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Who is the Greatest Irish SportsPerson based on what He/She have Achieved...

13

Comments

  • #62
    Pherekydes
    Registered Users Posts: 16,109 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    deadybai wrote: »
    In my opinion it has to be Henry Shefflin or Brian Cody. To win 10 AL medals in 15 years is just unbelievable.

    Michelle Carroll won 31 Irish titles and all on her own. Terry McHugh won 21 Irish titles in 21 different years.


  • #63
    feargale
    Registered Users Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    Martin Sheridan.


  • #64
    Tobyglen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 719 ✭✭✭Tobyglen


    Katie Taylor to be considered is ridiculous. V Minority sport. Anyone outside GB & I would not know her. Most in GB wouldn't know her aswell.

    Sean Kelly dominated a sport that's huge in Europe and big in other parts. 5 years consecutively no 1 cyclist and won a grand tour, numerous monuments and a Grand Tour (Espana). He's a legend in cycle circles.

    BOD was a wonderful player, best we have had but slightly overrated by our media.

    Roy Keane was a winner.

    P Harrington incredible achievement to win 3 Majors.

    McIlroy; no need to say anymore

    S O Sullivan was World champ and dominated middle distance running for 4-5 years. She was imo robbed of 2 gold medals by cheating (chinese in barcelona) (szabo in Sydney). Criminal because she was unbelievably talented and the best athletics person we have ever produced.

    Any of those 6 for me. All were winners on a global stage. For me Kelly but O'Sullivan gets nowhere near the credit she deserves.


  • #65
    poeticjustice
    Registered Users Posts: 159 ✭✭poeticjustice


    Tobyglen wrote: »
    Katie Taylor to be considered is ridiculous. V Minority sport. Anyone outside GB & I would not know her. Most in GB wouldn't know her aswell.

    Not ridiculous!! one of very few Irish gold medal winners at the olympic games and has dominated her sport overwhelmingly!! Plenty of people outside Ireland and Great Britain know who she is, especially those in boxing.

    I'm not saying she's the greatest, there's no definitive way of deciding that, it's personal opinion. But certainly not ridiculous for her name to be mentioned in this thread.


  • #66
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    locum-motion wrote: »
    Eh, no they're not!

    The clue's in the name; they're both 'boxing'.

    Yes, I concede that there are some differences in the rules between them, but they are most definitely not two different sports.

    Are American football and Association Football the same sport???


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  • #67
    Dan man
    Registered Users Posts: 3,076 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dan man


    Tobyglen wrote: »
    Katie Taylor to be considered is ridiculous. V Minority sport. Anyone outside GB & I would not know her. Most in GB wouldn't know her aswell.

    Sean Kelly dominated a sport that's huge in Europe and big in other parts. 5 years consecutively no 1 cyclist and won a grand tour, numerous monuments and a Grand Tour (Espana). He's a legend in cycle circles.

    BOD was a wonderful player, best we have had but slightly overrated by our media.

    Roy Keane was a winner.

    P Harrington incredible achievement to win 3 Majors.

    McIlroy; no need to say anymore

    S O Sullivan was World champ and dominated middle distance running for 4-5 years. She was imo robbed of 2 gold medals by cheating (chinese in barcelona) (szabo in Sydney). Criminal because she was unbelievably talented and the best athletics person we have ever produced.

    Any of those 6 for me. All were winners on a global stage. For me Kelly but O'Sullivan gets nowhere near the credit she deserves.


    Sonia was 4th in Barcelona and the Chinese didn't win any medals in that race. I think you mean 1993 in Stuttgart.


  • #68
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    How did Zsabo cheat?


  • #69
    TheQuietFella
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭TheQuietFella


    John O'Shea, has to be!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyrb-qFkjKs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDlGJH0OTm0

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHxJThRSkHQ


  • #70
    locum-motion
    Registered Users Posts: 5,143 ✭✭✭locum-motion


    efb wrote: »
    Are American football and Association Football the same sport???

    No, and neither are Rugby football, Gaelic football and Australian rules football.

    But:

    Amateur Association football and professional Association football are the same sport.
    Amateur American football and professional American football are the same sport.
    Amateur Rugby football and professional Rugby football are the same sport.
    Amateur Gaelic football and professional Gaelic football - if it existed - would be the same sport.
    Amateur Australian Rules football and professional Australian Rules football are the same sport.

    Just the same as there is in boxing (as I pointed out earlier), there may be slight differences in the rules (have you ever seen a TMO at a schools rugby match?) but the fact of one being professional and one amateur does not make them different sports.


  • #71
    carrollmark
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭carrollmark


    Has Sean Kelly a 100% clean record in relation to doping? Genuine question.

    I don't think he can be considered having never won the Tour de France or the World Championship.

    I think Stephen Roches treble in 1987 was the greatest achievement of any Irish sportsperson ... but he wasn't the greatest.

    I can't see past BOD.

    He won every honour in the game over a very long career and reinvented himself a little when he lost his explosive pace

    He was very special and a real warrior.

    Represented the very best of Ireland every time he pulled on the green jersey.

    I can't see past him


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  • #72
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    carrollmark wrote: »
    Has Sean Kelly a 100% clean record in relation to doping? Genuine question.

    I don't think he can be considered having never won the Tour de France or the World Championship.

    I think Stephen Roches treble in 1987 was the greatest achievement of any Irish sportsperson ... but he wasn't the greatest.

    I can't see past BOD.

    He won every honour in the game over a very long career and reinvented himself a little when he lost his explosive pace

    He was very special and a real warrior.

    Represented the very best of Ireland every time he pulled on the green jersey.

    I can't see past him
    Not winning either the tour or worlds shouldn't discount Kelly.
    20+ grand tour stage victories, won the vuelta, won paris nice 7 times in a row. was first to be ranked N1 when the UCI ranking were introduced and he stayed as N1 for 6 years.
    O Driscoll won virtually everything in the game and is certainly up there as one of the greatest but don't think Kelly can be discounted


  • #73
    carrollmark
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭carrollmark


    The Lost Sheep wrote: »
    Not winning either the tour or worlds shouldn't discount Kelly.
    20+ grand tour stage victories, won the vuelta, won paris nice 7 times in a row. was first to be ranked N1 when the UCI ranking were introduced and he stayed as N1 for 6 years.
    O Driscoll won virtually everything in the game and is certainly up there as one of the greatest but don't think Kelly can be discounted

    He's certainly worth his place in the debate, but wouldn't be my choice.

    I don't think Katie Taylor is a credible choice. She's certainly dominant in her sport and will go down as a legend of Amateur Female Boxing.

    I'm not questioning her dedication or skill but amateur female boxing isn't a top level sport in my opinion.

    McIlroy could be the greatest in a few years but I'll always hold to the opinion that golf/snooker/darts are games rather than sports on the basis that if you don't break a sweat, get out of breath and feel sore the next day then you've played a game not a sport


  • #74
    Tobyglen
    Closed Accounts Posts: 719 ✭✭✭Tobyglen


    poeticjustice wrote: »
    Not ridiculous!! one of very few Irish gold medal winners at the olympic games and has dominated her sport overwhelmingly!! Plenty of people outside Ireland and Great Britain know who she is, especially those in boxing.

    I'm not saying she's the greatest, there's no definitive way of deciding that, it's personal opinion. But certainly not ridiculous for her name to be mentioned in this thread.

    Participation rate is v low in comparison to other sports in which Irish athletes have excelled. Plenty people outside GB & Ireland know know Katie Taylor? -that's simply not true, in truth she can hardly sell out small gigs around Ireland. I say this as someone who has a lot of respect for her but she's not a contender.


  • #75
    poeticjustice
    Registered Users Posts: 159 ✭✭poeticjustice


    carrollmark wrote: »
    McIlroy could be the greatest in a few years but I'll always hold to the opinion that golf/snooker/darts are games rather than sports on the basis that if you don't break a sweat, get out of breath and feel sore the next day then you've played a game not a sport

    Wow...seriously???


  • #76
    poeticjustice
    Registered Users Posts: 159 ✭✭poeticjustice


    Tobyglen wrote: »
    but she's not a contender.

    ...in your opinion :)


  • #77
    180Bhoy
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭180Bhoy


    Wow. Not a mention of ROBBIE Keane?

    Our Countrys all time leading scorer. Got us to a World Cup and Euros. Only Irish player to score 100+ goals in Premier league.


  • #78
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Tobyglen wrote: »
    Katie Taylor to be considered is ridiculous. V Minority sport. Anyone outside GB & I would not know her. Most in GB wouldn't know her aswell.

    Sean Kelly dominated a sport that's huge in Europe and big in other parts. 5 years consecutively no 1 cyclist and won a grand tour, numerous monuments and a Grand Tour (Espana). He's a legend in cycle circles.

    BOD was a wonderful player, best we have had but slightly overrated by our media.

    Roy Keane was a winner.

    P Harrington incredible achievement to win 3 Majors.

    McIlroy; no need to say anymore

    S O Sullivan was World champ and dominated middle distance running for 4-5 years. She was imo robbed of 2 gold medals by cheating (chinese in barcelona) (szabo in Sydney). Criminal because she was unbelievably talented and the best athletics person we have ever produced.

    Any of those 6 for me. All were winners on a global stage. For me Kelly but O'Sullivan gets nowhere near the credit she deserves.

    Harrington has done nothing in the last few years. So he won a few majors. Golf is that kind of game, where low ranked players have a good tournament and win. Katie Taylor on the other hand has had a perfect record for 10 years. At the top all the time. No blips or drops. Nobody in the world of golf has a comparable domination. Woods sure was dominant, but he hasn't won a slam in 7 years. He also was not unbeatable. Taylor is a 95 percent winner in her sport. Lost only 6-7 fights out of about 160. You saying her inclusion is ridiculous is ridiculous.

    BTW, Taylor is a global name. To say that nobody outside Ireland and GB would know her, and that most in GB would not know her is ridiculous.


  • #79
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    carrollmark wrote: »
    I don't think Katie Taylor is a credible choice. She's certainly dominant in her sport and will go down as a legend of Amateur Female Boxing.

    I'm not questioning her dedication or skill but amateur female boxing isn't a top level sport in my opinion.
    t

    It is a top level sport. It's a global sport and anyone on earth can compete. In the first few years it was not, but over the past few years it has been global.


  • #80
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    carrollmark wrote: »
    Has Sean Kelly a 100% clean record in relation to doping? Genuine question.

    I don't think he can be considered having never won the Tour de France or the World Championship.

    I think Stephen Roches treble in 1987 was the greatest achievement of any Irish sportsperson ... but he wasn't the greatest.

    I can't see past BOD.

    He won every honour in the game over a very long career and reinvented himself a little when he lost his explosive pace

    He was very special and a real warrior.

    Represented the very best of Ireland every time he pulled on the green jersey.

    I can't see past him

    He hasn't won every honor.

    He hasn't a WC winners medal or an IRB player of the year trophy


  • #81
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    carrollmark wrote: »

    I think Stephen Roches treble in 1987 was the greatest achievement of any Irish sportsperson ... but he wasn't the greatest.
    .

    I always felt this. Tremendous year. I think only one other man had achieved that treble. Eddie Mercyx. I don't believe it has been achieved since Roche. I may be wrong.


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  • #82
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I'd throw in ROG as quick as BOD. ROG and his achievements and wins for Ireland, his game winning performances and his longevity are remarkable. His 6 N stats are also incredible.


  • #83
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    carrollmark wrote: »
    He's certainly worth his place in the debate, but wouldn't be my choice.

    I don't think Katie Taylor is a credible choice. She's certainly dominant in her sport and will go down as a legend of Amateur Female Boxing.

    I'm not questioning her dedication or skill but amateur female boxing isn't a top level sport in my opinion.

    McIlroy could be the greatest in a few years but I'll always hold to the opinion that golf/snooker/darts are games rather than sports on the basis that if you don't break a sweat, get out of breath and feel sore the next day then you've played a game not a sport
    Katie Taylor is certainly a credible choice. She has transformed her sport with her dominance. She has helped change how the sport is viewed upon to a large extent. Technicallty she is super. As for your opinion on golf etc :rolleyes:. They are games but they are also sports.


  • #84
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    locum-motion wrote: »
    No, and neither are Rugby football, Gaelic football and Australian rules football.

    But:

    Amateur Association football and professional Association football are the same sport.
    Amateur American football and professional American football are the same sport.
    Amateur Rugby football and professional Rugby football are the same sport.
    Amateur Gaelic football and professional Gaelic football - if it existed - would be the same sport.
    Amateur Australian Rules football and professional Australian Rules football are the same sport.

    Just the same as there is in boxing (as I pointed out earlier), there may be slight differences in the rules (have you ever seen a TMO at a schools rugby match?) but the fact of one being professional and one amateur does not make them different sports.

    Quite a discernible difference in amateur and pro boxing. More difference in those two sports than your examples. They share a common name, boxing, but apart from that they are very different. For men they are becoming more similar, that I will concede.


  • #85
    blue note
    Registered Users Posts: 4,501 ✭✭✭blue note


    walshb wrote: »
    Harrington has done nothing in the last few years. So he won a few majors. Golf is that kind of game, where low ranked players have a good tournament and win. Katie Taylor on the other hand has had a perfect record for 10 years. At the top all the time. No blips or drops. Nobody in the world of golf has a comparable domination. Woods sure was dominant, but he hasn't won a slam in 7 years. He also was not unbeatable. Taylor is a 95 percent winner in her sport. Lost only 6-7 fights out of about 160. You saying her inclusion is ridiculous is ridiculous.

    BTW, Taylor is a global name. To say that nobody outside Ireland and GB would know her, and that most in GB would not know her is ridiculous.

    Harrington has been poor since winning his majors, but what he did isn't something that can just happen to a low ranked player. Firstly, he wasn't a low ranked player, he finished top 20 in the world for about 10 consecutive seasons. And secondly, I think fewer than 30 people have more majors than him in the history of the game. Some average players have won a major, but you need to be top class to win 3.


  • #86
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,562 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    blue note wrote: »
    Harrington has been poor since winning his majors, but what he did isn't something that can just happen to a low ranked player. Firstly, he wasn't a low ranked player, he finished top 20 in the world for about 10 consecutive seasons. And secondly, I think fewer than 30 people have more majors than him in the history of the game. Some average players have won a major, but you need to be top class to win 3.

    I know that he wasn't ranked low pre major wins. I didn't mean to imply that. Just that a major is not something that is awesome. It's just ONE tournament that gets a lot more coverage. Yes, more entries as well, but so many brilliant and consistent players have never won a major. Then there are those who were never consistently great who have won. It can be a lottery at times. That's the the thing with golf. There are many permutations involved, particularly weather! I mean, in one of his wins wasn't he chasing an old man for the Open? Norman!

    Padraig had a 13-14 month window where he won three big tournaments. Not enough IMO to be a real threat as the GOAT in Ireland.

    Tom Watson threw away the Open in '09 if memory serves me. The saying, golf is a funny old game is so very true.

    I wouldn't consider Padraig for the GOAT in Ireland. But I can see why others would.


  • #87
    carrollmark
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭carrollmark


    efb wrote: »
    He hasn't won every honor.

    He hasn't a WC winners medal or an IRB player of the year trophy

    You're correct.

    He was hands down the world player of the year in 2009 and it was a joke they gave it to McCaw that year.

    He would've been a star on any World Cup winning team.

    On the Katie Taylor argument ... her dominance and record can't be argued with but when I watch her fights the intensity isn't comparable to high level mens professional boxing or any of the sports played by the other contenders for Irelands GOAT.

    She's also competing against amateurs which none of the others are ...


  • #88
    blue note
    Registered Users Posts: 4,501 ✭✭✭blue note


    walshb wrote: »
    I know that he wasn't ranked low pre major wins. I didn't mean to imply that. Just that a major is not something that is awesome. It's just ONE tournament that gets a lot more coverage. Yes, more entries as well, but so many brilliant and consistent players have never won a major. Then there are those who were never consistently great who have won. It can be a lottery at times. That's the the thing with golf. There are many permutations involved, particularly weather! I mean, in one of his wins wasn't he chasing an old man for the Open? Norman!

    Padraig had a 13-14 month window where he won three big tournaments. Not enough IMO to be a real threat as the GOAT in Ireland.

    Tom Watson threw away the Open in '09 if memory serves me. The saying, golf is a funny old game is so very true.

    I wouldn't consider Padraig for the GOAT in Ireland. But I can see why others would.

    A major is something awsome. 3 majors is absolutely spectacula . A few players win a major who wouldn't be truely great golfers. But only 10 have won more than Padraig in the modern era (since the 60s). And he had a 13 month window where he won three majors, but he had a decade before that with multiple wins and high finishes. I think after his PGA win he had the best irish major result in all 4 majors.


  • #89
    feargale
    Registered Users Posts: 8,636 ✭✭✭feargale


    You are all comparing widely different sports - apples and oranges! The winner has to be sonmbody who, over a very long period, dominated a sport that demanded extraordinary physical exertion, preferably showing all-round ability by doing so in more than one sport. By example, a poll of American sports writers in the fifties deemed Jim Thorpe the greatest all-round sportsman of all time, and Babe Zaharias, alias Mildred Didrikson the female equivalent.
    All-rounders are few and far between these days due to the insanely increasing demands of individual sports. Katie Taylor would be a magnificent addition to the Republic of Ireland soccer team ( for which she has played before ) if it weren't for her boxing commitments. I hope she will return to soccer when her boxing career ends. Even as a veteran she could make a valuable contribution for a while. Anyway I would certainly rate her at least Ireland's greatest ever female athlete.
    For really great all-rounders you would have to go back a century, to people like Sheridan ( already mentioned ), Kiely, Flanagan, the Ryan brothers ( rugby internationals and hurlers ) and Cecil Parkes.


  • #90
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Leaving out the drug power ones, there is really only one contender in Padraig Harrington. No one else is really even near him.


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  • #91
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Leaving out the drug powered ones, there is really only one contender in Padraig Harrington. No one else is really even near him.


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