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Doing the PME: am I mad?

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  • 30-08-2014 5:42pm
    #1
    D86
    Registered Users Posts: 3 ✭


    Dear all,

    I am new to boards.ie so I hope I am not breaking any rules!

    My question is whether doing the PME in the current job market is a bad decision? I know it is hard to answer as for some teaching is all they ever wanted in a career. My concern is that after the 2 years in college, and 11,000 later, I will be stuck with very few/no hours in a school...

    My subjects are English and French, I am a 21 Male studying in a Dublin University, and work very hard. I have a lot of experience working with teenagers and have a lot of extra-curricular interests. However, I am really considering dropping out (and getting the fees back!), as I fear being unemployed when I graduate.

    From your experience, does one stand little hope at getting a permanent position with English and French as subjects?


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    #2
    sitstill
    Registered Users Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭sitstill


    D86 wrote: »
    Dear all,

    I am new to boards.ie so I hope I am not breaking any rules!

    My question is whether doing the PME in the current job market is a bad decision? I know it is hard to answer as for some teaching is all they ever wanted in a career. My concern is that after the 2 years in college, and 11,000 later, I will be stuck with very few/no hours in a school...

    My subjects are English and French, I am a 21 Male studying in a Dublin University, and work very hard. I have a lot of experience working with teenagers and have a lot of extra-curricular interests. However, I am really considering dropping out (and getting the fees back!), as I fear being unemployed when I graduate.

    From your experience, does one stand little hope at getting a permanent position with English and French as subjects?

    Have you actually started the PME?

    None of us can actually tell you what to do. However at the moment, the jobs market is very bad. Sure, you might be lucky, but the likelihood is that the best you could hope for in your first few years is a few hours of subbing or a sick leave here and there, topped up with Social Welfare payments during the holidays.


  • Options
    #3
    aratsarse101
    Registered Users Posts: 128 ✭✭aratsarse101


    D86 wrote: »
    does one stand little hope at getting a permanent position with English and French as subjects?

    Honestly, I would say little or no hope in Ireland.


  • Options
    #4
    EarnestH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭EarnestH


    I'm not a teacher, so take what I say with a grain of salt. But I would not generally allow the negativity that all too often surfaces on this site to sway your decision too much.

    My view is that teaching is a vocation - and if you are passionate about this, then short term sacrifices will be worth the long term gains. You'll here all about the challenges here - and you should weigh these - but I also suggest you speak to teachers in real life. If you are passionate the challenges won't matter too much. The problem here is that too many of the wrong type of people go into teaching.

    I'm sure that if you are smart, motivated, and savvy you can have a great career in teaching.


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    #5
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    EarnestH wrote: »
    I'm not a teacher, so take what I say with a grain of salt. But I would not generally allow the negativity that all too often surfaces on this site to sway your decision too much.

    My view is that teaching is a vocation - and if you are passionate about this, then short term sacrifices will be worth the long term gains. You'll here all about the challenges here - and you should weigh these - but I also suggest you speak to teachers in real life. If you are passionate the challenges won't matter too much. The problem here is that too many of the wrong type of people go into teaching.

    I'm sure that if you are smart, motivated, and savvy you can have a great career in teaching.

    People on here are teachers, and they're not even going on about the negative aspects of the job, they are going on about how hard it is to come by long term sustainable work. That is the reality. Too many graduates, not enough jobs.

    Being smart, savvy and motivated is all very well, but it won't put food on the table, if there are no jobs to go to on graduation.


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    #6
    Mardy Bum
    Registered Users Posts: 3,674 ✭✭✭Mardy Bum


    EarnestH wrote: »

    My view is that teaching is a vocation

    It is a profession.

    OP you are not mad but you have to be willing to work very hard and be adaptable to change in location and lifestyle.


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    #7
    EarnestH
    Closed Accounts Posts: 30 ✭EarnestH


    Mardy Bum wrote: »
    It is a profession.

    OP you are not mad but you have to be willing to work very hard and be adaptable to change.

    Yes, this is exactly my point. If you are passionate about a career in teaching, work hard, and are adaptable, then you can be successful.

    As to vocation versus profession, that is another thread.


  • Options
    #8
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,108 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    You can be successful if you can find a job. The lack of jobs is the problem.


  • Options
    #9
    aratsarse101
    Registered Users Posts: 128 ✭✭aratsarse101


    In fact OP, there is a very obvious move away from French at Department level. Take for example the language consultation document published this week. Here is an extract from it for you:

    “One of the features of language provision and uptake at post-primary level is the predominance of French, mainly due to historical factors. Greater diversification of foreign language provision in post-primary schools is essential in order to meet the present and future needs of individuals and of society as a whole.”


  • Options
    #10
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    aratsarse101 wrote: »
    In fact OP, there is a very obvious move away from French at Department level. Take for example the language consultation document published this week. Here is an extract from it for you:

    “One of the features of language provision and uptake at post-primary level is the predominance of French, mainly due to historical factors. Greater diversification of foreign language provision in post-primary schools is essential in order to meet the present and future needs of individuals and of society as a whole.”

    It's a bit of a vicious circle really. More schools offer French over other foreign languages, so more students do French for LC, so more students do French at third level than other languages, so it's more likely that a greater proportion of them will do the PME than say Spanish graduates as there are greater job opportunities in French than Spanish based on student uptake.

    It's also a big risk for a school to introduce a new language if the overall uptake is relatively small, as it could be hard to get a teacher, but more importantly hard to get a substitute teacher for sick leaves/maternity leaves. Often easier for a school to offer French to maintain the status quo, instead of say introducing Italian.


    I can't honestly see how the Dept will break away from French anytime soon.

    Approximately 26,000 students did French for LC this year, compared to approx 7,000 for German, 5,400 for Spanish and 350 for Italian. Although Spanish has seen an increase of about 900 over the last two years which is a massive increase for a subject with such a small uptake.


  • Options
    #11
    dwiseman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 138 ✭✭dwiseman


    D86 wrote: »
    Dear all,

    I am new to boards.ie so I hope I am not breaking any rules!

    My question is whether doing the PME in the current job market is a bad decision? I know it is hard to answer as for some teaching is all they ever wanted in a career. My concern is that after the 2 years in college, and 11,000 later, I will be stuck with very few/no hours in a school...

    My subjects are English and French, I am a 21 Male studying in a Dublin University, and work very hard. I have a lot of experience working with teenagers and have a lot of extra-curricular interests. However, I am really considering dropping out (and getting the fees back!), as I fear being unemployed when I graduate.

    From your experience, does one stand little hope at getting a permanent position with English and French as subjects?


    The PME is now €12,400 for the two year course!!


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    #12
    Peter Flynt
    Registered Users Posts: 2,812 ✭✭✭Peter Flynt


    dwiseman wrote: »
    The PME is now €12,400 for the two year course!!

    A waste of money.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057159912


  • Options
    #13
    2011abc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,659 ✭✭✭2011abc


    Is it seriously the case now that you have to pay 12k+ to become a teacher in Ireland ( and 3k 'registration fee' or is that a once off in First Year only ?) AND you can't even get a grant as it's now classed as a Masters ?!
    Clearly the government just want the sons and daughters of their IBEC pals moulding the minds of the future .


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    #14
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    2011abc wrote: »
    Is it seriously the case now that you have to pay 12k+ to become a teacher in Ireland ( and 3k 'registration fee' or is that a once off in First Year only ?) AND you can't even get a grant as it's now classed as a Masters ?!
    Clearly the government just want the sons and daughters of their IBEC pals moulding the minds of the future .

    UCD lists fees on their webpage as €6,100 per year..... so yes:eek::eek:


    http://www.ucd.ie/education/graduateprogrammes/taughtprogrammes/professionalmastersineducationpme/


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    #15
    sitstill
    Registered Users Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭sitstill


    That is crazy money and shameful, as it basically cuts off people from less-well off or working class backgrounds from going into teaching because they won't get their grants now and would be unlikely to borrow such a huge amount of money when they'd hardly earn enough to pay it back afterwards.


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    #16
    TheDriver
    Registered Users Posts: 12,393 ✭✭✭✭TheDriver


    Even if your parents earned over 100k, they could barely afford that kind of money.


  • Options
    #17
    Peter Flynt
    Registered Users Posts: 2,812 ✭✭✭Peter Flynt


    sitstill wrote: »
    That is crazy money and shameful, as it basically cuts off people from less-well off or working class backgrounds from going into teaching because they won't get their grants now and would be unlikely to borrow such a huge amount of money when they'd hardly earn enough to pay it back afterwards.

    . . . and those from well off backgrounds won't even consider teaching due to the desperate money on offer.

    Throw in no job security . . . and that's a recipe for driving down the "profession"

    Well done the "Teaching Council" - Shower of useless muppets.


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    #18
    dwiseman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 138 ✭✭dwiseman


    Peter Flynt wrote: »
    . . . and those from well off backgrounds won't even consider teaching due to the desperate money on offer.

    Throw in no job security . . . and that's a recipe for driving down the "profession"

    Well done the "Teaching Council" - Shower of useless muppets.

    I can understand all the negativity but as someone working in fulltime employment that wants to become a primary school teacher it's the only option for me as for the most part it will allow me to keep working while I study. Between registration and fees it will be a total of 12,400 but the way I see it is at least I will be qualified at the end of it and I can then try to find a job however difficult that may be. As a father of 2 young kids this isn't a decision I take lightly, its a big financial commitment but reading the posts on this forum doesn't help all the questions flying around in my head!


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