Principals & The "600 points" Students

Feeded · 28-08-2014 11:35pm #1

I work in a voluntary secondary school in Munster and today I saw a photo of one of our most recent leaving cert graduates with our Principal on the local district weekly paper. He did brilliantly (over 600) but there were at least fifteen others that exceeded 500 and regularly contributed to school life in sport, music, open days, took prefect roles etc. The highest achiever didn't do ANYTHING else ...nothing but study.

I'm really annoyed by this photo because it was the only leaving cert photo from our school on the paper. Nothing about the rest of the graduates. I don't like the message that it sends to the rest of the school community and beyond and I'm wondering what other brazen efforts have been made around the country's schools to sidestep the achievements of great students so that the outstanding student can shine brighter.

Witcher · 28-08-2014 11:37pm

Feeded wrote: »

I work in a voluntary secondary school in Munster and today I saw a photo of one of our most recent leaving cert graduates with our Principal on the local district weekly paper. He did brilliantly (over 600) but there were at least fifteen others that exceeded 500 and regularly contributed to school life in sport, music, open days, took prefect roles etc. The highest achiever didn't do ANYTHING else ...nothing but study.

How do you know he didn't have achievements outside of school?

RH149 · 28-08-2014 11:48pm

Its just a media thing....they draw attention to the ones who stand out most with their 600 points as that makes a story. We have those students every now and then and their photos get in the paper when they get their Best LC Award/Best JC Award but we celebrate the other high achievers like you mentioned on our website or in our brochures. Their pictures will be up a lot longer than the 600 pt guys photo in the paper which probably ends up in the recycling bin the following week.

endacl · 28-08-2014 11:54pm

What about the student who just scraped a pass? You know the one. Nice kid. Not academically gifted. Worked their hole off. Did their best. Scraped a pass. Were over the moon with the achievement.

Where's their picture?

spurious · 29-08-2014 10:13am

endacl wrote: »

What about the student who just scraped a pass? You know the one. Nice kid. Not academically gifted. Worked their hole off. Did their best. Scraped a pass. Were over the moon with the achievement.

Where's their picture?

They are the ones I wish the media would focus on too. The child who was not functionally literate on entry but managed to pass, the child who missed months due to illness, the child who fought on despite deteriorating eyesight or health. The adult who never got a chance to enter secondary school and is doing exams for the first time in their 70s.

The 600 point pupils mostly teach themselves with their high levels of self-motivation. Good on them, but they are only a very small section of the truly inspirational people who get exam results.

happywithlife · 29-08-2014 10:44am

I'm with ya on this
I always think of one student I had - hadn't a word of English god love her and was completely lost! I only had her for her leaving cert yr as a sub and it took me a while to realise how poor she was cos she'd get the homework off others and orally in class was just about functional. But she couldn't read a word of English and my paper's language is fairly technical. I worked incredibly hard with her and she passed the ordinary level paper. I rate her sucess as high if not higher than the A1's. She was ready to quit school completely round the time of the pres but I'm so glad she stuck it out. Meet the girl now around town as she works locally and she always - without fail - stops me for a chat.
But you never saw her photo in the paper :-(

Eogclouder · 29-08-2014 10:48am

I knew a few people who got the 600+, they are probably some of the dullest people I have ever met.
Academically gifted, but that's about it.

Having them think on their own without having prepared for months and months (looking for patterns, learning off the essays that were written by college lecturers) is usually a situation people like this have a hard time dealing with.

Rubberchikken · 29-08-2014 10:49am

agree with you.
but it's really a media thing. never remember such hype about LC results in 'olden time', but in the past decade it's photos in paper, helplines and not just for students, and the whole thing of 'look how well this small percentage did' ethos.

hopefully the kids themselves pay little attention to it, and those that got what they wanted are happy and ready to move on to the next life stage.

29-08-2014 1:43pm

Let them have their photo for gods sake. It makes a change from the sporty kids etc being put on the pedestal.

Other kids did well but this one did the best.

byhookorbycrook · 29-08-2014 4:27pm

As a Learning Support teacher, I know that 6 passes may be an outstanding result for some children, but I don't see why we still can't celebrate those who achieve 600 points, just like we celebrate the team that win the football final, the child who excels musically and so on.

ustazjoseph · 29-08-2014 6:43pm

I know of a school who regularly has the 6oo point students. They stream their students, focus on the best and I fear have a bottom class for whom little is expected. Perhaps the issue is more about how we support and celebrate students rather than falling into the efficient point factory hype. ?

Enright · 29-08-2014 7:00pm

Rarely see LCA students selected for photo opportunities, these are equally deserving

Mary63 · 29-08-2014 7:26pm

oh,get over youself,teachers just dont like really bright students because the students ask clever questions the teachers cant answer.Teachers prefer the slogging swots who need spoonfeeding.

What is wrong with the brighter students teaching themselves,the pace of the class and the standard of teaching is holding them back,surely any good teacher would be thrilled to see the bright students self motivating themselves.
Also people want to read about success,they dont want to read about average students which is most of the student body,whats interesting about them.
Also life isnt fair,the brighter students are invariably also very photogenic too,they have received the best of everything since they were born,this attracts the eye and hence the paper is bought,this is the reaosn for taking the photo in the first place.

lulu1 · 29-08-2014 7:27pm

All the very best to each and every student who did their leaving weather they got top marks or just scraped through. I am delighted my own daughter got 450 points and her friend who failed maths by half a point last year and had to repeat also did well. Fair play to them all I for one couldn't do it

spurious · 29-08-2014 7:32pm

Mary63 wrote: »

oh,get over youself,teachers just dont like really bright students because the students ask clever questions the teachers cant answer.Teachers prefer the slogging swots who need spoonfeeding.

What is wrong with the brighter students teaching themselves,the pace of the class and the standard of teaching is holding them back,surely any good teacher would be thrilled to see the bright students self motivating themselves.
Also people want to read about success,they dont want to read about average students which is most of the student body,whats interesting about them.
Also life isnt fair,the brighter students are invariably also very photogenic too,they have received the best of everything since they were born,this attracts the eye and hence the paper is bought,this is the reaosn for taking the photo in the first place.

Wow, just wow.

endacl · 29-08-2014 7:35pm

spurious wrote: »

Wow, just wow.

W-O-W?

What an odd way to spell F-F-S...

Mary63 · 29-08-2014 7:49pm

Feeded wrote: »

I work in a voluntary secondary school in Munster and today I saw a photo of one of our most recent leaving cert graduates with our Principal on the local district weekly paper. He did brilliantly (over 600) but there were at least fifteen others that exceeded 500 and regularly contributed to school life in sport, music, open days, took prefect roles etc. The highest achiever didn't do ANYTHING else ...nothing but study.

I'm really annoyed by this photo because it was the only leaving cert photo from our school on the paper. Nothing about the rest of the graduates. I don't like the message that it sends to the rest of the school community and beyond and I'm wondering what other brazen efforts have been made around the country's schools to sidestep the achievements of great students so that the outstanding student can shine brighter.

The student who didnt do anything else got the 600 points,this achievement is probably very rare in a school in a voluntary secondary school and naturally enough the principal wanted to take the brownie points.
The student who got the 600 points has probably got his first choice in medicine,the ones who got the 500 points and faffed around for the year will be fighting for places in DIT.

evolving_doors · 29-08-2014 7:52pm

endacl wrote: »

W-O-W?

What an odd way to spell F-F-S...

LOL
Deduct 10 points for answering the wrong question.

anyhow...

I wonder do any of the news and media companies (which are INDEPENDANT) have any interests in these repeat schools which feed off the points frenzy?

spurious · 29-08-2014 7:54pm

Mary63 wrote: »

The student who didnt do anything else got the 600 points,this achievement is probably very rare in a school in a voluntary secondary school and naturally enough the principal wanted to take the brownie points.
The student who got the 600 points has probably got his first choice in medicine,the ones who got the 500 points and faffed around for the year will be fighting for places in DIT.

OK, lol.

evolving_doors · 29-08-2014 7:56pm

Mary63 wrote: »

The student who didnt do anything else got the 600 points,this achievement is probably very rare in a school in a voluntary secondary school and naturally enough the principal wanted to take the brownie points.
The student who got the 600 points has probably got his first choice in medicine,the ones who got the 500 points and faffed around for the year will be fighting for places in DIT.

not as rare as you think though!...

500 points ain't nothing to be sniffed at either..

Mary63 · 29-08-2014 7:59pm

Its not 600 points though and if they hadnt wasted their time playing GAA etc for the school and missing class time they could have got 600 points too.

partyatmygaff · 29-08-2014 8:02pm

The ones who excelled in sports, music and other extracurricular activities probably had more than their fair share of moments over the years. Maybe even some newspaper features too. If they got over 500 in their LC, they did a great job and it probably got them what they wanted but they're one in a few thousand.

The person who put in the time, dedication and effort to be one of the very few top-scoring LCers in the country deserves some recognition and they shouldn't be begrudged by their teachers or other students.

That and the article's put up after the Leaving Cert results and that's ultimately all that matters on that day. If you wanted someone to be recognised for being a prefect and representing the school in matches etc, they could have done something near graduation. The LC has nothing to do with any of it.

spurious · 29-08-2014 8:02pm

You're kind of overdoing it now Mary63, but you got me, I'll admit it.

byhookorbycrook · 29-08-2014 8:05pm

Mary63 wrote: »

Also life isnt fair,the brighter students are invariably also very photogenic too,they have received the best of everything since they were born,this attracts the eye and hence the paper is bought,this is the reaosn for taking the photo in the first place.

Ignoring errr... typos, so only middle/upper class children get 600 points? Stereotype much???

Blackpanther95 · 29-08-2014 8:07pm

Feeded wrote: »

I work in a voluntary secondary school in Munster and today I saw a photo of one of our most recent leaving cert graduates with our Principal on the local district weekly paper. He did brilliantly (over 600) but there were at least fifteen others that exceeded 500 and regularly contributed to school life in sport, music, open days, took prefect roles etc. The highest achiever didn't do ANYTHING else ...nothing but study.

I'm really annoyed by this photo because it was the only leaving cert photo from our school on the paper. Nothing about the rest of the graduates. I don't like the message that it sends to the rest of the school community and beyond and I'm wondering what other brazen efforts have been made around the country's schools to sidestep the achievements of great students so that the outstanding student can shine brighter.

Wait.. so all he did was study.... And his only achievement is 600 points, then why on earth would you want to take away his picture or have him in with people who did worse. I just can't understand that, his ONLY reward is that, he has dedication. The other guys have their music, they have their plays etc etc and HE HAS ONLY THIS -you wanna take even that away from him

Santa Cruz · 29-08-2014 8:21pm

endacl wrote: »

What about the student who just scraped a pass? You know the one. Nice kid. Not academically gifted. Worked their hole off. Did their best. Scraped a pass. Were over the moon with the achievement.

Where's their picture?

They don't need a picture. They can wait until the 600 points student needs a plumber and then they can rip him off for as much as they can.

evolving_doors · 29-08-2014 8:34pm

Mary63 wrote: »

Its not 600 points though and if they hadnt wasted their time playing GAA etc for the school and missing class time they could have got 600 points too.

Ahhh so you reckon anyone who didn't get 600 points was just faffing about?
...
.
.fumbling for bold pen somewhere in pencil case.
.
ahhh there we go...
.
.

Blackpanther95 · 29-08-2014 8:39pm

Armelodie wrote: »

Ahhh so you reckon anyone who didn't get 600 points was just faffing about?
...
.
.fumbling for bold pen somewhere in pencil case.
.
ahhh there we go...
.
.

Well if your working hard to get 200 points, then school might not be for you. Maybe you'll make a great actor or singer or... there are so many jobs that you don't need pen or paper for...
Put it this way when i went to school, it was the 15 year old that made the senior team that was the talk of the school... untill the LC results came out. Now no one was complaining that they weren't getting any attention because they weren't athletically gifted. No one should be complaining about not getting attention if they're not acedemically gifted... its not ur fault

seavill · 29-08-2014 8:44pm

amazing opinions on this thread, baffled doesn't describe it

Mary63 · 29-08-2014 9:14pm

Im not assuming people who didnt get 600 points were faffing about,i mentioned that in relation to OP who said the wonderful give it all a go characters didnt get credit for all the extra stuff they did,well,why should they,they obviously got involved because they enjoyed the experience,are we supposed to put all the Gaisce award winners on the front page.
Byhookorbycrook,it is a fact that the private schools top the leagues tables every year and their average points would be 450,you only have to look at the intake into the really high point courses in the top universities,the majority of students are from professional middleclass backgrounds.Plumbers sons and daughters dont go on to study law,brains are genetic and you cant turn a donkey into a racehorse.

seavill · 29-08-2014 9:18pm

Mary63 wrote: »

Im not assuming people who didnt get 600 points were faffing about,i mentioned that in relation to OP who said the wonderful give it all a go characters didnt get credit for all the extra stuff they did,well,why should they,they obviously got involved because they enjoyed the experience,are we supposed to put all the Gaisce award winners on the front page.
Byhookorbycrook,it is a fact that the private schools top the leagues tables every year and their average points would be 450,you only have to look at the intake into the really high point courses in the top universities,the majority of students are from professional middleclass backgrounds.Plumbers sons and daughters dont go on to study law,brains are genetic and you cant turn a donkey into a racehorse.

Thats actually a shocking view of the world to have, if you really believe that because you are a plumber you have no brains and your children wont either I feel really sorry for you. I'd rather be a plumbers son any day than be raised to believe that

Principals & The "600 points" Students

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