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Festina lente

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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    I would have had kittens once it was known that there was only 5 in the race!

    I was already out of kittens :)

    Easy off-plan runs Thursday and Friday

    Easy #1 yesterday morning, out before the rain

    Steady #2 run this morning. Found the first interval hard enough this morning, and I realised I was making it harder by worrying about the interval to follow. Same thing I did on Wednesday, building up the difficulties to come instead of concentrating on what I was doing in the moment...


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    recovery week, so day off Monday

    Tuesday - Steady #1 - first time in ages doing this, and it was tough

    Wednesday - easy #2 run into work

    today and tomorrow - days off, as I head over to Spain for some warm weather training boozing


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Enjoy! Jeez you guys take your beer mile training seriously here ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Enjoy! Jeez you guys take your beer mile training seriously here ;)

    no beer mile for me, I am a Serious Athlete

    Month|2010|2011|2012|2013|2014|2015
    January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13|202.59|199
    February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8|217.1|190
    March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93|249.45|169
    April|72|106.33|201.18|51|150.36|212
    May|75.9|107.13|175.21|41.9|123.51
    June|90.2|64.85|150.09|89.72|150?
    July|118.1|126.92|242.21|147.92|200?
    August|124.4|168|240.27|173.96|227.51
    September|154|171.75|203.69|178.55|202.86
    October|108.7|191.2|229|196.88|201.55
    November|58.4|128.9|283.87|208.34|177.62
    December|83|166.58|285|233.23|219.01
    Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604|1837.3|~2300


    better... 10k PB and (teeny tiny:pac:) 5k PB, plus 4 steady runs and an interval session... hmm, doesn't seem much when I put it like that! when I get back from holidays I may try adding a second steady run in the week, will have to balance with racing though...


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,182 ✭✭✭demfad


    RayCun wrote: »
    Month|2010|2011|2012|2013|2014|2015
    January|38.8|105.61|187.46|257.13|202.59|199
    February|35.5|106.68|191.79|212.8|217.1|190
    March|53.2|121.83|214|45.93|249.45|169
    April|72|106.33|201.18|51|150.36|212
    May|75.9|107.13|175.21|41.9|123.51
    June|90.2|64.85|150.09|89.72|150?
    July|118.1|126.92|242.21|147.92|200?
    August|124.4|168|240.27|173.96|227.51
    September|154|171.75|203.69|178.55|202.86
    October|108.7|191.2|229|196.88|201.55
    November|58.4|128.9|283.87|208.34|177.62
    December|83|166.58|285|233.23|219.01
    Total|1012.2|1578.1|2604|1837.3|~2300


    better... 10k PB and (teeny tiny:pac:) 5k PB, plus 4 steady runs and an interval session... hmm, doesn't seem much when I put it like that! when I get back from holidays I may try adding a second steady run in the week, will have to balance with racing though...

    Great stuff. Keep doing what youre doing if its working Ray. The slower you evolve and build the training the more you'll adapt. Progression, consistency and no injuries/ailments seem to be happening for you now.
    Keep adding and progressing but keep the increments small in my opinion.

    I use how tired I am week to week as a good gauge. Generally not noticably tired at all. That means the body is strong enough to sustainably continue the progression, and your immune system is strong enough also.

    What Im trying to say is, youre going well and have the progression well under control, but don't be tempted to push on too much as a result.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    got some decent training in on holiday. Not near enough to balance the overeating and drinking, but something...

    the town the in-laws live in is on the side of a hill, not a 100m flat stretch to be found anywhere. Fenced of waste ground on one side, a sharp drop separating us from another built-up area on another, and roads, maybe some trees on the other. Maybe one year I'll test out that bit with trees, but it doesn't look inviting, so my regular route is to the town centre, such as it is, then along one side and back up to the house. One lap takes 25-30 minutes, close enough for me. Didn't fancy a steady run at all - heat, hard roads/paths, lots of junctions with drivers not expecting runners - so ended up doing a lot of shorter stuff

    Friday 1st - another planned rest day
    Saturday - most of an Easy #2 run. Back to the house with about 5 minutes of the last zone 2 interval to do, I'll have to live with the guilt as best I can :)
    Sunday - the kid had 5 x 200 to do, so we found a nearby cul-de-sac that approached flatness for them. Warmup and intervals with him, then dropped him back to the house and I did a lap of the town @ Easy #2
    Monday - Intervals. First one I did on a 400m up-and-down loop around some mini concrete football pitches, but that was a bit of a pain in the arse so used the hills instead. About 800m uphill, across the top and 100-150 down the other side. The uphill was fairly constant, 31/32m climb in the 800m and 7/8 back down says the garmin. Three of those and I was done
    Tuesday - warmup and 15 minute fartlek with the kid, then a lap on my own
    Wednesday - Intervals again. Started with the hills this time, four uphills and then one on the 400m loop
    Thursday - warmup and 200/300/400/300/200 with the kid, and a lap on my own
    Friday - off
    Saturday - Intervals as Thursday, four uphills and one loop
    this morning - crawled out of bed and up to Tymon for an Easy #2 run


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    back to the grindstone...
    Easy #1 home from work
    Easy #2 back in the next day. Bumped into emerald007 on the way and ran with him for a while. Fecker made me run my zone 1 section too fast :)
    Steady #2 home today

    Fairly knackered now, the missed sleep caught up with me yesterday and I'm stiff around the ankles, I think from the hills and concrete last week. In for a massage Friday.

    No national league team this year :( too many injuries and other people unavailable. I had been considering running the mile at the next meet, but now it will be the 5k...


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    Easy run into work on Thursday, pretty slow
    Rest day Friday... which turned into rest day Saturday and Sunday as well!
    Saturday I got up, out, and down the road then stopped, turned around, and jogged back home
    Sunday I just stayed in bed
    Feeling a lot better for it now, last week I was always an hour or two behind

    Entered into the graded 5k Wednesday evening, a couple of clubmates will be along too so there should be enough for at least one race :) and the Leinster masters at the end of the month, 5k again


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    bit of a weird week.

    after Saturday and Sunday off I expected to be back in the mood but the opposite happened, my motivation completely disappeared :( Running home Monday I came to a complete stop again. Couldn't turn around and walk home, this was me getting home, but turned off the workout and jogged in
    Tuesday I had no desire for a real run, just jogged in to work again. Felt fine physically (bit of stiffness in the ankles, new shoes were too tight on Monday, nothing really) - but why would anyone go out for a run when they could... not go out for a run?

    The answer yesterday was 'because I've already entered this race', and I was giving another guy a lift out, so off we went to Santry. Went up to register and - surprise, surprise - instead of a women's race, a B+C race, and an A race, there was one race. Mostly B+C runners but two women and a few As. Met thewolf at sign-in and went for a warm-up with himself and the clubmate. Got back to see a couple of the miles, then there was a 20 minute gap before the 5k (it was only 8.30, and the A race was supposed to be starting around 9.30) Did some light jogging and desultory drills in the meantime.

    Not much to say about the race - we went around and around in circles :) First couple of laps were on target, but gradually fell off the pace. thewolf and one clubmate opened up a gap, I was left behind with another clubmate (who dropped out with a few laps to go). Clohissey lapped me with 6/7 laps to go and caught me again as he finished. Last k I rallied (3:23) but 4th was shocking (3:41). 17:24 in the end (unofficial) Calves very tight afterwards, to the point that I didn't even go for a cooldown jog, left one was right on the point of cramping even as I walked around.

    The race - not the result I wanted, and I don't think I've run a good track race yet. But it's a learning process and I'm getting better at it

    the general malaise - I'm going to go off-plan for a few days/weeks. Keep running, but without the beeping :) do a few runs that I haven't done in a while, long run around Phoenix park, hill sprints, strides at the end of an easy run, that kind of thing...


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    How's the sabbatical going ray?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    How's the sabbatical going ray?

    Running away, but not very fast...
    What I eventually realised - I can be very slow on the uptake - was that the problem was my Achilles. I wasn't getting sharp pains, but a dull ache that got worse as I ran, that's why I was stopping. A week/ten days off completely, another week of just easy running, and at the moment I'm doing the 60 minute easy runs from the plan, Saturday tempo sessions with the club, and lots and lots of heel drops. The funny thing is, easy running hurts but faster running is not a problem - except it isn't fast. Parkrun last week was a minute slower than last month :rolleyes: So all racing plans are on hold for now...

    ETA - outlook probably the same as you - I'm also thinking of the Lakes 10k and XC season


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    RayCun wrote: »
    Running away, but not very fast...
    What I eventually realised - I can be very slow on the uptake - was that the problem was my Achilles. I wasn't getting sharp pains, but a dull ache that got worse as I ran, that's why I was stopping. A week/ten days off completely, another week of just easy running, and at the moment I'm doing the 60 minute easy runs from the plan, Saturday tempo sessions with the club, and lots and lots of heel drops. The funny thing is, easy running hurts but faster running is not a problem - except it isn't fast. Parkrun last week was a minute slower than last month :rolleyes: So all racing plans are on hold for now...

    ETA - outlook probably the same as you - I'm also thinking of the Lakes 10k and XC season

    Ah yes, sounds like we're on a very similar path! Best of luck with it Ray, it doesn't sound like you've done any long-term damage anyway. Shall we get TbL/aka THL into the pool? :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    only updating because I have to reset the garmin again, and lose my runs from the last couple of weeks. Not that there's much to report...

    Took about 4 weeks completely off from mid-June to mid-July

    Current routine is circuit in the morning, heel drops at lunch, run in the evening - but I'm doing a few more runmutes these days, which means morning runs. And juvenile training is back on, so a few k with them too

    Progress is slow. Feel fine running until I'm 20-30 minutes in and the calf/achilles start playing up again. Gradually pushing out that time, and recovery from each run is pretty fast, but its very limiting

    50k in the last week of July, 40 last week, 30 so far this week


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,621 ✭✭✭ThebitterLemon


    Good to see you tipping along RC, you seem to be adopting a sensible approach to it. I found the loss of pace very frustrating.

    Best of luck with it.

    TbL


  • Registered Users Posts: 15 wall.e


    Hi Ray,

    Did you get in to Trinity for another test in June? If you wouldn't mind sharing, would love to see the two data sets against each other.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    No, I was fecked in June. And July. And August. And pretty fecked in September. No point in doing another test before next February at the earliest...


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    another update, sure why not...

    Last comeback petered out. Distances stopped increasing, pain continued to increase :rolleyes:, I stopped again on the 24th and there was a few weeks of only running with the kids at training

    Started going out to the Performance clinic in Celbridge at the start of September. Two appointments with another physio first - dry needling, changes to the way I'd been doing the eccentric exercises, and ankle mobility exercises, and started running again a couple of weeks ago. Then an appointment with Mark Kenneally last week, more exercises to do, and a couple of weeks of a training plan to the next appointment. His diagnosis was heel striking on my slower runs putting more strain on the achilles, so lots of forefoot running prescribed.

    At the moment I'm still doing (a lot) more 'other stuff' than running - today is
    chin-ups (7)
    foam rolling
    one set of (14 single-leg bridge, 14 press-ups, 14 clams each side, 42 x side plank running action each side, 14 lunges each side, 7 chin-ups, 21 squats, 14 runners' touch alternating sides) *
    3 sets of heeldrops during the day (3 x 15 each side straight leg, 3x15 bent leg, 10kg weight)
    4 x 10 each side inner calf exercises
    30 minutes of cycling
    and 45 minutes running! 1 minute on my toes every 5 minutes
    plus probably 300/600/1000/600/300 with the kids this evening

    so, you know, keeping busy. I have been able to do some longer runs without pain, which is great. On the other hand I had to do 8 x minute on/minute off last week, and that did hurt :eek: No particular race plans yet, will see how things go...

    *started all this during the summer, up to 3 sets if I have time


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,621 ✭✭✭ThebitterLemon


    I know how frustrating auld man injuries are RC, best of luck with your recovery.

    TbL


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    still going, but annoyingly unpredictable
    Progression run the other weekend, 70 minute on Sunday, 2 minutes on/one off last week - all went fine. Some runs feel smooth and easy
    But Saturday morning and yesterday I was stiff and tight immediately. Saturday I just turned around and came home, yesterday I ended up walking for 5 minutes before starting to jog again. But was out running with the kids an hour later and felt fine :confused:


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    still going, still up and down

    good thing/bad thing - did a tempo with some guys from the club on Saturday. Great to run with people again, but it was hard. And I stopped after 5k of the planned 6 :( A bad habit I picked up over a summer of stopping during runs, it is going to take some work to break :(

    Yesterday I had 6 x 800 planned on the way home from work. All the way to the park I was arguing with myself over whether to do it - too sore, too close to the tempo, will do it Wednesday instead. Stopped and walked for a few minutes after coming up the hill (in Bushy) to stretch and argue some more. Started to jog home then thought '**** it' and started the session. Way too hard on the first, probably too easy on the next few and stopped after the 4th. I wanted to continue but my calf was locking up :rolleyes:
    Probably a lot more of this on/off to come...

    Back to physio last week, more stride changes to work in to reduce ground contact time, not give my knee time to collapse in...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 19,492 ✭✭✭✭Krusty_Clown


    I reckon you need to knock this premature finishing on the head (ooh-errrr). If It means reducing the effort levels or reducing the distance/number of reps, or just toughening up, it's got to go. You're reinforcing a defeatist attitude. Better to plan to do 4 with the gang and add an extra couple of kilometers if you are able, than to be forced to cut it short. If it's injuries/niggles causing the early shower, the point still stands - why are you trying to achieve sessions that the body can't handle? Need to get back into a building frame of mind rather than one of compromise and surrender. Just my 2c


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    Yeah, I agree. It's not just sessions either, I could be in the middle of a regular run and have a really strong urge to stop. Six months ago it wouldn't have even occurred to me, but too many runs where pain forced me to stop have made it seem an option. I was just talking to a bunch of novice marathoners the other night about how you can't let yourself stop for anything, because if you stop once you'll stop again and again, and that's what I'm doing myself

    Your point is a good one. Plan sessions I know I can finish and build from there


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    bloody hell, I'll always been impressed with the runner-facing side of DCM, but some of the behind the scenes stuff is ... not so well organised :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    still moving along...
    no sessions last weekend. I couldn't make the group session, and decided to run easy instead of doing a tempo on my own. I'm still not happy with my lower legs, they're uncomfortable at the start of the run, getting to sore at the end, and not great in between :rolleyes: So I want to keep working on my form, see if that's going to help. It's not easy though to keep a forward lean, midfoot landing underneath, feet straight up, knees up AND keep the pace slow. Usually I start to speed up then when I slow down again things go all over the place - braking when I land is the most common thing. Maybe I'm getting there. Maybe.

    Monday was out at the marathon, Roebuck Road and Fosters Avenue. Great running from my clubmates and boardsies (and the odd,"Hi Ray", "Great running! whoever you are...") Spent a fair amount of time trying to get people running again down Fosters Avenue. Some did, some looked like they'd happily throttle me :)

    Session on Tuesday, just 5x600. A definitely completable session (especially at the speed I was going). Some strides yesterday, tempo again tomorrow, and we'll see how I hold up...


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭belcarra


    Good to hear the shout out from you on Monday Ray!
    Hopefully you will be back to full fitness soon.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    tempo run Saturday, managed the full thing but so slow! (in hindsight, didn't feel slow:o)
    no running Sunday - down to Tymon by 7 to set out the course, knackered by the end of the day
    no running Monday either - blood donation in the evening (and too tired in the morning)
    easy run Tuesday
    early morning session on Wednesday, 6x400. completely blown with about 100m to go on the 5th
    run home on Thursday, pretty sore around the ankles from start to finish
    and run in again this morning, not so sore, and higher up the calf

    morning workout is progressing
    9 chin-ups
    foam rolling
    18 single-leg bridge
    18 press-ups
    18 clams each side
    54 x side plank running action each side
    18 lunges
    9 chin-ups
    3 sets of 15 each side inner calf exercises
    27 thrusters
    18 runners' touch alternating sides

    The sad thing is, the 'exercising' is going better than the running :rolleyes:
    The running feels like just pre-training. I don't feel like I could pick a race and set a progressive training plan building up to it, or even run 70-80 minutes every day without it becoming a problem. So I'm still in a holding pattern...


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    parkrun - 18:27

    Track coaching this morning so couldn't join the tempo run. Decided to do the parkrun instead because I didn't think I'd hack a tempo on my own, but I was really not in the mood for a race (even a 'not a race') either. But I didn't manage to talk myself into going for an easy run, or postponing until later,so I turned up - didn't lead a warm-up, or do much of one myself, just a minute or two of jogging.

    Did my usual shoot off from the start, but relaxed at the bottom of the hill and let one, then two, then three people past me. Debated whether to go with them, but first lap was already 3.37, so I hung on where I was. Hanging on right behind was some ringer meno had brought along and sicced on me :) Second and third k went okay too, 3.40 and 3.41, which was mildly surprising, but then the easy bit is over :o Coming around the far end of the park, the front three were holding steady in front of me, and the ringer right behind, and I was hurting. 3.47 for the 4th k. Then we turned back towards the finish, along the uphill drag, and it hurt even more - heart rate hit 196 at one point, and that was not a false reading :eek: The ringer made her move in the last k but I was able to hang on to her, and finally put in a fast enough finish to pass her again at the end, though still a good 15 seconds back from 3rd.

    One of my clubmates was at the finish and got a photo of me crossing the line - not pretty. I'm leaned back so far I'm surprised I didn't fall over! :o


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,915 ✭✭✭✭menoscemo


    Not guilty sir!! It was the guy in 3rd I told to keep an eye on you.
    Pity she didn't bring along her barcode though as that would have been a parkrun pb for Laura.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,704 ✭✭✭✭RayCun


    easy 10k this morning around Tymon, uncomfortable but not sore

    then home for some breakfast, and out again for juvenile training. Solid rain for their session :pac:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,398 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    menoscemo wrote: »
    Not guilty sir!! It was the guy in 3rd I told to keep an eye on you.
    Pity she didn't bring along her barcode though as that would have been a parkrun pb for Laura.

    Ye run a tight ship overt there. In St Anne's there's a "volunteer next week and we might relax the 'no barcode no result rule'". :)


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