Advice - Scrapping old car and reselling the new one

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 3:56pm #1

Hi All,

I have a '98 Avensis in need of serious repair - not worth it (>200k miles). Looking to scrap it through the scrappage scheme to get some value for it, but sell on the new car immediately from the dealer. I would never take posession of the car, just leave it with the dealer until change of ownership is through. I have discussed it with a couple of dealers who are prepared to facilitate the arrangement.

I reckon with some of the deals out there it should be possible to get value for my old car and give good value to the person buying the new car.

I would not buy the car without having a buyer lined up, so they get to specify the car, and I am not left with something I don't want.

I would appreciate any comments or advice on my plan.
I have posted this add for a Micra on Donedeal:
http://cars.donedeal.ie/for-sale/cars/1365479
However I don't care what car the deal is on; it is purely a financial transaction.

I will probably also put something on Carzone and/or Adverts.ie; any other recommendations?
Am I better off putting in a general ad, or advertising specific models? Which ones?

I know I am a bit late in the year with this, but a family member who had been thinking of changing has now decided to hold off for a year or two.

I am looking to get another Avensis, 2.0 D4D 5 door, the best that €8-8.5 can buy!

Thanks.

John

Mr Benevolent · 12-06-2010 4:20pm

You what? Doesn't make sense.

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 4:26pm

Confab wrote: »

You what? Doesn't make sense.

Why not?....split the scrappage allowance with someone who does not have a car to scrap, something in it for both of us.

Thoie · 12-06-2010 4:37pm

Why not just advertise the Avensis for €1000, saying "only good for scrap" of "in need of expensive repairs"?

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 7:15pm

Thoie wrote: »

Why not just advertise the Avensis for €1000, saying "only good for scrap" of "in need of expensive repairs"?

I did not do it that way because under the terms of the scrappage scheme the person availing of the scheme has to have owned/insured the car for 12-18 months prior to scrapping. I would have to be the first registered owner of the new car, and then transfer the ownership to the real intended owner.

However now that you put it like that, maybe I could offer it for scrappage at a price, on the understanding that I would have to be the first registered owner of the new car being purchased, and would transfer ownership immediately.

Thanks.

Abelloid · 12-06-2010 7:43pm

Isn't that fraud? If I was planning something like this I wouldn't go shouting about it.

bazz26 · 12-06-2010 7:57pm

JustinOval wrote: »

Isn't that fraud? If I was planning something like this I wouldn't go shouting about it.

How is it fraud? The OP is fulfilling the terms of the scrappage scheme. If he or she want to sell the new car on straight away then that is his/her right, the Government don't care once the old car scrapped has been owned by the current owner for 12 months or more and the new car registered in his name. He/she can then sell the car on when they like.

12-06-2010 8:07pm

shrewd, very shrewd. . . . . . Not

Abelloid · 12-06-2010 8:11pm

bazz26 wrote: »

How is it fraud? The OP is fulfilling the terms of the scrappage scheme. If he or she want to sell the new car on straight away then that is his/her right, the Government don't care once the old car scrapped has been owned by the current owner for 12 months or more and the new car registered in his name. He/she can then sell the car on when they like.

I really don't know. I would have thought they had built something into the scheme to prevent this happening... I asked, I didn't state it was.

neilthefunkeone · 12-06-2010 8:16pm

Seems like a bit of a pain for 1500 quid.. but if you have the time and it works then happy days!! money in your pocket..

RobAMerc · 12-06-2010 8:28pm

If the buyer couldn't negotiate a huge discount for cash in the first place they'd have to be complete tools, also remember the car they would be buying from you would be second hand meaning the car is worth a coupla k less immediately. I can't see it being worth it for them. sorry

dirtydiesel · 12-06-2010 9:58pm

Its a bit of a crazy idea that just might work for you. As mentioned a pitfall is the fact that the brand new car will have 2 registered owners within a week of been purchased.
Still your offer might suit someone and I see no harm in trying it.
Please loose the green micra in the add you linked with your post, there must be a more appealing car you could use.
Best of luck with it anyway.

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 10:58pm

bazz26 wrote: »

How is it fraud? The OP is fulfilling the terms of the scrappage scheme. If he or she want to sell the new car on straight away then that is his/her right, the Government don't care once the old car scrapped has been owned by the current owner for 12 months or more and the new car registered in his name. He/she can then sell the car on when they like.

Exactly...the only restriction in the scheme is that the old car has been owned by the person buying the new car....buying = first registered owner.

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 11:02pm

neilthefunkeone wrote: »

Seems like a bit of a pain for 1500 quid.. but if you have the time and it works then happy days!! money in your pocket..

I am looking to spend €8k - €9k on my next car....€1k is a reasonable chunk of it.

alias no.9 · 12-06-2010 11:12pm

€1.5k is not a big discount for a 'pre-registered' car. The registration cert will list it as having a previous owner, even if your buyer drives it off the forecourt with 0 miles, you will have metaphorically driven it off the forecourt already with the associated depreciation.

12-06-2010 11:13pm

johnb25 wrote: »

I am looking to spend €8k - €9k on my next car....€1k is a reasonable chunk of it.

You won't make anywhere near a grand this way unless you find a total and utter fcuktard (yes, I try to use that word once a day on boards

). Scrap a sh1tbox against a car and the garage don't get a grand from the government, €350 ish iirc. The rest of the discount is available for straight sale customers too.

All that add will bring you at best is loads of annoying phonecalls, you'd have been just as well off putting your €3 on a Spain / Brazil final in the World Cup, chance you'll get €30 back as well as the €3

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 11:27pm

RobAMerc wrote: »

If the buyer couldn't negotiate a huge discount for cash in the first place they'd have to be complete tools, also remember the car they would be buying from you would be second hand meaning the car is worth a coupla k less immediately. I can't see it being worth it for them. sorry

I know some of the manufacturers scrappage offers can probably be negotiated but the govt are putting in an additional €1,500 that can't be negotiated...

dirtydiesel wrote: »

Its a bit of a crazy idea that just might work for you. As mentioned a pitfall is the fact that the brand new car will have 2 registered owners within a week of been purchased.
Still your offer might suit someone and I see no harm in trying it.
Please loose the green micra in the add you linked with your post, there must be a more appealing car you could use.
Best of luck with it anyway.

Regarding the two owners, the second owner would be the first driver, so they still get a brand new car.
The value of the car in three or more years when they go to trade it in will be the same as one bought direct and driven by the first owner, except that someone getting a scrappage discount at the front end will have lost less in depreciation.

I picked the Micra as it has a good scrappage offer, therefore more in the deal for all...but fair comment...I wouldn't want to drive one.

Thanks for the comments.

12-06-2010 11:38pm

johnb25 wrote: »

I know some of the manufacturers scrappage offers can probably be negotiated but the govt are putting in an additional €1,500 that can't be negotiated...

Me thinks that is not the case tbh.

johnb25 · 12-06-2010 11:45pm

RoverJames wrote: »

You won't make anywhere near a grand this way unless you find a total and utter fcuktard (yes, I try to use that word once a day on boards ). Scrap a sh1tbox against a car and the garage don't get a grand from the government, €350 ish iirc. The rest of the discount is available for straight sale customers too.

Are you saying that the Govt is not putting up €1,500 for scrappage of old cars against the purchase of a new qualifying car, or that the dealers are not passing it on?
Also, are you saying that all of the manufacturers scrappage offers are 100% available as cash discounts anyway? I'm sure that a proportion of it will be, but not it all.

12-06-2010 11:55pm

johnb25 wrote: »

Are you saying that the Govt is not putting up €1,500 for scrappage of old cars against the purchase of a new qualifying car, or that the dealers are not passing it on?

I'm saying the former.

johnb25 · 13-06-2010 12:01am

RoverJames wrote: »

Me thinks that is not the case tbh.

How...offering discounts to cash customers that are not offered to scrappage customers?

johnb25 · 13-06-2010 12:10am

RoverJames wrote: »

I'm saying the former.

I inquired with a number of dealers about scrappage offers and none of them protested that the Govt were not honouring the scheme. Surely they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

RobAMerc · 13-06-2010 12:13am

johnb25 wrote: »

Regarding the two owners, the second owner would be the first driver, so they still get a sbrand new ecar.
y

yes, they get a brand new car with but are the second registered owner. That whether you like it or not makes it worth less than if they were the first owner. Couple this with the fact that the discount achieved could possibly be matched by cash discount, factor in the hassle plus general mistrust of folk that it could be some sort of scam - I doubt you plan will work. Sorry, I'm not against it I just dont think it would be worth while for a cash buyer.

Abelloid · 13-06-2010 12:20am

How much discount will the buyer actually get for bypassing a direct cash deal and putting your name on the log before theirs?

johnb25 · 13-06-2010 12:45am

JustinOval wrote: »

How much discount will the buyer actually get for bypassing a direct cash deal and putting your name on the log before theirs?

On the Micra above on Done Deal, the dealer is quoting €15k for cash. I'm asking €13.5, so at least €1,500, maybe more if we can agree on an amount.

The values will vary with the different deals on offer. Generally the scrappage offers are a greater proportion of the price (better value) on the smaller cars.

As I mentioned above, I believe the second owner thing will make little difference when trading in in a few years time. It is only then it really becomes relevant; just a paper value while they own it.

jaffa20 · 13-06-2010 1:31am

johnb25 wrote: »

On the Micra above on Done Deal, the dealer is quoting €15k for cash. I'm asking €13.5, so at least €1,500, maybe more if we can agree on an amount.

The values will vary with the different deals on offer. Generally the scrappage offers are a greater proportion of the price (better value) on the smaller cars.

As I mentioned above, I believe the second owner thing will make little difference when trading in in a few years time. It is only then it really becomes relevant; just a paper value while they own it.

So, how are you making a profit out of this? You are only passing a discount onto a buyer who buys a car for 13.5k rather than 15k...

Abelloid · 13-06-2010 10:56am

jaffa20 wrote: »

So, how are you making a profit out of this? You are only passing a discount onto a buyer who buys a car for 13.5k rather than 15k...

That's what I'm trying to figure out...

johnb25 · 13-06-2010 12:48pm

JustinOval wrote: »

That's what I'm trying to figure out...

The scrappage cost from the dealer is less than €13k when the Nissan scrappage is included. From what dealers are quoting me there is enough in double-scrappage deals to make it worth while for both parties.
When I press them that the manufacturers scrappage must be available as a discount for cash customers they insist not.

13-06-2010 1:13pm

you should go on the dragons den !

johnb25 · 13-06-2010 2:10pm

RoverJames wrote: »

you should go on the dragons den !

I doubt if any of them are looking for a small little runabout:)

Advice - Scrapping old car and reselling the new one

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