    pelevin wrote: »
    Well GVA finished 5th suggesting he'd not too much to be worried about from Fuglsang.

    Fuglsang finished 4th a few years ago. If he had nothing to worry about then why did he mark him?


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    #38
    lennymc
    Registered Users Posts: 6,458 ✭✭✭lennymc


    Is anyone else reading "Fuglsang" in Sean Kelly's voice?


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    #39
    pelevin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Raam wrote: »
    Fuglsang finished 4th a few years ago. If he had nothing to worry about then why did he mark him?

    Fuglsang is obviously a good rider but whatever a team tries there's no certainty in winning - as shown in Gilbert not winning. If it came down to Gilbert having to beat everyone or the 'gamble' of GVA just up against beat Fuglsang - as well if that fails as Gilbert maybe winning anyway, I think that's fairly obviously an increase in one's chances. A very clear worthwhile throw of the dice imo.


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    #40
    Raam
    Registered Users Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    pelevin wrote: »
    Fuglsang is obviously a good rider but whatever a team tries there's no certainty in winning - as shown in Gilbert not winning. If it came down to Gilbert having to beat everyone or the 'gamble' of GVA just up against beat Fuglsang - as well if that fails as Gilbert maybe winning anyway, I think that's fairly obviously an increase in one's chances. A very clear worthwhile throw of the dice imo.

    I dunno, man. I think Gilbert's record in this race shows that they did the right thing.


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    #41
    pelevin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Raam wrote: »
    I dunno, man. I think Gilbert's record in this race shows that they did the right thing.

    I know - we're not going to resolve it here! I just think it was a case of adding to the considerable chance they had with Gilbert by letting GVA go on, rather than detracting from it. Anyway . . .


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    #42
    dastardly00
    Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭dastardly00


    Lads, just be happy that GVA didn't win. Think of the shít storm that would caused given his current circumstances.


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