Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all,
Vanilla are planning an update to the site on April 24th (next Wednesday). It is a major PHP8 update which is expected to boost performance across the site. The site will be down from 7pm and it is expected to take about an hour to complete. We appreciate your patience during the update.
Thanks all.

England v Ireland St Patricks Day 2012

Options
1…4344454749

Comments

  • Options
    #1382
    OldRio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,915 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    I think you may have missed the ironic tone of my post.

    Apologies.
    :D


  • Options
    #1383
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    Lelantos wrote: »
    Is it not worth remembering that we have 4 provinces, and it seems if you play for connaught you dont figure in the managements plans..

    What players exactly is this in relation to in the present. The only player who could have conceivably made the team was McCarthy, and he did... There isn't another player playing for Connacht who can feel aggrieved that they missed out. Even McCarthy's selection was arguably the wrong one.


  • Options
    #1384
    Lelantos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,612 ✭✭✭Lelantos


    Tox56 wrote: »
    By laughing stock I meant the running joke about X player from another country and his great-great-great grandfather in-law knew a guy who owned an Irish Wolfhound and therefore he can play for Ireland.

    It's not the point, we don't need to "bring in" Irish players from other countries because our talent pool is too small, we have plenty to chose from they just aren't being chosen.
    Sorry, but we weren't a laughing stock, and its different with the rugby scenario. It's Irish born & Irish parentage, no granny grabbing. And as far as us having plenty of players to chose from, we don't. It's obvious our options are limited if Healy & Ross are out. We don't have the quality & depth of other nations


  • Options
    #1385
    Lelantos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,612 ✭✭✭Lelantos


    Hagz wrote: »
    Lelantos wrote: »
    Is it not worth remembering that we have 4 provinces, and it seems if you play for connaught you dont figure in the managements plans..

    What players exactly is this in relation to in the present. The only player who could have conceivably made the team was McCarthy, and he did... There isn't another player playing for Connacht who can feel aggrieved that they missed out. Even McCarthy's selection was arguably the wrong one.
    That's partially my point. It's looked upon as a 2nd class citizen & anyone like Carr or Keatley knows they have to get out to have a chance at getting selected for Ireland.


  • Options
    #1386
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Hagz wrote: »
    What players exactly is this in relation to in the present. The only player who could have conceivably made the team was McCarthy, and he did... There isn't another player playing for Connacht who can feel aggrieved that they missed out. Even McCarthy's selection was arguably the wrong one.

    I'd argue that Tiernan O'Halloran has shown the most potential out of all the young wingers in the country but appears to be behind both D.Kearney and Zebo at the moment.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1387
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    shuffol wrote: »
    I'd argue that Tiernan O'Halloran has shown the most potential out of all the young wingers in the country but appears to be behind both D.Kearney and Zebo at the moment.

    I would disagree he should be ahead of D. Kearney.


  • Options
    #1388
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    Lelantos wrote: »
    That's partially my point. It's looked upon as a 2nd class citizen & anyone like Carr or Keatley knows they have to get out to have a chance at getting selected for Ireland.

    But as of now, there genuinely isn't anyone who's missing out on a deserved spot. The argument that Connacht players are being ignored can only hold water when there actually is a Connacht player who's being ignored.


  • Options
    #1389
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    shuffol wrote: »
    I'd argue that Tiernan O'Halloran has shown the most potential out of all the young wingers in the country but appears to be behind both D.Kearney and Zebo at the moment.

    Hardly evidence of Connacht players being ignored. You'd be basing it on 1 wolfhound game and a sub appearance from Kearney.


  • Options
    #1390
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Tox56 wrote: »
    I would disagree he should be ahead of D. Kearney.

    Has been performing consistently well in the HEC in a poor side and has outplayed guys like Vincent Clerc along the way. D.Kearney has seen sod all HC gametime and when he did he had one of his quieter days.


  • Options
    #1391
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Hagz wrote: »
    Hardly evidence of Connacht players being ignored. You'd be basing it on 1 wolfhound game and a sub appearance from Kearney.

    No but I do feel that Connacht players in general have to do more to get noticed, actually I think the same is the case with Ulster players too.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1392
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    shuffol wrote: »
    Has been performing consistently well in the HEC in a poor side and has outplayed guys like Vincent Clerc along the way. D.Kearney has seen sod all HC gametime and when he did he had one of his quieter days.

    If he was playing for Connacht he would be able to play HEC rugby, but I prefer him at Leinster to learn and play with the players he does. Simply playing regular HEC rugby should not mean automatic selection. DK has so many players to get past it would be unfair to base selection on solely that.

    He's been good in the Wolfhounds and non-HEC games.


  • Options
    #1393
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    shuffol wrote: »
    No but I do feel that Connacht players in general have to do more to get noticed, actually I think the same is the case with Ulster players too.

    The ironic thing is that an Ulster player was completely ignored this year in favor of a Connacht player, despite being younger and in arguably better form. So yes, I would agree that sometimes Ulster players can be hard done by.


  • Options
    #1394
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Tox56 wrote: »
    If he was playing for Connacht he would be able to play HEC rugby, but I prefer him at Leinster to learn and play with the players he does. Simply playing regular HEC rugby should not mean automatic selection. DK has so many players to get past it would be unfair to base selection on solely that.

    He's been good in the Wolfhounds and non-HEC games.

    Its very subjective but he's been the one I've been most impressed with when I've seen him, very classy player. He's a couple of years younger than Kearney and Zebo so that could also explain why he hasnt been looked at.


  • Options
    #1395
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    Leinster on their own can field an Irish second team of:

    Healy/McGrath
    Strauss/Cronin
    Ross/Hagan
    Thorn/Flanagan
    Cullen/Toner
    McLaughlin/Ruddock
    SOB/Dom Ryan
    Heaslip/Auva'a
    Reddan/Boss
    Sexton/Madigan
    Fitzgerald/Carr
    D'Arcy/McFadden
    BOD/O'Malley
    Nacewa/Conway
    Kearney/D Kearney

    There is an abundance of young talent in Leinster alone, and that's not even including what all the other provinces are able to contribute.

    The talent is there, and we have no need to search elsewhere, we just need to try these players.


  • Options
    #1396
    Ardillaun
    Registered Users Posts: 2,535 ✭✭✭Ardillaun


    We've just suffered one of the greatest scrummaging humiliations in our rugby history and yet there loads of comments in this thread about the performance of the backs which says quite a bit about how much we value set-piece forward play.

    Firstly, every single member of that pack has to take some responsibility for the disaster that occurred - from Heaslip forward - and before they are considered for Ireland again their scrummaging should be the first factor looked at. There's no way one can praise the performance of either second row in that match without mentioning their culpability in the scrum as well.

    How many international level tight-heads do we have in the country? How can we develop more? Rugby is impossible without these people. We shouldn't bother going on any more tours until we sort this out.

    I don't know when I'll be able to take a closer look at what happened in those 'scrums' again. I'm about as fond of that prospect as Basil Fawlty was of Lord Melbury's bricks.


  • Options
    #1397
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    Ardillaun wrote: »
    Firstly, every single member of that pack has to take some responsibility for the disaster that occurred - from Heaslip forward - and before they are considered for Ireland again their scrummaging should be the first factor looked at.

    Why? How the hell were Heaslip, Ferris, O'Brien, O'Callaghan, Healy supposed to take any blame for what happened. It's even strange to lay blame on Best and Ryan. The only person to blame is Court, and you can't even blame him. We don't have a prop who can play both sides of the scrum. Nothing can be done about that until one is found.


  • Options
    #1398
    JustinDee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,684 ✭✭✭JustinDee


    Tox56 wrote: »
    That made our national football team a laughing stock and it's not necessary at all, we have plenty of people to chose from, it's just Kidney has only 22 and that's it.
    I know its an aside but ... so what?? Nobody's laughing at England, for a start despite the fielding of Americans, Samoans, Welsh, or New Zealanders.
    Provided they've played for no-one else and qualify, they're perfectly entitled to play. Nobody there gives two stuffs what anybody else thinks if they're winning.
    No playerbase is too big and that includes exiles.


  • Options
    #1399
    Tox56
    Registered Users Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    JustinDee wrote: »
    I know its an aside but ... so what?? Nobody's laughing at England, for a start despite the fielding of Americans, Samoans, Welsh, or New Zealanders.
    Provided they've played for no-one else and qualify, they're perfectly entitled to play. Nobody there gives two stuffs what anybody else thinks if they're winning.
    No playerbase is too big and that includes exiles.

    But we would never have the moral high ground over England!

    And yes, I've seen plenty of mockery at England's expense from a variety of sources. Didn't you see that Kiwi video with the "It's every little New Zealanders dream to pull on the black of New Zealand, just like it's every little Samoans dream to pull on the black.. of England"?

    This is light years off topic though, and if it is so contensious I withdraw it..

    The point is, we have enough of a talent base here, we just don't use it effectively.


  • Options
    #1400
    Sindri
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,059 ✭✭✭Sindri


    Hagz wrote: »
    Ardillaun wrote: »
    Firstly, every single member of that pack has to take some responsibility for the disaster that occurred - from Heaslip forward - and before they are considered for Ireland again their scrummaging should be the first factor looked at.
    Why? How the hell were Heaslip, Ferris, O'Brien, O'Callaghan, Healy supposed to take any blame for what happened. It's even strange to lay blame on Best and Ryan. The only person to blame is Court, and you can't even blame him. We don't have a prop who can play both sides of the scrum. Nothing can be done about that until one is found.

    It was obviously illegal scrummaging lads FFS. No one to blame. Court had no answer and Ross was injured by that same illegal scrummaging. :mad:

    We need to stop this ****e about how we can't scrummage and how we were brutal in the scrum. We were brutal but it was for aforementioned reasons.

    We lost the match by poor ball retention and being overturned by illegal scrummaging. The 'tactical' substitutes didn't help either.


  • Options
    #1401
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,709 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    JustinDee wrote: »
    Tox56 wrote: »
    That made our national football team a laughing stock and it's not necessary at all, we have plenty of people to chose from, it's just Kidney has only 22 and that's it.
    I know its an aside but ... so what?? Nobody's laughing at England, for a start despite the fielding of Americans, Samoans, Welsh, or New Zealanders.
    Provided they've played for no-one else and qualify, they're perfectly entitled to play. Nobody there gives two stuffs what anybody else thinks if they're winning.
    No playerbase is too big and that includes exiles.

    Couldn't agree more, how many Pacific Islanders have played for the All-Blacks and Wallabies. You don't see many people laughing at them when there winning World Cups.
    If a player qualifies for a country and is good enough to get picked good on them. How many of us would complain if Isa was togging out in green?

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1402
    JustinDee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,684 ✭✭✭JustinDee


    JRant wrote: »
    Couldn't agree more, how many Pacific Islanders have played for the All-Blacks and Wallabies. You don't see many people laughing at them when there winning World Cups.
    If a player qualifies for a country and is good enough to get picked good on them. How many of us would complain if Isa was togging out in green?
    Don't forget that the best known Samoan, Tongan and Fijian intls tend to be New Zealanders.


  • Options
    #1403
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    I have no problem with players qualifying for other countries. I have a bit of a problem with countries actively seeking out young players from other countries in the hopes of making them qualify in the future.


  • Options
    #1404
    JustinDee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,684 ✭✭✭JustinDee


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    I have no problem with players qualifying for other countries. I have a bit of a problem with countries actively seeking out young players from other countries in the hopes of making them qualify in the future.
    Like Geoghegan, Henderson, Maggs or the Easterby bros?


  • Options
    #1405
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,263 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    JustinDee wrote: »
    Like Geoghegan, Henderson, Maggs or the Easterby bros?

    I think he was more talking about seeking out players with the intention of them qualifying through residency.


  • Options
    #1406
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    Has Kidney resigned yet?


  • Options
    #1407
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    JustinDee wrote: »
    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    I have no problem with players qualifying for other countries. I have a bit of a problem with countries actively seeking out young players from other countries in the hopes of making them qualify in the future.
    Like Geoghegan, Henderson, Maggs or the Easterby bros?
    No? Every single one of those players was Irish by descent.

    I'm talking about, for example, the IRFU spotting a top class 18 year old Finnish tighthead and arranging for him to be brought over as a project player.


  • Options
    #1408
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,709 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    JustinDee wrote: »
    JRant wrote: »
    Couldn't agree more, how many Pacific Islanders have played for the All-Blacks and Wallabies. You don't see many people laughing at them when there winning World Cups.
    If a player qualifies for a country and is good enough to get picked good on them. How many of us would complain if Isa was togging out in green?
    Don't forget that the best known Samoan, Tongan and Fijian intls tend to be New Zealanders.

    Exactly, there's a much more fluid movement of players in the Sanzar region. With the size of our player pool I have no problem with anyone coming over here.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Options
    #1409
    Fishooks12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,318 ✭✭✭Fishooks12


    danthefan wrote: »
    Has Kidney resigned yet?

    No, and it's naive to think he will any time soon tbh

    He'll be around for another championship unless we get totally humilated in the Autumn and Summer tests


  • Options
    #1410
    JustinDee
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,684 ✭✭✭JustinDee


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    No? Every single one of those players was Irish by descent.

    I'm talking about, for example, the IRFU spotting a top class 18 year old Finnish tighthead and arranging for him to be brought over as a project player.
    Nothing wrong with that. That's how Hartley, Tuilagi and Corbi-whateverhisnameis were targeted and if Richardt Strauss is good enough, he'll follow suit in Ireland.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #1411
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,709 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Fishooks12 wrote: »
    danthefan wrote: »
    Has Kidney resigned yet?

    No, and it's naive to think he will any time soon tbh

    He'll be around for another championship unless we get totally humilated in the Autumn and Summer tests

    Even then there's no guarantee he'd go tbh. Our current management setup really believe in what their doing. I don't but that that's immaterial as long as the blazers in the IRFU do. I'd say if the crowds start staying away from Landsdowne he'd be gone in a heartbeat.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



Advertisement