How cheaply can you run a tidy car legally and safely ?

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 2:32pm #1

I believe the cheaper you can live the more free and independent you can become.

Depending on where you live, a car can offer added independence, but at a cost.

So taking all costs into consideration including depreciation, parts, tyres etc., doing average mileage, how cheaply can you run a car legally and safely for every year ?

And I'm not talking about some smellly heap. A clean tidy car.

djimi · 09-08-2013 2:40pm

How long is a piece of string? A lot of variables to be taken into account. How big of a car do you need? How many miles per year do you do? What kind of roads do you drive on? Do you live in a city or in a rural area? What is your age profile and driving history? All of these will affect how much it costs to run a car.

If you are in your 40s with a clean license and full NCB, driving a 1 litre car and doing 100km a week then it would cost next to nothing to run a car.

Toyotafanboi · 09-08-2013 2:41pm

car purchase 1500 say for a god condition 2000-2001 k11 micra
service costings say 400 per year
tax 200 per year
insurance 500 per year
nct 50 per year
fuel 1800 (35 euro per week)

so 4450 the first year (85 per week) including the cost of the car, 2950 (55 per week) the second year.

assuming you want to drive modestly but legitimately a couple of hundret km's top per week and you already have a license and aren't a male aged 17.

Anan1 · 09-08-2013 2:42pm

djimi wrote: »

If you are in your 40s with a clean license and full NCB, driving a 1 litre car and doing 100km a week then it would cost next to nothing to run a car.

Even at that you're probably looking at a couple of grand a year, all in.

djimi · 09-08-2013 2:44pm

Anan1 wrote: »

Even at that you're probably looking at a couple of grand a year, all in.

True. I should have said relatively speaking next to nothing! All in my car probably costs me close to €500 a month to run...

Cee-Jay-Cee · 09-08-2013 2:46pm

I have an 05 legacy. I own the car and have no loans or debts on it. I do 12k kms a year. It costs me €50 a week in fuel, €710 p.a in tax and approx €400 in insurance. I service it myself which costs €60 (Every 12 months) I've owned it since April 2012 and never had to spend one penny on it other than the above. It's highly reliable, will get me anywhere, comfortable and looks good. It needs absolutely nothing as tyres have at least 70% life remaining. It got a new clutch and flywheel just before I bought it and so its relatively maintenance free.

Honey-ec · 09-08-2013 2:48pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

I believe the cheaper you can live the more free and independent you can become.

Why's that now? Once you're living within your means, how does the actual amount spent make any difference whatsoever to your freedom and independence?

Someone spending €100 a month running a car isn't necessarily any more independent than someone spending €800 on theirs.

challengemaster · 09-08-2013 2:48pm

CJC999 wrote: »

I service it myself which costs €60 (Every 12 months)

Oh dear

keithsfleet · 09-08-2013 3:24pm

challengemaster wrote: »

Oh dear

Is an oil change not a full service....

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 3:36pm

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

car purchase 1500 say for a god condition 2000-2001 k11 micra
service costings say 400 per year
tax 200 per year
insurance 500 per year
nct 50 per year
fuel 1800 (35 euro per week)

so 4450 the first year (85 per week) including the cost of the car, 2950 (55 per week) the second year.

assuming you want to drive modestly but legitimately a couple of hundret km's top per week and you already have a license and aren't a male aged 17.

That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. I'd say your € 400 for maintenance is about right, because something like a clutch, or full set of tyres, or exhaust etc. will be needed from year to year. I'd also add in depreciation (about €250 per year for that car maybe ?) and the fact that 4450 in the bank would net you about €120 year in interest. That's another cost people often forget. I'd be thinking with that value of car to go third party insurance only though, so might be able to get the insurance down to € 300-400. Interesting exercise, especially for any home considering a second car.

dr.fuzzenstein · 09-08-2013 3:52pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. I'd say your € 400 for maintenance is about right, because something like a clutch, or full set of tyres, or exhaust etc. will be needed from year to year. I'd also add in depreciation (about €250 per year for that car maybe ?) and the fact that 4450 in the bank would net you about €120 year in interest. That's another cost people often forget. I'd be thinking with that value of car to go third party insurance only though, so might be able to get the insurance down to € 300-400. Interesting exercise, especially for any home considering a second car.

You can subtract a third from that, because of DIRT. And the fact that virtually all savings products available to the end user are next to worthless.

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 4:00pm

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

You can subtract a third from that, because of DIRT.

I'm not going to start arguing exact savings rates, but just like the NCT fee, if you're on a budget, it still should be factored in though to get the true cost. And the fact that cars can loose somewhere around 20 % per year on top of that again. It's not a great place to place a lot of money, and that's leaving out the borrowing % rate costs if you get a loan.

djimi · 09-08-2013 4:07pm

I think factoring in the interest that you didnt get from having the money in the bank is a step too far when calculating the cost of running a car if Im being totally honest.

dr.fuzzenstein · 09-08-2013 4:11pm

djimi wrote: »

I think factoring in the interest that you didnt get from having the money in the bank is a step too far when calculating the cost of running a car if Im being totally honest.

Don't forget wear and tear on the driveway!:P

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 4:20pm

djimi wrote: »

I think factoring in the interest that you didnt get from having the money in the bank is a step too far when calculating the cost of running a car if Im being totally honest.

That's up to you, but if you're factoring in the total annual cost of things like the NCT fee, and motor tax, in some cases it can be actually more than those expenses.

Remember the OP is 'how cheaply'

cluelez · 09-08-2013 4:37pm

me 03' jap car. medium engine, same car past 4-5 years:

20,000- 30,000km's on motorways per year, fuel cost is in the range of 2,500-3.500 euros per year.

servicing on oils cost about EUR75-150 per year.

tyres cost about 250-350 a set per two/three years.

other servicing varies between 150-400 every year (there are years there is nothing and there are years there is 150 +300 or so, it just depends on the age, mileage, type of the car etc)

insurance with Full NCB cost about 300-350 per year

55 for nct

tax cost me about 450 a year but again it depends of the type of car your own.

OP the least you drive the cheaper you will pay

you can always get the car, go for NCT then repair it on your own (if you have tools and skills)

parts you can search online or s/hand if needs be... there are ways... but consider do you really need the car.

djimi · 09-08-2013 4:46pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

That's up to you, but if you're factoring in the total annual cost of things like the NCT fee, and motor tax, in some cases it can be actually more than those expenses.

Remember the OP is 'how cheaply'

Those expenses are directly related to motoring though, and as such are a direct cost of running the car. Its a bit much to include money that you never had in the first place. Each to their own, but adding things like that is not giving you a realistic figure imo.

MadYaker · 09-08-2013 4:52pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

That's the kind of thing I'm talking about. I'd say your € 400 for maintenance is about right, because something like a clutch, or full set of tyres, or exhaust etc. will be needed from year to year. I'd also add in depreciation (about €250 per year for that car maybe ?) and the fact that 4450 in the bank would net you about €120 year in interest. That's another cost people often forget. I'd be thinking with that value of car to go third party insurance only though, so might be able to get the insurance down to € 300-400. Interesting exercise, especially for any home considering a second car.

Cars like that don't really depreciate much, sub 1000 maybe after a few years. But you'll always get close to a 1000 for a micra unless its an absolute wreck.

Anan1 · 09-08-2013 4:52pm

djimi wrote: »

Those expenses are directly related to motoring though, and as such are a direct cost of running the car. Its a bit much to include money that you never had in the first place. Each to their own, but adding things like that is not giving you a realistic figure imo.

A direct cost of running the car is not being able to employ the money elsewhere if you already have it, or having to pay to borrow it if you don't.

Cee-Jay-Cee · 09-08-2013 6:31pm

challengemaster wrote: »

Oh dear

Explain?

Oil €40
Oil Filter €6 (bought 5 of them for €30)
Air filter €14

Spark plugs are 60k platinums and were done 22k kms ago so don't need replacing for quite a while. That's all that's needed for a small service. The cars gets what it needs when it needs it so explain your comment please.

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 9:03pm

djimi wrote: »

Those expenses are directly related to motoring though, and as such are a direct cost of running the car. Its a bit much to include money that you never had in the first place. Each to their own, but adding things like that is not giving you a realistic figure imo.

Actually they are part of the cost. Of course if you put a grand into a micra it's a small/negligible loss, but if you put 40,000 into an Audi, it's a large loss of capital interest. They both get you from A-B, but at two entirely different costs. And if you didn't have the money in the first place, and you have to borrow that sum, then you're costs are even higher as you must pay interest on the capital to someone else instead of receiving it. Of course you're free to ignore these costs, but they are still there none the less.

Dr.Rieux · 09-08-2013 10:01pm

The 4450 in the bank will net you the 120 a year if you have the 4450 in the bank the whole year. If you put the purchase price 1500 in the first month and approx 250 per month after that you'll get less interest.

To me if you count the interest you would have gotten as a cost of ownership it sounds like the only thing you would do with the money saved is leave it to accumulate interest.

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 10:23pm

Dr.Rieux wrote: »

The 4450 in the bank will net you the 120 a year if you have the 4450 in the bank the whole year. If you put the purchase price 1500 in the first month and approx 250 per month after that you'll get less interest.

To me if you count the interest you would have gotten as a cost of ownership it sounds like the only thing you would do with the money saved is leave it to accumulate interest.

For people on a budget, the € 120 a year is just as important an expense as the NCT fee or the motor tax. And the more expensive the car the more you have to factor in that loss, which will be far more than € 120. If €120 does not matter, why bother counting other expenses like the NCT fee or the lower motor tax ? To me it all adds up. Even more so if you are going to borrow the cash to pay for the car.

Just saying. Yes it's just one expense of many. People can and do ignore that particular cost it if they want to, but as it's there, I'm going to count it in. That's my choice. It helps focus the mind, and is yet another personal reason for me not to tie up too much already scarce personal capital in a car.

My OP is about running a car as cheaply as possible, so I like to compare all costs. I understand that's not for everyone, but so be it.

Some people like Bangernomics, some people don't. Some people get a thrill from of spending money, some people get a thrill from managing just as well without having to have, or spend a lot of it, and the independence and self sufficiency that brings. Some people like "working for the man", some don't. That's life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qa8jpV_uLdw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37oJqWp4rJM

dgt · 09-08-2013 10:31pm

And where would the saved money from skimping on your car go? What would you skimp on? Wan li tyres? Gem oils? Quentin hazel filters and pads? That timing belt change it needs?

How cheap I can run a car is a sickening disease of an attitude to have. Cut corners to have what, that extra 5gb on broadband, the sky tv, booze?

Anyone cutting corners on motoring costs find out their car won't function right and we have to listen to sh*te on why it won't work how rubbish it is etc.... Caused by cheapness

Spend the extra few quid needed to do it right or just don't bother

Dr.Rieux · 09-08-2013 10:37pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

For people on a budget, the € 120 a year is just as important an expense as the NCT fee or the motor tax. And the more expensive the car the more you have to factor in that loss, which will be far more than € 120. If €120 does not matter, why bother counting other expenses like the NCT fee or the lower motor tax ? To me it all adds up. Even more so if you are going to borrow the cash to pay for the car.

Just saying. Yes it's just one expense of many. People can and do ignore that particular cost it if they want to, but as it's there, I'm going to count it in. That's my choice. It helps focus the mind, and is yet another personal reason for me not to tie up too much already scarce personal capital in a car.

My OP is about running a car as cheaply as possible, so I like to compare all costs. I understand that's not for everyone, but so be it.

Some people like Bangernomics, some people don't. Some people get a thrill from of spending money, some people get a thrill from managing just as well without having to have, or spend a lot of it, and the independence and self sufficiency that brings. Some people like "working for the man", some don't That's life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk6xLX-C7_U

Then surely the cost of alternative transport should be subtracted from the cost of ownership for the total difference?

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 10:48pm

Dr.Rieux wrote: »

Then surely the cost of alternative transport should be subtracted from the cost of ownership for the total difference?

If alternative transport is an option, then sure, but for many people it's not.

You should introduce some Bob Marley to your vehicle and chill man, drive at a more chilled out speed and increase you're mpg at the same time. You're working too hard and you're too stressed working for da man and his money. Try bangernomics. A nice cheap motor doesn't have to be a banger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffCmFDzaYyQ

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 10:51pm

dgt wrote: »

And where would the saved money from skimping on your car go? What would you skimp on? Wan li tyres? Gem oils? Quentin hazel filters and pads? That timing belt change it needs?

How cheap I can run a car is a sickening disease of an attitude to have. Cut corners to have what, that extra 5gb on broadband, the sky tv, booze?

Anyone cutting corners on motoring costs find out their car won't function right and we have to listen to sh*te on why it won't work how rubbish it is etc.... Caused by cheapness

Spend the extra few quid needed to do it right or just don't bother

Check the first line of the OP dude, it says legally and safely. Play some Bob, drive slower, pick up some tips, you'll save dough, and you'll feel better instead of getting road cage rage.

Dr.Rieux · 09-08-2013 10:56pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

If alternative transport is an option, then sure, but for many people it's not.

You should introduce some Bob Marley to your vehicle and chill man, drive at a more chilled out speed and increase you're mpg at the same time. You're working too hard and you're too stressed working for da man and his money. Try bangernomics. A nice cheap motor doesn't have to be a banger.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffCmFDzaYyQ

What the...?

There would always be an alternative, it might be a €100 taxi charge every time because you're way out in the middle of nowhere. Or even a bike which needs to be bought, safety gear bought. if counting lost interest than for a bike more food needs to be bought since using more energy cycling.

dgt · 09-08-2013 11:00pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

Check the first line of the OP dude, it says legally and safely. Play some Bob, drive slower, you'll save dough, and you'll feel better instead of getting road cage rage.

Every part I've mentioned is legal and therefore safe in the general motorists eyes. Doesn't make them safe to me.....

That attitude is fine and dandy untill it causes an accident and your left picking up the pieces..... Wondering why you didn't speed up out of that junction, speed up on the motorway to catch the last few mins of someones life. But its ok, I was driving slowly :rolleyes:

The rsa does a good enough job of brainwashing people to drive slower. Making people into dummies, puppets on strings. Oh no, I'll keep my hot head and stand up for what I believe in

So don't brainwash me with that crap, save it for another brainless sheep

Sandals and Shorts · 09-08-2013 11:09pm

dgt wrote: »

Every part I've mentioned is legal and therefore safe in the general motorists eyes. Doesn't make them safe to me.....

That attitude is fine and dandy untill it causes an accident and your left picking up the pieces..... Wondering why you didn't speed up out of that junction, speed up on the motorway to catch the last few mins of someones life. But its ok, I was driving slowly :rolleyes:

The rsa does a good enough job of brainwashing people to drive slower. Making people into dummies, puppets on strings. Oh no, I'll keep my hot head and stand up for what I believe in

So don't brainwash me with that crap, save it for another brainless sheep

Dude, I'd get that road cage rage seen to if I were you. The first line of the OP says legally and safely, buy legal and safe tyres when you need to, buy legal and safe parts when you need to, and drive at a legal and safe speed. Put on some chillaxin sounds, you'll live longer and you'll be happier. Pull over now and then and have a picnic in a senic picnic area and admire the view. :cool:

dgt · 09-08-2013 11:18pm

Sandals and Shorts wrote: »

Dude, I'd get that road cage rage seen to if I were you. The first line of the OP says legally and safely, buy legal and safe tyres when you need to, buy legal and safe parts when you need to, and drive at a legal and safe speed. Put on some chillaxin sounds, you'll live longer and you'll be happier. :cool:

I haven't tried to ram my opinion down someones throat.... So why should you try to change a natural thing in someone else? A smiley, cheery happy front is just that, hiding an underlying dormant/ suppressed emotion: anger, fear, depression.... How do you know the other person you're advising isn't menatlly ill or psycotic? A message like that might just tip them into a crazy rage but it's ok because they're mellow....

What's legal to industry standards isn't good enough to me.... But that's the way I am....

Chillax man, don't get cage rage because I'll never agree with that attitude.... Just makes me even more hot headed, keep it up. Lock in the cage and go bananas with marley like :cool:

How cheaply can you run a tidy car legally and safely ?

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